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Daniel Bilek

pull ups vs rope climb

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Daniel Bilek

Pull ups are excelent tool for building upper back strenght. Its same for rope climb? Its mean can i replace pull ups with rope climb? What benefits it have? IF i know pull up also help to front lever. Its same for rope climb?  i cant do pull ups and rope climb in one train session..its so much + my other work.

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Dylan Robertson

Pull-Ups are a progression to Rope Climbing. They are both Vertical Pulling and will build the same muscles. I do not reccomend Strict Rope Climbing as that's a great way to get elbow tenonitis unless your body is properly prepared.

Pull-Ups will not help with Front Lever (or the benefits are minimal) as FL is a straight arm element. (Straight vs. Bent Arm) and is in a different plane of motion (Horizontal vs Vertical), therefore Pull-Ups will not help FL Work.

Your best bet to obtaining these skills while not injuring yourself, and preparing the body is to buy the Foundation Series, as those are 2/7 of the main goals of it.

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Jon Douglas

Pull-Ups are a progression to Rope Climbing. They are both Vertical Pulling and will build the same muscles. I do not reccomend Strict Rope Climbing as that's a great way to get elbow tenonitis unless your body is properly prepared.

Pull-Ups will not help with Front Lever (or the benefits are minimal) as FL is a straight arm element. (Straight vs. Bent Arm) and is in a different plane of motion (Horizontal vs Vertical), therefore Pull-Ups will not help FL Work.

Your best bet to obtaining these skills while not injuring yourself, and preparing the body is to buy the Foundation Series, as those are 2/7 of the main goals of it.

Pretty much says it all.

I do a fair bit of rope climbing now and rarely bother with normal pullups.

Weighted, Chinese or occasional high rep set sure, and this is not a great idea without progressive elbow and shoulder prep as above, as well as requiring pretty good shoulder and lat mobility to avoid reinforcing bad habits when vomume rope climbs become a fixture in training :)

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Daniel Bilek

Yes pull ups help progress with front lever. I know many and many guys who learned front lever only by weighted pull ups. ( i dont say its good way to learn, but its possible)
And i'm talking here about weighted pull ups vs rope climb you know, rope climb is more chin up than pull up.
Dont talk about preparation. (i dont want talk about preparation, just weighted pull ups vs rope climb)

If pull ups varitation is preparation for rope climb than weighted pull ups (here is always progress) can replace rope climb and rope climb can replace weighted. pull ups? Its same????

Edited by Daniel98

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Jon Douglas

The original post did not say anything at all about weighting pullups :) don't get upset if your questions are not clear.

Weighted pullups cannot replace rope climb for soft tissue conditioning for ring strength. They will build a bigger and stronger back though, bigger than rope climbs with enough weight and volume.

I've had good results doing heavy weighted pullups and higher volume rope climbs once a week each; you don't need to choose just one. Doing both will help ward off elbow issues provided you have enough preparation in the first place :)

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Coach Sommer

- There is no 'vs'.

For GST rope climbing is far superior to pull-ups.

- Rope climb is not more chin-up than pull-up; rope climb is more simillar to neutral grip pull-ups and heavily targets the brachialis.

Yours in Fitness,
Coach Sommer

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Ivan Pavlovic

Those guys who learned fl doing only pullups didnt have straight arm front lever for sure. Pullups separate weight to certain muscles and cant strenghten lats enough to hold straight arm from lever. Pullups with weight maybe can strenghten lats for fl but then again elbows wont be strong enough to hold it with streight arms and eventualy you will develop injury.

From my point of thinking rope climb is more biceps and forearms dominant while pullups are more biceps and lats dominant. If training fl and rope climb combined you will strenghten lats,biceps and forearms definitely more then you will with weighted pullups and you will also strenghten your elbow joints which later will help you with iron cross training.

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Katharina Huemer

IMO Pull-Ups work full ROM better (if done correctly from deadhang and chin clears the bar) while in rope climb you often take smaller steps, unless you are really strong and can basically pull yourself up on one arm from deadhang.
Rope climbs are good for grip strength.

I do know girls who can climb up a rope about 10feet taking very small steps but they are unable to do a single full ROM pull-up.

I think that if you can do 5 good pull-ups and have a strong core, you are able to climb a 20ft rope once. However, it wouldn't be good for your elbows and rope climb mastery of GB is FAR more difficult than "simple" pull-ups.

Depending on how often you train and what your current strength level is, I would say you could train pull-ups 3 times a week and rope climb on the 4th or something like that. 

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Travis Widmann

(i dont want talk about preparation...)

 

Then don't talk about more advanced pulling progressions. You can't have one without the other. It either comes with preparation or it comes with injury. Take your pick.

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Daniel Bilek

Then don't talk about more advanced pulling progressions. You can't have one without the other. It either comes with preparation or it comes with injury. Take your pick.

Im talking here weighted pull ups vs rope climb wich is advanced pulling. I dont want post where everyone talk about injures i know what preparation need but here im talkin about benefits and + and -.

I like rope climb and weighted pull ups so i will train 2x weighted and 2x rope, its help to better my front lever too if pull ups are here. Thanks for reply all.

Edited by Daniel98

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Alessandro Mainente

Saying that pullup will help in front lever is reductive.

