Douglas Bell Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 Hi AllEvery year at Karate just before we break off for the holidays the class gets given a challenge to complete some sort of physical test, it could be Strength, Endurence, balance ect.Last year it was the first person to be able to do 1000 pushups without stopping, I was just beaten last year and managed to get 971 in a row. This year its a strength related feat that was given by one of our female students who is also a Gymnast, she basically done an L-Sit from the floor and transitioned into a full handstand, for this we are not looking for perfect technique, basically just to get from the floor and press to a handstand, she also said we could do this between 2 chairs if flexibility is an issue and we can either to a full L-Sit to Handstand or more of a tucked version to Handstand. She gave us a couple of demonstrations then said we are on our own and figure it out. She did mention that a beginner should be able to achieve a rather poor form untidy version of this in a few months.So my first point of call was Google looking up Gymnastic tutorials and it pointed me in this direction, after reading a few posts on here I realise this is a very close knitt community who strive for excellence through Gymnastic training, so I hope you dont mind me posting a very specific question regarding some help on how to achieve the above or at least give it a go.CheersNeverGiveUP (Our number one club rule) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rik de Kort Posted June 28, 2012 Share Posted June 28, 2012 What you're referring to is an L-sit press to handstand. Just searching for 'press handstand' on the forums will bring up several drill in the forums. I'd say the most important part is to get your handstand down, otherwise you can't press to anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted June 28, 2012 Author Share Posted June 28, 2012 Hi RikThanks for the reply, decided I better try a handstand to see if I could even do one, I actually surprised myself I could do a freestanding handstand for a few seconds before my balance gave way and I was able to hold a handstand for over a minute against a wall, My biggest problem with a free balance handstand is shoulder flexibility cant get my body in a complete straight line. Also played around with an L-Sit I can hold one with slightly bent knees for around 20 seconds, but the transition from L-Sit to handstand is way way beyond me at this point, but I have hope.CheersNeverGiveUP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted June 29, 2012 Author Share Posted June 29, 2012 Hi AllOk, after reading through lots of the posts and since I dont really do much strength training anyways apart from what we do in Karate I am going to do some specific strength training in order to help with this challenge.After watching the L-Sit to press to hanstand on youtube a few times I think I have broken it down into the following components I need to work on.Static HoldsL-Sit -- I can hold a slightly modified L-Sit (Knees slightly bent due to hamstring tightness) for 20 seconds and after reading the forums, rule of thumb is 1 minute work so.4 x 15 secondsPlanche -- Ouch Cant even lift my knees of the ground with my arms straight like that, dont have the arm strength, for this one feet elevated using a band so more pressure on arms as I lean forward so I can get used to being in that position.4 x 15 secondsHandstand -- Can only do 1 - 2 seconds freestanding so will work more for time against the wall.4 x 30 secondsStrength WorkHanstand PressI will do handstand pushups against the wall, at the moment I dont even have the strength to do a headstand pushup so I will have to use books and reduce the height as I get stronger. Once I get the strength for a headstand pushup I will then use 2 boxes for extra height so I can lower further using the same principle with reducing books until I have the strength needed for a full handstand pushup.5 x 5As the strength work is rather limited I will add in Pushups, Pullups and Dips and Back Squats.Does the above seem reasonable and a good approach for my challenge?CheersNeverGiveUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagabond Posted June 29, 2012 Share Posted June 29, 2012 Yeah, it seems pretty good. I would throw in a few things:1. For the planche work, you can probably start using the yoga crow position. It's like a tuck planche but with the inside of your thighs touching the outside of your arms. The easiest version is with bent arms, then with straight arms, and then you could do it with your knees on your forearms, trying to use your shoulders strength to lift your hips. You could also use planche leans.2. The planche work is indeed beneficial, but you'll need something more specific to help you develop the press later on. I think that to succeed your challenge in an efficient way, you should probably use a tuck bent arms press to handstand, it's easier than a clean competitive gymnastics one.3. Work your hamstrings flexibility. Do not neglect your flexibility.In general, your approach is pretty good. I like that you're taking your time and starting with the basics. Better to do that and succeed than lose your time on things you wouldn't be able to do. So good thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted