Rampage Posted December 17, 2009 Author Share Posted December 17, 2009 Oh yeah and, that was the exact page listing the exercises I had seen, thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted December 22, 2009 Author Share Posted December 22, 2009 If you have parallel bars, you can work skin the cats in some fashion. Consider them your hanging lever work.What are skin the cats? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 That's when you start in a dead hang and rotate from there through the front lever, through inverted hang, through back lever all the way to inverted hang. Sort of like a tick tock, but without the requirement of hold ing a certain position. It's purely to stretch everything attached to the shoulders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted December 23, 2009 Author Share Posted December 23, 2009 3) Like slizzardman said don't cheat. If you're not using full ROM (range of motion), you are not recruiting all muscle fibres. Quality over quantity!So is going all the way down, locking out, when doing pullups and chinups, better? I think I read somewhere something that said that if you went all the way down and locked out, that you gave your body a little "rest" time or something like that, that you took away the intensity, because then the arms could sort of "ease up" and relax, but if you didn't go all the way down, you would always have the arms tight and contracted.What do you think about that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 I think you're listening to a bodybuilder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted December 23, 2009 Author Share Posted December 23, 2009 I think you're listening to a bodybuilder Yeah, I'm pretty sure it was a bodybuilder that said it 8) ; I just wanted to confirm it was a lie.It is right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregor Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 I think you're listening to a bodybuilder Yeah, I'm pretty sure it was a bodybuilder that said it 8) ; I just wanted to confirm it was a lie.It is right?It's not always black and white. Diffrent goals defines diffrent things.Like BB style of bench press is diffrent to PL style of benc press even in PL it differs from one association to another.So let me remind you planche training is not BB style training. Look at video posted it's very instructively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Razz Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Yeah it is not a lie what you have heard, however bodybuilders just want to beat up their muscles so they usually do not go to lockout. Gymnasts will want to perform FULL range of motion in order to get stronger in the full range of motion and prepare joints for the stress coming from lockout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 I think you're listening to a bodybuilder Yeah, I'm pretty sure it was a bodybuilder that said it 8) ; I just wanted to confirm it was a lie.It is right?It's not a lie exactly, it's more like a flawed concept combined with a different goal. Bodybuilders want their muscles to grow as quickly as possible, and whether they get stronger or not doesn't matter to them. By maintaining true constant tension without even a moment's rest you ensure that you get into the muscle's glycogen stores and drain them, but not go into aerobic respiration. That way you trigger maximum sarcoplasmic hypertrophy. With even a moment's rest, the body starts removing waste products and regenerating ATP and creatine phosphate stores in the muscle. This is actually beneficial to the strength athlete, as it allows more intense work to be done.By stopping short of the dead hang, you do not train the muscles that move to the scapula and hold the shoulder in the socket. This means that you're not going to be strong at full extension. If you want to be able to perform in the real world you need strength throughout the full ROM, from beginning to end. Interestingly, this also promotes more even muscle development across the posterior shoulder girdle. The bodybuilders only care about their lats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted December 24, 2009 Author Share Posted December 24, 2009 Alright, I see.It's like dips too: bodybuilders and other non-gymnast people say that it is bad to go all the way down on them, that you should only make a 90° angle, not going all the way down; and they also say that doing bench dips are bad for the shoulders, going all the way down with them even worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted December 24, 2009 Share Posted December 24, 2009 Pretty much! It's only bad if your body isn't prepared for it. Just like anything else, you work your way into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted December 26, 2009 Author Share Posted December 26, 2009 Pretty much! It's only bad if your body isn't prepared for it. Just like anything else, you work your way into it.Yeah, I thought so...Hey, I know I have asked this to you before, but you didn't answer, I think, and just so you know, I already don't do the routine that I did when I first posted here (2 sets of as much reps I could do with perfect form, of 4 exercises), so now I have been working more on my handstands and HSPU's and L-sits and the pushups you described in the video and all that, so I just wanted to ask you again if this was a good workout, and if it is endurance or not:4 sets of 6 pullups and dips; the sets are the 6 pullups and the 6 dips done without any rest in between them, the only rest is 30s in between sets.I have been alternating pullups with chinups, and I think I will also alternate the dips with the pushups you showed in the video.I obviously do the first 2 sets easily, being that they are only 6 reps, but in the 3rd set it gets a little difficult, and in the 4th I barely complete the last reps.So this is what I have been doing on the parallel bars the last 3 days or so. I think I will eventually be able to do them in an L-sit to progress and make it