Backbend in a handstand

[jutajata]

Just wanna know what kind of preparatory exercises is necessary to safely progress in this technique cause i can do a good backbend but my lower back sufer a lot with pain after the hold. I notice its a matter of stretching out the shoulders to compensate the backbend so i started to train using a wall and concentrate on stretching the shoulders instead of overload the lower back muscles and vertebraes. So my training to improve this position consists on 4 sets of 15 secs with my feet on the wall and 2 sets of 2 reps per side in the limbers (going from the bridge position to handstand with one leg after another). I do a lot of bridge static holds in my yoga practise too.

Is this enough? And there are any other good exercise that improve this position and help to prevent a lower back injury?

Thanks guys!

[Guest]

I don't have any advice to offer but this type of handstand is something that I'd like to achieve too, some day. Good luck in your quest!

[Richard Duelley]

I have been working this also and have been using the wall as well. I have also worked on it with bent legs (just as another variation). When I do the wall holds I only go down as far as I can pull my feet off the wall. I just kick up against the wall, walk my hands out as I walk my feet down and then work to pull my feet off the wall. The way we are working it is the only way I can think of to build the proper flexibility and strength to hold the position, the next problem is trying to lower down from a free standing handstand which is really hard and a bit unnerving for me :shock: But I personally think this position is one of the coolest looking handbalancing positions out there!

I asked Ido this very question a while ago, and its the very first post in my handbalancing log over on his forum. Here is his reply. I at first thought I would work from a bridge and press it up but Ido says that "your (my) approach would not be wise." So now, whenever I feel up for it, I give it a few tries free standing. . . but I havent really gotten anywhere with it.

"Ricky, like in most movements, the eccentric part of the motion is easier than the concentric.

So, your aproach would not be wise. I suggest to work from the top (handstand) and lower back down as much as you can, hold for time (5-15 sec) and perform sets.

This is a very basic recommendation. A more complete aproach to the development of this movement is beyond the scope of this forum, but will be presented later on, along with improtant prehab before starting such practice, dynamic and static mobility work specific to that motion, and some advanced PNF work using the stall bars for further development of the strength/flexilbility needed for such movements. (The last one is directly from Charles Poliquin, from a consultation I did with him many many years ago..)" Ido Portal

[Nick Van Bockxmeer]

awesome pic.

This is also one of my (long term) goals. Handstand lower to bridge and back up again. Super slow. Im also using the wall, starting in back to wall HS with fingers touching the wall, walking out all the way down to bridge. I am able to do this with straight legs. The concentric motion...my god this is seriously killing my shoulders. I don't do more than one rep of this at a time at the moment. By the time I have walked back up the wall (with straight legs) I am gone.

[jutajata]

Great tips guys!

I feel that my shoulders are a little tight for this position, i'll have to develop a more extremely open shoulder strength to hold this position more confortably in a safe spot instead of the one im usually going to that strain my lower back a lot.

Observing the way the professionals handbalancers do this skill you can see a very intense use of shoulder girdle flexibility to hold it safely. Im just a little annoyed cause my back really scream in pain when i come back from that backbend, maybe i need to spend a lot more time in the preparatory exercises using wall and concentrating on a more open shoulder position before rushing into the full position.

Keep the replies coming!

[Guest]

I've come to realize that the weakest aspect in my bridge is that I simply can't push my shoulders over my hands in bridge position. Now, I've never really trained my bridge and I can only do a basic bridge but I decided to start working on it (yesterday, actually). I lie down on the floor, put my feet on the couch and then push up into bridge. This makes it so much easier to get your shoulders over your hands (or at least, almost) and in this position, I try to gently straighten my legs, pushing my shoulders back and bending more in the middle/upper back regions.

I'm sure you guys are a lot more advanced in your bridge flexibility but this feels as if it's going to work for me in terms of getting a good, strong bridge. First, I want my shoulders over my hands, then I will progressively lower my feet until I can do it from the floor.

[Jason Stein]

Great tips guys!

I feel that my shoulders are a little tight for this position...

Juta,

To work flexibility in shoulders and chest, you might try this same sequence and alignment, but with hands interlaced in a headstand position.

You might also begin walking down the wall, and take a couple reps to increasing the ROM to full bridge.

From there you can drop to the floor from headstand, then perhaps limber back up to headstand.

Finally, after this, you can play around with lifting one leg straight up and straightening the supporting leg.

I find if I can lift my head off the floor, I can press into chest and shoulders and feel a nice, active stretch in preparation for full handstand limbers and, in yoga, what is called vrschikasana, or scorpion.

Another suggestion as a prep for your "Mexican" might also be to practice it from forearm balance and really work the chest/shoulder flexibility.

If the bending stays in your lumbar/low back? Not good...

best,

jason

[Cole Dano]

Some random thoughts that might be of help-

Usually the most important issue in lower back compression is 'falling' into the lower back. Since your handstanding is already very solid, think when you are still vertical that you are lifting your hips and lengthen your waist, this will begin to decompress your spine. Now try to keep this lifting and let that inform the move into the backbend. The lumbar bends but keeps lifting.