June 29, 2012 Author Share Posted June 29, 2012 Hi VagabondYeah being from a traditional karate background its all about you basics and foundation skills, no point trying to get complex when your basics and foundations are letting you down, never succeed this way.Tried your Yoga crow and I can hold that position for around 15 seconds, so I will work on these thanks for that and slowly change the position until I can do a tuck planche. Although I must figure out where my centre of balance is as I face planted the floor after 15 seconds, lol.Yeah my biggest failure is my flexibility I just neglect it allot, I really must concentrate on this, again flexibility is a basic thing and something that does let me down in my Karate too.Thanks for the reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted June 30, 2012 Author Share Posted June 30, 2012 Hi AllOk, tried my first workout based on my post and I did.4 x 15s L-Sit4 x 15s Yoga Crow4 x 15s Front Lever (I read about it on the forums and seen a youtube vid think what I did was a tuck front lever, damn that was hard on the biceps and shoulders I felt the strain all the way through my arm on that one)4 x 30s HandstandAfter doing the above my upper body felt so dead I couldnt do any strength work, is this normal, I could barley do a pullup, although I did do some sets of planche pushups with feet elevated my bands but my core still working so my feet didnt hit the floor.CheersNeverGiveUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagabond Posted June 30, 2012 Share Posted June 30, 2012 It is kinda normal, but if you're still dead after 1-2 weeks, think about decreasing the volume a notch to increase it again progressively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted July 1, 2012 Author Share Posted July 1, 2012 Hi allQuick question as I am working out in my home gym / garage the room is rather limited so rather than kick up into a handstand I am walking up the wall belly to wall to do handstand pushup negatives but doing 5 x 5 is rather taxing as for a beginner doing 25 walk walks is actually more demanding than doing the negative pushup its self. Is there other options to help with my handstand pushups are will I just have to grin and bear the wall walks?CheersNeverGiveUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Miskelly Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 You could just limit your range of motion and do partial Headstand pushups. Stack a couple of books or something under where your head will be in the push and do the pushups with whatever range of motion you are currently strong enough in. As your strength improves remove a book, rinse and repeat until you are on the ground doing full headstand pushups. Then to get to full handstand pushups start going the other way by raising your hands on the books to further your ROM rather than limit it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted July 1, 2012 Author Share Posted July 1, 2012 Hi micYeah I did try that method but I lost my balance on one of the presses and about broke my neck trying to roll out of it as I hit the box I was using for the height for limited range presses.CheersNeverGiveUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OyvindBirkeland Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 Ouch! I would not dare to have something under my head in a HS at my level, which I guess is about same level as you.I do wall walk up to HS as you do, and negative HeSPU (3x3 paired with adv. frog stand). Works fine for me, but I try to start as close to the wall as possible, so it's a really short wall walk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Miskelly Posted July 1, 2012 Share Posted July 1, 2012 Yeah I did try that method but I lost my balance on one of the presses and about broke my neck trying to roll out of it as I hit the box I was using for the height for limited range presses.Can you kick up back to wall so that you fall back to your feet and don't have to roll out if you over balance? You will have to be more diligent to stay hollow and not arch your back this way but it sounds a safer method than your neck break dilemma. Hope you didnt hurt yourself with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted July 2, 2012 Author Share Posted July 2, 2012 Hi AllI have been doing karate for years and most of our throws, tumbles and breakfalls are done on concrete with no matts, so I am fine, it was just unfortunate that the box I used was probably a bit to long to be able to roll out of properly, I am looking up some foam / rubber matts so its not so bad if I have an accident. I may just contnue to do Walk Walks with negatives but I would like to get some actual pushing up working in aswell.At the moment I am reading the forums on how to structure a full workout to take advantage of the Gymnastic training as I feel it has a good carry over for karate especially when we are working techniques that require strength from a disadvantaged leveraged body point.CheersNeverGiveUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted July 2, 2012 Share Posted July 2, 2012 Practicing L-sit to tuck planche and trying to lift your hips as high as possible, with no momentum if you can, to fatigue will really help you.If you fold your body like a V sit