harder, but it will be a long time for that, since I think I wouldn't be able to do even 2 sets of those right now.So is this training good?Oh and, I do them without any added weight, since using my sister's backpack with a 10kg plate was very bad because I couldn't even move well lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarun Suri Posted December 26, 2009 Share Posted December 26, 2009 I find that 30 second rest is too short assuming you are going past 80% of max effort. This isn't a circuit training, at least not if your goal is still to train strength. That kind of set up might be ideal to bring in maybe once a week, just to do some metcon (cardio-ish), but I would rest 60-90 seconds. You should barely be able to finish all the reps. If it's too easy, then you're already strong enough for a harder progression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted December 26, 2009 Author Share Posted December 26, 2009 I find that 30 second rest is too short assuming you are going past 80% of max effort. This isn't a circuit training, at least not if your goal is still to train strength. That kind of set up might be ideal to bring in maybe once a week, just to do some metcon (cardio-ish), but I would rest 60-90 seconds. You should barely be able to finish all the reps. If it's too easy, then you're already strong enough for a harder progression. Too short? I think a previous post of slizzardman said that you should rest 20-40 seconds, around there, and I think they were similar exercises...Yes, maybe for 80%+ effort it would be too short, 30s, but right now I think I'm only doing 50% effort, since I'm only doing half of my max reps.But then again, 12 was my max rep just as I got started again, and it has been almost 2 weeks now...Probably my goal with this kind of training, right now, is to get a little bit better at pullups and chinups, to get stronger at them, to then be stronger for levers and that kind of stuff.Yes, only in the 3rd set do I feel the pressure a bit, and then in the 4th, I barely finish the last rep heh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarun Suri Posted December 26, 2009 Share Posted December 26, 2009 If that's the case then it's fine. Just remember that the harder the variation, the more rest you will need. This will be instrumental later on when you are placing demanding loads on your body. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted December 26, 2009 Share Posted December 26, 2009 I find that 30 second rest is too short assuming you are going past 80% of max effort. This isn't a circuit training, at least not if your goal is still to train strength. That kind of set up might be ideal to bring in maybe once a week, just to do some metcon (cardio-ish), but I would rest 60-90 seconds. You should barely be able to finish all the reps. If it's too easy, then you're already strong enough for a harder progression. Like Rampage said, he's not working that intensely. Because he's sticking with his current progression and only working around 60-70% intensity (compared to what his 1 rep pullup max should be), he's really only going to get training progress by compressing his rest schedule. Rampage: I DO agree that you should take at least one workout a week and start working on the L-sit pull ups, because you should definitely be able to do them. I know you're waiting for your weighted vest and whatnot, but even when you get that it's a good idea to work the pull up and chin up progressions to make sure you are preparing your body for the levers and all of that. They do help I'll be working out either today or tomorrow and I will shoot a pull up video to cover how to properly move through the progressions. When I do I'll make sure you get linked to it! In the meantime, how are you liking the new additions to your workout? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blairbob Posted December 26, 2009 Share Posted December 26, 2009 We only use the weighted pulls/dips as a benchmark unless of course, you are past all the ways of making them harder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted December 26, 2009 Author Share Posted December 26, 2009 I find that 30 second rest is too short assuming you are going past 80% of max effort. This isn't a circuit training, at least not if your goal is still to train strength. That kind of set up might be ideal to bring in maybe once a week, just to do some metcon (cardio-ish), but I would rest 60-90 seconds. You should barely be able to finish all the reps. If it's too easy, then you're already strong enough for a harder progression. Like Rampage said, he's not working that intensely. Because he's sticking with his current progression and only working around 60-70% intensity (compared to what his 1 rep pullup max should be), he's really only going to get training progress by compressing his rest schedule. Rampage: I DO agree that you should take at least one workout a week and start working on the L-sit pull ups, because you should definitely be able to do them. I know you're waiting for your weighted vest and whatnot, but even when you get that it's a good idea to work the pull up and chin up progressions to make sure you are preparing your body for the levers and all of that. They do help I'll be working out either today or tomorrow and I will shoot a pull up video to cover how to properly move through the progressions. When I do I'll make sure you get linked to it! In the meantime, how are you liking the new additions to your workout?Alright, I'll start doing them, it's just that I can't even do them locking out all the way down, I can do a few but I can't lock out all the way down.Yes, the new additions have been great, thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted December 26, 2009 Share Posted December 26, 2009 That's ok, the lock-out will come with time, don't try to rush it I'm glad you are having fun with the new exercises! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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