Been on RC/PE1 for 20 months - help!

I'm getting ready to lose my sh^% with this exercise.

Ive been doing it since June 2014, and I still can't get 4x15r.

My form and tempo have definitely improved since the start but I just don't seem to be making any progress with this one over the last few months.

Ive been doing Thrive since it started, I don't miss workouts, and I go to failure on the final sets.

Is this just how long it takes? Should I be doing supplemental work on this exercise? And if so, what should I be doing?

I know a lot of guys struggle with this one... I'm just starting to wonder if I'm doing something wrong?

Any help is appreciated,

Cam

Sorry I don't recall, but have you done a form check lately?

Just filmed this now:

Hey Cam

I think you should try to lose the up and down movement that happens during hinging. Didn't notice anything major being wrong otherwise 

Thanks Petri!

i noticed that as well

Will work on that

What step are you at right now?

Try to 'hinge' at the hip. Ideally the hips should not drop and should stay in the same spot. 

I think your tempo is rather fast. Try to match the tempo on the videos.  And add a brief pause at the top.   Doing those things should increase the difficulty and activation of the muscles..

If you are still having trouble, try adding a few sets of static holds in the top position.   Also stretching out the pecs before, will open the chest make the movement easier. 

Hope that helps.

Hi Cameron,

We've all felt this way at some point or another... Don't give up. Don't let temporarily feelings get in the way of your long-term goal.

Many here are willing to help. Please check my thread for the same element where Zach provides first-class guidance:

https://www.gymnasticbodies.com/forum/topic/23699-rcpe1-work-in-progress%C2%A0/?do=findComment&comment=207436

My main issue was hip bobbling and you have some of that going on too. 

1. You need to find the exact height for your rings (in relationship to your individual anatomy) in order to avoid hip bobbling.

2. You may need to move your heela back a bit so your hips stay put under your rings. If you stop your video when your torso is up, you're leaning back a bit. 

3. You're flexing at your lower back instead of hinging at your hips. For this, I'd practice on the side your hinge patern with a straight leg deadlift to insure you have that hinge component down with neutral spine.

4. I would slow down tour tempo so you can feel where your hips are during the transitions.

Hope this is not tmi. You're closer than you think!!

Coach Sommer's recommendations

Do not worry about how long it might take you to master a part of the course. At some point in the couse there will be parts that seem like a you have hit a wall head on.The more you work on it the greater your tendon strength develops. As your tendon strength develops, your body gains more muscular strength without needing needing additional hypertrophic mass.

As you continue to shed body weight, your body will be lighter and the exercise will seem easier. Keep at the hard work.

That's great info - thanks guys.

Rayne-William, the link you posted seems to be advice from coach for someone who can't do any hinge rows... Would you suggest the holds as supplemental work?

53 minutes ago, Cameron Williams said:

Would you suggest the holds as supplemental work?

(That's what I suggested! :p)

Hello Cameron, 

When you say you fail at 4x15 reps, how do you fail ?

I struggled a lot with the final reps of RC/PE3 and RC/PE4 and to me what helped was when I started to fail was let go of the rings for a couple of secs, breathe and resuming the set to the target amount of reps. What also helped was, if you can do the 4x12 reps, maybe you can ditch that week and try 4x15 reps for that week to get some more volume. Progressing in this would be having less and shorter pauses, so make a note in your workout log where you pause. Just make sure it's short pauses to catch your breath and take some of the burn off your arms, don't actually rest. 

In exercises where you stall it's important to have a workout log, to try to analyze why you fail and also I find it helps with motivation because, as you said you ARE progressing, just not at the rate that you might have wished.

This will sound a bit corny, but if you have access to an intelligent, comprehending yet ruthless workout partner it'll also help immensely. I find that one can double one's efforts if you have someone giving instant feedback on your form and more importantly if they shout at you :).

Here's a link to an article I wrote a while back that may help you.

Hey Cam,

I have also been on this one for a while but not quite lost my rag with it yet. I still can't get past 4x9r. My pecs are so tight that I fatigue quicker at the end rom on these. I may start stretching them out before I start the exercise. Perhaps a similar issue with you? Also as several mentioned above, you need to fix that hip bobbing. I need to check mine also now that I seen this topic.

Anyway don't give up just yet mate. Just imagine what Jeff would say if he found out the original suspect were going to give up. You don't need him coming into this subforum giving you s**t. Or maybe you do?

Wow, thanks everyone for your responses - very encouraging!

Julian - sorry man, I see that you wrote about static holds there. I didn't register that the first time I read it . So yes, good call.

Christian - I fail on sets 3 and 4. I typically get 15,15,12,9, or something close to that. On the final two sets, my strength just dies, and I literally can't pull myself up anymore. I will try your idea of short breaks mid-set too, with the idea of eventually phasing those out, of course.

Eva - thanks for the info and the encouragement! I can definitely see the hip-bobbing and the fast pace, so I'll work on that. As for hinging at the hips, I could be wrong, but I feel like I am doing that already. I have extraordinarily long legs for my height, so it might look like I'm hinging above my hips, when the reality is that I'm not.

Douglas - thank you for the link! I'll give that a read.

Si Hoang - I don't think it's tight pecs... I don't feel a stretch at all when I do the exercise, and have been doing TB for a year now, so I think I'm fairly good there. And yes, maybe I do need Jeff to pipe in and tell me to shoot myself in the face!

Zach - thanks as well!

Clearly I have more work to do!

Onward.

