HLL

[Ian Legrow]

In a video i am watching by jordan Jovtchev he says that you should keep your legs bent in the HLL until you are strong enough you keep your legs straight. Is this way better then keeping your legs straight and gradually getting higher?

[Daniel Burnham]

You should always try to train full rang of motion unless there is something preventing you from doing so. Bending of the legs lets you do this with the decreased leverage.

[Joshua Naterman]

Burn said it. You should always train full ROM. There's nothing wrong with doing partial work as well, but make sure you are training full ROM as well, and that full ROM gets the primary focus.

[Julekman]

HLL Full ROM is primary target, but if someone cant do it there is no point to force them. Tuck,or partially bent is step before full rom. If flexibility is low, then go back to floor, lay down and work there with full rom to increase flexibility.

[Joakim Andersson]

burnhamd and slizzardman,

Why is it important to do full ROM? I'm interested because I'm working to achieve a OAC. I can do it from the elbow being at a 60-70 degree angle (a bit deeper than half way down/upper arm parallel to the floor) and my goal is to do it from a dead hang.

Do you mean that assisted work from the bottom and up with benefit more than slowly improving unassisted ROM, plus extra work such as weighted one arm dead hangs?

And to keep from straying away from the topic, this was also the way I perfected my HLL and later one arm HLL, by gradually getting higher with straight legs.

[Joshua Naterman]

burnhamd and slizzardman,

Why is it important to do full ROM? I'm interested because I'm working to achieve a OAC. I can do it from the elbow being at a 60-70 degree angle (a bit deeper than half way down/upper arm parallel to the floor) and my goal is to do it from a dead hang.

Do you mean that assisted work from the bottom and up with benefit more than slowly improving unassisted ROM, plus extra work such as weighted one arm dead hangs?

And to keep from straying away from the topic, this was also the way I perfected my HLL and later one arm HLL, by gradually getting higher with straight legs.

Your progress would have been faster, and there is no guarantee that you have not developed compensation patterns in the process. If you were diligent about keeping perfect form then you are probably fine, but if you had included full ROM work you would have almost certainly achieved your goals in less time.

You don't need very much direct OAC work, 1-2 sets 4-5 days per week is plenty.

What you are doing will work, but it will take longer and may end up teaching you a less than ideal movement. What good is a OAC if it doesn't carry over to anything else? This is a matter of perspective, and my perspective is that you should always have perfect movement.

Full ROM is important for maintaining joint mobility as well as working on your muscles evenly.

For example: In HLL, up to 80-90ish degrees (just below parallel with ground) Psoas has very little involvement. From 80 on up to a V, about the top half of the movement, psoas and rectus abdominus are both working quite hard with Rectus Femoris not doing much. So during the first half of HLL you aren't working the muscles responsible for the top half hardly at all (compared to what they have to do at and past 90 degrees).

In OAC, in the arm the biceps are really only prime movers at the very top, and then it's brachialis down to about 45-60 degrees, and then it's radiobrachialis. So by doing what you are doing, one of the muscles is being largely undertrained. We're not even going to get into teres major and the other back muscles. If you are simultaneously performing full ROM work you will be covering these muscles well, as they will be your limiting factor. This will allow you to make much better progress if there is a focus on OAC and the same or slightly better progress (possibly as good or better than just focusing on OAC) if you are working on many things at once.

it is not the only way, but it is a smarter way. No matter what you do, you can't do a full ROM OAC until the weakest part of the ROM is strong enough. You can focus heavily on that and have less energy to put into other skills or you can focus on the weakest part first and train many more things at the same time. In the end, it takes the same or slightly less time and prevents injuries as well as gives you a vastly superior array of skills that you can perform. Those skills mean more strength, more muscular development, and just being more awesome in general.

I don't know why anyone would want to focus so hard on one thing when they could spend the same amount of time on the calendar and get so much more out of their training.

[Joakim Andersson]

Thanks for the insightful reply. I'll try more assisted full ROM and see how it evolves.

[Drills4Skills]

Hi there

I have questions about one of the

quintessential strength exercise in Gymnastics

The Hanging leg lift !!.

My hanging leg lifts currently are quite horrible... I can barely make it to

the horizontal... I can however make it to about 70-75 Degrees with a stall bar.

Im not inflexible or anything but I just don't have the strength in the necessary muscle groups.

People also say that its harder for me because I have long legs. That however is not a good enough reason

to be incapable of doing good HLL's

I am not new to gymnastics in general but I am new to proper training and strength

regimes.

what associated exercises can I do ,short of leg lifts themselves which I continue to practice in vain it seems,

that will dramatically improve my ability to do better leg lifts?.

i.e. isolated exercises that will strengthen the right muscle groups etc.

Thanks for your time

PS what is an AOC?

[Blairbob]

For now, I would focus on mastering the L hang and using HLL with knees bent and tucked with some sort of tempo. 313 maybe.

At the gym, for the girls who couldn't do HLL without a spot, we would do this:

On/under the low bar of a set of UB, set up a big block and lay a springboard upside down at desired angle.

Hold the rail and perform HLL, toes to bar. Gymnast is now doing HLL at an inclined angle instead of in a full hang so it's easier.

V-ups are another drill. I've heard of weighted ankle leg lifts or banded leg lifts but have not really tried either.

[jl5555]

Just take it a bit at a time. Start with knee ups (to 90 degrees) extend the legs to horizontal and then slowly down in negatives. After not too long you should be able to do it with your legs straighter and straighter until you are doing them properly.

[Drills4Skills]

Thanks to you all for the advice on how to better my HLL's.

I will work on the suggestions provided and will let you know how I progress.

Thanks again.