BBuilding style pullup helps front lever but you need perfect technique to master them and you will never have muscle up preparation with this version.

regular gymnastics style pullup train much more elbow flexors preparing for adv rings element.

 

I do not believe that you are doing BBing style because before being able to add weigth you need to pass years to develop the proper technique and upper back activation. probably you are doing gymnastics style weigthed pullups. and if it is, you are training biceps until the bar stays above the middle of the neck.

No matter about experience , sensations etc, EMG does not measure digital signal basing on experience and sensation.

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Ivan Tverdohlebov

Those guys who learned fl doing only pullups didnt have straight arm front lever for sure. 

Here is one of the guys who say that:

He claims that by doing only pullups he was able to hold a 1-leg front lever, without doing any straight arm work. Maybe his form wasn't perfect, and he certainly did static holds to get a full front lever, but pullups definitely helped.

 

So, even though it's not a most efficient way, it works for some.

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Coach Sommer

... So, even though it's not a most efficient way, it works for some ...

 

Why are you interested in even discussing a less efficient way?  

 

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

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Daniel Bilek

Here is one of the guys who say that:

He claims that by doing only pullups he was able to hold a 1-leg front lever, without doing any straight arm work. Maybe his form wasn't perfect, and he certainly did static holds to get a full front lever, but pullups definitely helped.

 

So, even though it's not a most efficient way, it works for some.

Ive achieved one leg front lever without any training for it too. Ive never sayed do only pull ups, but i think they help a lot. Of  course if you want front lever you need to work on front lever, pull ups help a lot but best way to learn fl is to start doing it.

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Ivan Pavlovic

@kesevar

Listen again every word what he says.

5:40 - "in fact that i chatted with Zeff i didnt stoped my static holds..."

P.S. I remember this guy saying once that straight arm training is bad for you and now he is doing it, hilariously. :lol:
 

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Jesse Kim

Honestly they both have their uses. Weighted pull ups are nothing to laugh at but rope climbs are so badass there's a reason why Coach Sommer included them in the foundation series. I think if you're trying to go through a hypertrophy phase then I guess you should include some weighted pull ups here and there. But for strength rope climbs are hard to beat.

 

Rope climbs are definitely harder on the elbows than pull ups, so if you ever do rope climbs/do both pull ups and rope climbs make sure your elbows are well prepared because tendinitis can develop pretty quickly if not careful.

 

Since we're on the topic of rope climbs, does anyone know if cirques are more demanding than chameleons? It looks like cirques require special preparation for the elbows because of the negative one arm chins; preparation that I think the Foundation series will provide.   

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Jon Douglas

Honestly they both have their uses. Weighted pull ups are nothing to laugh at but rope climbs are so badass there's a reason why Coach Sommer included them in the foundation series. I think if you're trying to go through a hypertrophy phase then I guess you should include some weighted pull ups here and there. But for strength rope climbs are hard to beat.

 

Rope climbs are definitely harder on the elbows than pull ups, so if you ever do rope climbs/do both pull ups and rope climbs make sure your elbows are well prepared because tendinitis can develop pretty quickly if not careful.

 

Since we're on the topic of rope climbs, does anyone know if cirques are more demanding than chameleons? It looks like cirques require special preparation for the elbows because of the negative one arm chins; preparation that I think the Foundation series will provide.   

Cirques are definitely more demanding than chamelons on the elbows, and mastery of Foundation rope climb standards should prepare you pretty well for them. More discussion on this topic will need to be in the F4 forum :)

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Edoardo Roberto Cagnola

Muscles don't know what you are doing when you move. The only thing they know is how to produce force in order to move the right levers (your torso, arms and legs) through space. This means that building a bigger and stronger back, in this case by doing pull-ups, will help everything that involves using your back muscles (pull up variations, rope climbs, front levers, deadlifts, squats, bench press, rows etc). Unfortunately pretty much every movement you can think of has a good skill component in it, that you can develop only by practicing the actual movement often enough (that's why in fitness the concept of "specificity" is really important when choosing exercises and assistance movements).

 

Front levers require a lot of back strength --> Pull-ups build back strength very nicely --> Pull-ups will help you get a front lever, but you'll still need to practice the skill directly through the right progressions. This isn't any different than saying that increasing your barbell squat will help you get a pistol squat: obviously it will, but you need to spend some time practicing pistols in order to get the skill down. 

 

Although there are some general principles that needs to be followed, there are a million ways to get stronger. If anyone tells you that their way is the only right way, that person is probably an arrogant idiot and doesn't know what he/she is talking about.

 

PS. That's my opinion anyways, so feel free to agree or disagree

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Mouclier Victor

i take the advantage of the thread : wich kind of pull up do you think giving the most latissimus dorsi activation ?

Edited by Bosco

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Jon Douglas

Pretty much. My back is certainly not the bit failing in rope climbs :)

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Mouclier Victor

Thanks  ! very interesting

 

plus, i 'm french so i can give details of the article if you need.

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Jose Morante

I really love rope climb but I can do because I don't have a place to do that, instead I have a vertical bar (like pole-dance bars), is climbing it useful like rope climbing is? Or it's just a waste of time and should just forget it and try differents variations of pull-ups?

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