as you pass from L-sit into the beginning of the HS press, as she probably did, and try the same thing as mentioned above you will basically be doing a half press. I'd practice with bent arms AND straight arms, regardless of which one the challenge is for, because they will strengthen different aspects of your shoulder girdle.The work you are doing is a good idea, but you do need to practice for the skill itself as well. Is her challenge for straight arms or bent arms? If it's bent arms, your focus should be on HeSPU progressions and that lift I just described.Another drill is L-sit to shoulder stand, if the challenge is for bent arms, but you may not have a safe place to do that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted July 2, 2012 Author Share Posted July 2, 2012 Hi JoshuaThanks for the reply, to be honest it will be more of a tuck sit than an L-Sit as I have very bad hamstring flexibility so I will not get a L-Sit until I fix my flexibility. As for the challenge she said an L-Sit / Tuck to Handstand was the challenge, how we get there straight arm, bent arm, smooth or with a bit of a swing is up to us, obvisouly the person that masters an L-Sit to handstand with the best form wins the challenge.As for her demonstration, she went from an L-Sit with straight arms to a pike, transitioned with straight arms all the way into a handstand, she done this with complete control and very smooth, there was no press involved it was straight arms all the way. It looked awesome but she is 19 and has been training gymnastics since she was 5.I would love to be able to do the straight arm version, although my L-sit into a pike / V-sit will never be like hers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted July 2, 2012 Author Share Posted July 2, 2012 While I am on the subject, what is the best way to get the flexibility for an L-Sit, at the moment if I sit straight legged on the floor, I cant sit up straight I have to lean back slightly as I feel the pull behind the knee, I am just what is described in Scotland as a steky, lol.When I am doing my L-sit I bend my knees enough so that I dont feel the pull in the hamstrings, I feel a lot of pressure on my arms and lots of pressure on my thighs but not really on my core, does this mean that my core is strong enough to hold the position but my thighs and arms are the weak points?If you know what a Dragon Flag is I can hold that position at 45 degrees with straight body for around 30 seconds as these are used a lot in my karate class for core strength. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OyvindBirkeland Posted July 2, 2012 Share Posted July 2, 2012 http://gymnasticbodies.com/tutorials/we ... e-stretch/Works fine for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted July 2, 2012 Author Share Posted July 2, 2012 Hi JoshuaDamn just watched some of your youtube videos, you are a beast!!! Gratz man!!NeverGiveUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted July 2, 2012 Author Share Posted July 2, 2012 Hi AllGot some Parralettes made at work and had a play, not sure how much this is an indication of strength but I had a play anyway, no way in hell could I straighten my arms, thought my biceps were going to explode doing this as it was, lol.http://flic.kr/p/cpFWKANeverGiveUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Are you resting on the upper arms? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted July 3, 2012 Author Share Posted July 3, 2012 Hi JoshuaI am not resting on my arms but I have my upper arms locked and a lot of tension in my shoulders and I am squeezing tightly.CheersNeverGiveUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Nice. You should be able to start with L-sit to tuck PL presses no problem. Same with half presses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douglas Bell Posted July 3, 2012 Author Share Posted July 3, 2012 Hi JoshuaI went from a somewhat bent arm tuck planche to a handstand with moderate control but I couldnt push into a full hanstand as I just dont have the strength in my shoulders, but I will work on it. At the moment an L-Sit is beyond me as I just dont have the flexibilty in my hamstrings.Also the transition from the L-Sit (or my bent knee version) to the Tuck Planche is non existent at the moment.CheersNeverGiveUp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted July 3, 2012 Share Posted July 3, 2012 Hi JoshuaI went from a somewhat bent arm tuck planche to a handstand with moderate control but I couldnt push into a full hanstand as I just dont have the strength in my shoulders, but I will work on it. At the moment an L-Sit is beyond me as I just dont have the flexibilty in my hamstrings.Also the transition from the L-Sit (or my bent knee version) to the Tuck Planche is non existent at the moment.CheersNeverGiveUpI never said you'd get it first try! Starting with the bent knee L-sit and moving as far into tuck PL as you can is a great way to do this. If you're doing this properly you will feel it in the ribs where your serratus anterior attaches. It will feel like it's the lats, but a bit too far forward. Overall, your focus should be on hollow planks and push ups with a plus (performed slowly). Basically, the beginning of the planche prerequisites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now