hype Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 Hi everyone,I'm new to this forum, first post! So here's my current situation : I'm 18 years old, I have been training what we call ''streetworkout'' for a whole year now. I've never used any weights, except for weighted calisthenics occasionnaly. I can do about 25 pull pull ups, 40 dips, and 70 pushups perfect form. I'm in good shape, I can do L-sits, muscle ups, elbow levers, and few other stuff. Now, I've recently found about this book, ''Building the Gymnastic Body'', and making my research, I've finally decided to buy it.. So far, I have to say it's great, the progressions are amazing ! However, this book gives excellent progressions, but does not tell you HOW to use the progressions.. That's what I want to know! How do I work? should i seperate it one day pressing, one day pulling, etc. ? Should I seperate it one day holds, one day bodyweight? Or should I split exercies and form a chest day, shoulder day, etc. ? Or should I work everything in one day? Or should I pick up a few exercices of my level and work in cycles (like circuit training) ? How many reps, sets should I do? Should I do cycles, or one exercice at a time with sets?( Main goal: gaining pure brutal gymnastic strength) How do I know when it's time to upgrade in the progressions? You know, all those questions we probably all asked ourselves when getting this amazing book ! Please, help me .. I have no idea how how do I progress in this discipline, and set this up... THanks in advance ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForzaCavaliere Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 You already have a nice level in calisthenics, don't you already know how to make a routine? lol. You weren't born able to do muscle-ups and L-sits and whatnot, I'm assuming you used suitable progressions and routine to build up to it. It's the same with the things in the book. It's not magic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hype Posted March 6, 2014 Author Share Posted March 6, 2014 You already have a nice level in calisthenics, don't you already know how to make a routine? lol. You weren't born able to do muscle-ups and L-sits and whatnot, I'm assuming you used suitable progressions and routine to build up to it. It's the same with the things in the book. It's not magic!not really actually.. All I did to get there, is something called the ''around the world routine''.. In the street workout world, it means doing pullups-dips-pushups in a non-stop cycle (no rest), as much cycles as you can... Everything else came as these basics became easy for me... With that said, I don't have much knowledge about how to select exercises and building a strength based routine, especially not in gymnastics... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForzaCavaliere Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 Oh ok, sorry for making the assumptions! I'm sure there have been some previous, high quality threads regarding help for beginners, but I can't find any atm so if anyone wants to link to them that is the best option. I'll cover some basics here though, I'm not sure if everyone on the forums would agree with my strategies though but whatevs: - Regarding the splitting of routines into days of pushing/pulling/straightarm/bentarm/legs/etc, I personally would recommend full body routines until the advanced level is reached; from what you said you can do, it seems like you are at the intermediate level strength but how you do your routines is up to you really. - There are a lot of exercises in the book so it's important to not lose focus. Choose a few goals (a couple pushing, a couple pulling, and core-exercise goals) and work towards them hard. Once you have achieved those goals, choose some new exercises, until eventually you've mastered the exercises in the book. - Circuit training or not, depends on your goals. If you want to focus exclusively on strength then it makes sense to get adequate rest between sets so you can go at each set with high quality repetitions. If you want to increase endurance you can decrease rest time or start circuit training, though this would make the strength gains slower (not lesser, just slower). - Regarding programming, I believe there's a whole section at the end of the book dedicated to programming anyway? Check it out, it has a few templates and sets/reps schemes. - How to know when to progress: the book talks about SSC in the programming section. Stick with a progression for a few training cycles (a cycle is basically training hard for a while and then every so often taking it easy for a week or 2), and when you've reached the adequate amount of high quality repetions and sets (5x5 or 3x8 or whatever, depends on the exercise really) then move onto the next progression. Lastly, I would just like to add that apparently all of your questions would be answered if you purchased Coach Sommer's new books 'The Foundation Series'. I do not yet own a copy, but if you perused the Internet a bit you would find that it is highly regarded and contains detailed programming and progressions and exercises and mobility and whatnot, it answers everything for beginners/experts that BtGB does not. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 If your goal is build gymnastic strength, start with the foundation and handstand series. General "Street workout" routines mimic standard weight lifting routines that favor chest muscles development more than the back muscles. Since most of the pressing strength in the human body is found in the back. Gymnastic routines tend to favor the development of the back muscles over the chest muscles. There is a section on program development in BtGB book. Read the section several times.If you really must start with a basic routine, here is the Killroy Template. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murray Truelove Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 A good place to start would be Killroy's template. He was a beginner that got some great results. Also there should be a sticky called "prerequisite". These are fundamental to GST. