Slow progress on the Front Lever

[Aaron Griffin]

So I've been working with the Front Lever for some time now, without a lot of heavy focus. I include 3-4 sets of about 80% effort as part of my warmup, which I do M/W/F and maybe Saturday. My regular workout is not a GB workout - mainly due to having limited space for rings.

However, I don't feel like I've been progressing quick enough. I am currently at approx 3x20s on the Adv Tuck (though, I must say it's not always perfect - sometimes more like a more hip-extended Tuck without a super flat back).

So if I want to advance JUST this skill quicker, what is the best way to do this? Should I start an SSC and do it M/T/Th/F? Should I add in some front lever pullups on my regular pullup days? Should I try doing front levers EVERY day?

Advice would be appreciated.

[Reveridian]

How long is some time? Keeping in mind all this advice is my opinion and you may want a mod to double check it but M/W/F seems alright. Instead of just doing the static you could incorporate some front pulls, front lever pulls and front lever negatives from an inverted hang (the negatives in a more advanced position then you are currently capable of holding (such as straddle)). Thinking about training the position FOR the position is good but you need to also think about which muscles you are using. You could supplement in some exercises that use those same muscles to increase your general level of strength and that may help you get the skill as well.

Remember that rest and diet is just as, or even more, important as the actual work you put in. Also remember that front lever is not exactly easy and it may take you a bit of time to acquire.

[Blairbob]

MWF is still pretty good compared to MTuThF.

Something I just tested for myself was my weighted pullup. It's nearly@ 1/2 BW+ though some conjecture about what's necessary for FL is 3/4 or more. I just tested my adv tuck FL 90/90 degrees and held it for 20s, up 5s from my last cycle.

So I'd test your weighted pullup? What's your body lever like? Use these as diagnostic tools for the FL. My body lever is decent and my L's are 1m+, probably 90s+. I haven't tested hollow in a long time and it's probably around there, maybe more if I pushed myself. It'll only get better as I lighten up but I have figured my weak pull strength as the limiter for this for some time now.

Generally I can hold a momentary one, from a pullup or hang but nowhere near as solid as I would like.

[Aaron Griffin]

Some time is... about 6 months. I probably increased about 5-10 seconds in that time.

As for my L-Sit, it's miserable - my hamstrings have been very tight for so long, that's it's very hard on my quads and lower back to do a real L-sit. I can do 3x30s with bent legs, but I haven't done it in a long time.

[Blairbob]

you can do 60s tuck FL, right?

[Nicholas Sortino]

As for my L-Sit, it's miserable - my hamstrings have been very tight for so long, that's it's very hard on my quads and lower back to do a real L-sit. I can do 3x30s with bent legs, but I haven't done it in a long time.

This is just like me. My quads, lower back and hip flexors all cramp when I try to do straight leg L-sits(which are horribly low). I can hold tuck ones alright though

[Joshua Naterman]

80% effort is WAY too much for warm up. That's cool once a week, but not more than that.

Weighted pull ups and chins (50/50 split) will help a lot. Erik can attest to that, he's 6'6 and 180 with a decent full front lever. When you hit around 60% added BW for a few reps you'll have the lat strength you need. Body levers will provide the straight body strength, and your dipping and HSPU work should give you all the tricep strength you need, together with the regular SSC FL work.

[Aaron Griffin]

you can do 60s tuck FL, right?

I'm not entirely sure, I moved on at 3x30s. I know that's not really how people do things in these parts, but my recovery is pretty good, and I figured the difference between tuck and adv tuck was small enough...

Is it worth going back and "perfecting" the tuck?

slizz, would you recommend I do a real SSC then? I've debated it, but I actually fear it will make my FSP warmup significantly longer... i.e. 6x10s.

I'll start adding in more weighted pull/chin work, to see if that helps.

[Gavin Strelitz]

Steady Stating the FSP's has worked very well for my BL and FL, adding roughly 10s to my max hold per 8 week cycle. Obviously you will be built differently to me but SSC has worked consistently well in advancing my FSP's.

[Joshua Naterman]

Yes, I think SSC would help. Just make things into a circuit so that you can go from exercise to exercise without needing hardly any rest. I do not recommend ever doing more than 4 sets of any hold, or less than 3 sets. If your working sets are 10s I would do 3-4 working sets. 6 is pretty tough and may be too much, and 3-4 will still give you plenty of improvement so that your next ssc will nave something like 15-20s holds x 3-4 working sets.

Working set is half of your max hold time. I personally did achieve 60s in flat tuck and I do feel it makes a difference, but 45s is an absolute cutoff. If you can't do that you don't have the development to start playing with straddle yet.

[Erich Lin]

I never played with straddle and got my full front lever. So I'm thinking straddle is not a necessity. I literally stayed at flat tuck for like 6-8 months at 3x20 seconds 2-3 times a week. Did not change a thing. And one day, I tested straddle and I held it for 5 seconds. I continued to work flat tuck because my max time was still at around 40 seconds. Then one day, I tested my full lay, and it was 5 seconds. I still did 3x20 seconds flat tuck, and then one day it was at 15 second full lay. My max at flat tuck was still at 45 - 50 seconds.... Just my $.02 You don't need to do specific training or move up a progression to get the desired skill.

[Erich Lin]

I would have to say though that I was also doing flat tuck front lever rows, and I occassionally threw in some flat tuck front lever straddle rows, so that could have helped it as well.

[Joshua Naterman]

I agree that straddle is not necessarily a necessity. I did spend time there, but I was working on single leg straightened versions at the same time as well as FL pulls and front pulls with ankle weights and weighted pull ups. I think that more than anything else it helped me to straighten my legs properly, which made a big difference. For me, my full lay isn't that much different than my straddle because my straddle flexibility is crap.

I do think that there is an intermediary step that helps a lot, and that is to practice your hardest FSP version that you can hold for at least 4 seconds and do a few sets of 50-70% max hold time once a week. This helped me a lot.