Cam

Tru-dat Zach is the man.  Zach's cue to press heels into the ground for support for the hinge movement I think makes the sit up more managable. I could be wrong but I think when I used to drop my hips coming up it made it harder than it needed to be because it loaded up the grip and shoulders more than necessary by dropping the body thereby increasing he weight load down rather than staying on the same plane. Are you doing any other upper body work not related to GST through out the week? Is your recovery dialled in? Sometimes less is more, for me I find it that way for now.

I know what your going through but I try to remind myself it's a journey not a destination. Some PEs I've moved on with others like this one I still work on. Can't say with any of it that I've become weaker as a result so at least it's not a waste of time.  Maybe not my place to say so forgive me but I think if your struggling with a PE longer than a year I would get video clarification to make sure your actually on the right track in the first place. Or better yet do it now if you haven't already. If you have been doing it then just ignore everything I just said. 

I almost quit out of frustration, not sure if performing anything right etc, etc, the usual whining  but I put the effort in and GB coaches were there (Zach was the victim I picked on) to put it all in perspective for me and drastically improved my reason for being here. Lastly, maybe consider GB pro, I've found the videos helpful in getting the work done and for quick form and temp cues to further help be on track. Good luck and don't quit I.....may need your support one day....

Thank you Sean!

To answer your questions:

* My recovery is pretty dialed in... I've been doing Thrive Nutrition since Jan 1, and do the 3-day F1 template, as I found the 4-day to be too much. Sleep is the only area that is a bit of a challenge for me. I get the requisite amount of time in bed with the lights out, but my sleep is often not solid through the night. that's been a lifelong issue for me though

* No, I am not doing any unrelated upper body work outside of GST

* Yes, you are totally right about the form check vids... I think I left this one way to long. It's a good lesson for me to make sure to post form checks more often, to make sure I'm on track

Thanks for your input and support!

Cam

Hi Cameron, 

Do you have GB pro +?  This will help with programming and with all the other suggestions you will definitely get there. 

Nicholas - I had GB Pro+ but not anymore 

Zach - I stop the set after failure... Should I be taking a short rest and finishing the numbers?

That's great feedback - thank you very much!

I guess I've been unclear/confused about which rep scheme to use and for how long, and also when to stop a set. 4x12 for me is relatively easy, so I figured if I just stayed on 4x15, the final two sets would eventually come up, but that's where I stalled. 

I'll try all of your suggestions and see how I do!

Thanks again,

Cam

4 hours ago, Cameron Williams said:

Nicholas - I had GB Pro+ but not anymore 

 

 Why in the world would you discontinue GB Pro+ when you have a GB certified instructor there leading you through your workouts and iMs?

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

GB pro plus its tips are seriously helpful. I can attest to Coach's insight. Though I've much work to be done, I'm gaining ground in my progress. 

If I may add my opinion to Coach's question about GB Pro even tho it was directed to Cam. the reason I cancelled was because it was very buggy starting out. I signed up when first heard of it and I thought "awesome". but later discovered I couldn't get many of  the follow along vids to play on my iPad. Some would show... many didn't. Didn't matter what device I used it was the same. Also the schedular wouldn't allow me to down grade the steps of all my PEs when the follow along vids showed me my tempo wasn't there. Any change for that matter.  Could be user error but I did watch all the instruction vids and I'm not computer illiterate entirely. In addition I had trouble recording certain elements my results as well.  

I sent help requests to Cory, as I was instructed to do, and he responded to many patiently so I have no complaints as to how that went but it seemed to me it needed time to work out the newness of it.  Since nothing was offered in the mean time to offset the inconvenience, I thought I would cancel and try back later rather than pay and not have full use from the get go. nothing worse than debugging computer issues while trying to work out   

I would like to get back to it as I did find it very useful and motivating. I wouldn't have cancled otherwise. If there has been "bug" improvements I would interested to know. I rather not pay again to discover otherwise. As everyone's  experience if diff i may be the exception here. 

There are many things competing for my hard earned cash, plus  exchange for me as well, so I couldn't get enough use out of it to justify staying on board on a monthly basis at the time. This is all in the tone of constructive criticism, no offence meant. 

1 hour ago, Coach Sommer said:

 Why in the world would you discontinue GB Pro+ when you have a GB certified instructor there leading you through your workouts and iMs?

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

To be honest, I don't see the value in it. Form and tempo can be seen on the standard course videos. I receive excellent (and much needed!) guidance on the forum on these two variables. Rep counts seem to need my own personal tweaking, as per the above conversation. 

The GB+ videos helped me see that I was taking a little too much time between sets, but I've fixed that now.

That's my reasoning anyways.... but I'm open to changing my perspective. Am I missing something here?

Edit: some of the issues Sean just mentioned were a factor for me too. Scheduler/video errors that I had to message Cory about (who was always very helpful) were a bit of a pain, and the CAD/USD exchange rate is a factor for me too. That said, it's not like I won't spend money on this stuff... I've been to a live seminar in Seattle (travelling from Vancouver), and have invested in F1, H1, and Thrive, and been very pleased with everything so far.

GB Pro+ is not designed to be 'viewed'.  Follow along with the workouts; rep for rep, set for set.  Find the deficits.  Listen to the technical points.  And correct deficiencies.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

Regarding the bugs, I haven't had any since I 'properly' started with GB Pro+. So there's that. Regarding the value, well, that's subjective after all, but it really is a fantastic tool overall. I especially like having access to the online classes. Gives ideas for some supplemental work.

Still can't beat real-life ass-kicking from Coach, but there's plenty coming in July.