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikkel Ravn Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 ...Now, I've recently found about this book, ''Building the Gymnastic Body'', and making my research, I've finally decided to buy it.. So far, I have to say it's great, the progressions are amazing ! Just out of curiosity, where is "Building the Gymnastic Body" for sale? I doesn't seem to be on the products page. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForzaCavaliere Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 Just out of curiosity, where is "Building the Gymnastic Body" for sale? I doesn't seem to be on the products page.I don't think Coach Sommer sells it anymore since the release of the Foundation series because it's no longer listed on the products page as you said. You would have to go to Amazon or a second-hand bookstore or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hype Posted March 6, 2014 Author Share Posted March 6, 2014 Hi everyone!first of all, thanks you all for answering! I havn't reached the programming section yet ( i didnt know there was one lol), but I'll definitely check it out. Regarding progression, from what I understand, I should upgrade whenever I reach my goals in term of reps and sets.. (Ex: 5 sets of 5 reps completed with perfect form = upgrade) .. however, how does it apply to static holds? Should I upgrade when I reach something like 60s of holding? As for foundation 1, yeah I've read about it already, but I personnally don't like having to follow a strict, pre-made program, same thing for diet... I like discovering, trying new things, making my own stuff, doing some freestyle from times to times, etc...With that said, I bought building the gymnastic body as I thought it would better suit my style (and im looking forward to the second edition). Just out of curiosity, where does Foundation one would bring me in terms of progress? Would I still be considered a beginner after mastering it? what skills does it reaches? Thank you . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForzaCavaliere Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Yeah same for static holds, when you reach a certain amount of time with a good form hold, move onto the next progression. NB: You wouldn't train for, say, a straddle planche only by holding advanced tuck planches. You would also include some supplementary exercises. Just a little note in case you were thinking of progressing that way. As for your comments regarding pre-made programmes, I also feel the same way! I like to do a lot of research and stuff on topics and formulate my own routines so if I made progress it's evidence I really understand the way the body works. As for BtGB v.2, it's been replaced by the Foundation Series (I believe), the same with all of the other texts that were referenced with BtGB. All have been assimilated into some sort of mega-production. As for how far you would get after F1, I think you could be considered a master of the basics once you have completed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connor Davies Posted March 7, 2014 Share Posted March 7, 2014 Just out of curiosity, where does Foundation one would bring me in terms of progress? Would I still be considered a beginner after mastering it? what skills does it reaches?I think the official term is 'advanced intermediate' and you would have a straddle planche, front lever, human flag, manna, single leg squat, rope climb and hollowback press. There's tons more skills that it covers as well, you're not just limited to those. If you're at all concerned with bodyweight strength, I would say the first thing you need to do is get a solid handstand. It's the basis for quite a lot of future skills, and you're holding yourself back if you can't do one. You already have some decent strength to you, so I would seriously prioritize it over everything, if your worried about time constraints or recovery. As for not following strict workout schedules and 'freestyling' well... I can tell you come from the world of street workout. But seriously, think of it as a list of progressions, with set/rep goals before you can move on. Even if you limit it to just that, it's still miles better than BtGB ever was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Li Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 I think the official term is 'advanced intermediate' and you would have a straddle planche, front lever, human flag, manna, single leg squat, rope climb and hollowback press. There's tons more skills that it covers as well, you're not just limited to those. That's after F4 not F1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Douglas Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 Also, advanced beginner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connor Davies Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 Also, advanced beginner Awww, really? What's intermediate then, finishing R4!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Douglas Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 Awww, really? What's intermediate then, finishing R4!?I'll hazard a guess at around R2+H2+M2 level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaros?aw Ruszkowski Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 I'll hazard a guess at around R2+H2+M2 level.Awwww shieeeeeet Need to focus more on F1+H1, as a zombie beginner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hype Posted March 8, 2014 Author Share Posted March 8, 2014 Hi guys,thanks for the replies! So after reading your feedbacks, I'm thinking about getting foundation one instead of BtGB. However there's a few things that would need clarifications: I read a bit about the foundation series, and I'm not sure if I'm right, but it doesn't seem to cover handstands?? Everyone says handstands are the most important, but