In the shoulders one easily missed component, that is particularly important in back bending, is to think of spreading the shoulder blades wide. If you can feel the inner edge of your shoulder blades clearly in a regular handstand think of moving the whole inner line away from your spine and wrapping your shoulder blades around your sides. This can give an amazing increase in shoulder opening.

With this widening of the shoulder blades, take your upper back into the chest so it feels like the curve of the lower back and upper back are part of the same arc.

All to often backbends are only happening in the lower back. The 'bend needs to spread' and the thoracic spine flatten and move in towards the chest as the whole spine lengthens. In a back bend to get very specific the front of the spine lengthens, if you think of your spine as a tube lengthen the part the faces into your body more.

Have fun brother, and get rid of the pain!

[Coach Sommer]

I refer to to this as a reverse planche and have used it for a number of years with my top athletes.

The emphasis during this element should be in the shoulders; not the lower back. Feeling more stress in the lower back, rather than the shoulders, is a sure sign that you are performing this exercise incorrectly.

My recommendation is to begin from a static HS and then slowly lower into the reverse planche by attempting to press the shoulders in front of your hands. Do not lower deeper than you can pull out of back to HS. Do not allow the elbows to bend or the hands to be placed wider than usual for a regular HS.

Performed well, the athlete should be able to slowly lower their feet to just above the floor before pulling back to the HS.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

[Blairbob]

This kind of HS was taught me by a name called the Yogi HS. I believe it was in the old FIG code as well. I believe the old diagram in the code both had a very open shoulder angle but the back was either really arched (like this reverse planche which is done by women on BalanceBeam a lot) or piked at the hips.

I remembered these recently, so we've taken to doing them against the wall with the hopes of increasing the shoulder flexion in some of the guys. We do one hold of each, so 2 against the wall back to wall and stomach to wall, piked and arched.

[Coach Sommer]

Working reverse planches against the wall is not nearly as effective due to the lack of muscular tension. It is much more productive in the long run to gradually increase the ROM from the static HS.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

[Richard Duelley]

Working reverse planches against the wall is not nearly as effective due to the lack of muscular tension. It is much more productive in the long run to gradually increase the ROM from the static HS.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

I will have to try and add this into my freestanding work then, hmmm I might have to start programming my handstand work because I am starting work quite a variety of skills now 8) Would it be beneficial to work this out of a tucked handstand as well. I am not talking about for pure gymnastics but for someone, like me, who is very much obsessed with handbalancing.

[jutajata]

Working reverse planches against the wall is not nearly as effective due to the lack of muscular tension. It is much more productive in the long run to gradually increase the ROM from the static HS.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

Thanks for the tips Coach!

Its really a privilege to have this assistance from guys with so much know-how in this area.

Ill implement this approach asap!

[Blairbob]

Working reverse planches against the wall is not nearly as effective due to the lack of muscular tension. It is much more productive in the long run to gradually increase the ROM from the static HS

Hmm, I hadn't thought of this as my goal for it was just opening up the shoulder. I thought maybe this way they could put more pressure on their shoulder girdle to shoulder flex than I could doing it manually stretching them.

Right now my goal with these guys is still to develop a stable HS. I will definitely keep this in mind if I ever go back to coaching girls to reverse planche in optionals.

[Nick Van Bockxmeer]

[Guest Ido Portal]

Actually, I feel there are a lot of ways to achieve this, from a technique POV.

In the last picture posted, for example, the CDS artist does not use a lot of shoulder flexibility, but more lower back one.

I am also limited in my shoulder flexibility and feel more safe and comfortable to use more lower back for this move.

Extreme arching in the lower back, like many types of extreme ROM should be aproached with active means for both the agonists antagonistic being stretched. I do not agree with those experts who make a b&w statements as: arching is bad.It is simply bad for the ones who are not prepared and properly conditioned for it. Also, for most people, the lower back can take a lot more punishment than the gentle, hypermobile but unstable shoulder joint.

The coache's advice about the HS lower down and pull back is right on the money. No other approach will yeild faster and more stable results as the real thing, being incremental in the ROM. Also, I like to combine static holds in the position before/instead of pulling back, as well as multiple dynamic reps in and out without stopping there.

I am not flexible in my shoulders and limited in the amount and type of shoulder flexibility I can perform due to an old shoulder injury, but I am still able to lower down to the floor and pull back to HS even though.

My 2 cents,

Ido.

[Razz]

Ido what kind of shoulder injury did you have? It's interesting for me to see how far you got with what kind of shoulder injury, as I'm just coming out of one myself.

[Guest Ido Portal]

Subscap tear, many years ago.

It is under control, with all the attention I give it both from soft tissue management side, scap mobilization and trap-3, rotator cuff and scap retractors strengthening, but whenever I try to push shoulder flexibility, it can get reinjured.

Ido.

[jl5555]

I find that forearm balance inversion and scorpion have really opened up my shoulders more than anything I've tried.

[Guest]

I find that forearm balance inversion and scorpion have really opened up my shoulders more than anything I've tried.

I had never done them but I played around with the forearm balance inversion over the weekend and it did feel very good in my upper back/shoulders. I'm adding these to my routine

[jl5555]

Jamester has a video somewhere in which he walks around in a forearm balance. Quite impressive considering the shoulder flexibility required.