foundation doesn't cover it..How come? I saw the handstand series; Do I need to buy them in order to progress in handstands, or does foundation one cover that? Moreover, I've noticed that foundation requires A LOT of time to complete. Even TOO MUCH time, in my opinion. I'Ve seen a lot of people in this game master planches, human flags, etc. from zero to perfect form in a year or two maximum. However, if we look at the foundation series, completing all of them would require like 5 years..? How come?? Also, regarding BtGB, I'm a little confused; will there be a second edition, or are the foundation series the new BtGB, with no second edition? I ask a lot of questions lol, sorry about that.. I just want to make sure I know where I'm going with this! thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaros?aw Ruszkowski Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 New BtGB was spread between other programs like F1, R1, M1 or some H1 elements. And yeah, some people master hard elements... but are they joints/tendons ready for what they're doing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Connor Davies Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 Moreover, I've noticed that foundation requires A LOT of time to complete. Even TOO MUCH time, in my opinion. I'Ve seen a lot of people in this game master planches, human flags, etc. from zero to perfect form in a year or two maximum. However, if we look at the foundation series, completing all of them would require like 5 years..? How come??Coach has said F1-4 should only take a couple years, but I think he might be too used to training with proper athletes.... How long it takes you depends on you, but I can say if you follow the progressions you'll be a lot less likely to injure yourself by the time you get to the end. You'll also have planche / human flag ect long before they come up in the program. You're supposed to be purposefully working under your maximum limit, it's a much more efficient way to build strength. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hype Posted March 8, 2014 Author Share Posted March 8, 2014 Hmm alright I see, you're right about injuries!What about the handstands? Are they lart of F1 or only in H1? And what are M1 and R1? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hype Posted March 9, 2014 Author Share Posted March 9, 2014 I read a bit more about this, and I learned that R1 is a ring progression. However, I still don't know what M1 is, and if foundation series has progressions for handstand... If not, should I be working F1, H1, R1, etc. simultaneously? Or should I do one at a time? (ex; complete alll foundations, than all handstands, etc.). Or should I do all level 1, then all levels 2 , etc. (ex: f1, then H1, then r1, than f2, h2, etc.) Or can I work mabey f1 and h1 simultaneously since i think rings are more advanced aren't they? lol once again, a lot of questions xdd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Slocum Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Handstands are covered in Handstand 1.Also note that Foundation does not use rigid programming: most people will not need to start from week 1 on every element, and you'll often be strong and mobile enought to immediately progress. If you are diligent and a hard worker, you should be able to finish in significantly less than 5 years. Also note that the end goal of Foundation is not to simply achieve each final element, but to *MASTER* them. That means five sets of 5 reps/10s holds with perfect form and no rest in between except for a short mobility exercise. Also also note that for many of the exercises you will probably achieve the final movement well before you are performing it in your work sets. M1 is the first installment in the movement series, which builds explosive power with dynamic exercises. R1 is the first installment in the rings series, which follows up on foundation to develop maximal strength via rings.Edit: it is recommended to work F1 and H1 at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hype Posted March 9, 2014 Author Share Posted March 9, 2014 Handstands are covered in Handstand 1.Also note that Foundation does not use rigid programming: most people will not need to start from week 1 on every element, and you'll often be strong and mobile enought to immediately progress. If you are diligent and a hard worker, you should be able to finish in significantly less than 5 years. Also note that the end goal of Foundation is not to simply achieve each final element, but to *MASTER* them. That means five sets of 5 reps/10s holds with perfect form and no rest in between except for a short mobility exercise. Also also note that for many of the exercises you will probably achieve the final movement well before you are performing it in your work sets. M1 is the first installment in the movement series, which builds explosive power with dynamic exercises. R1 is the first installment in the rings series, which follows up on foundation to develop maximal strength via rings.Edit: it is recommended to work F1 and H1 at the same time.Wow, thanks you answered it all man! So basically, I start with the foundation and hanstands together, then, when mastered, I upgrade to rings and dynamics movements? Seems like a pretty complete program, very nice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenEagle Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Wow, thanks you answered it all man!So basically, I start with the foundation and hanstands together, then, when mastered, I upgrade to rings and dynamics movements? Seems like a pretty complete program, very nice!The GymnasticBodies Roadmap and Curriculum according to Coach Sommer's standards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hype Posted March 9, 2014 Author Share Posted March 9, 2014 Found my new fitness goal ! Thanks guys, and thanks to the coach! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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