Question for Coach Sommer (Please Help)

[gymrob]

Hi everyone and Coach,

I have aquired a wealth of knowledge just by reading numerous posts on this forum so I am very gateful. One think that I really have little info on is how to put together a proper program. I mean what would your recommendations be? Are there certain rules to follow? Maybe I should give more info about my goals so my routine can fit: I would like to gain a lot of PURE strength that's functional to tumbling, strength holds such as planches and skills such as press handstands. From reading from other sources, it seems that many people follow these guidelines for strength routines:

Skills or most CNS intensive things come first, though planches can be put at the end occassionally.

25-50 reps total per muscle group

1rm-5rm (1-5 reps) 3-5 mins rest in between sets

Balance a horizontal push with a vertical push and same for pull

This is very basic and when Coach Sommer saw my old routine he said

Gymrob,

On reviewing your workout, the first thing that struck me was the enormous pressing volume in a single workout. My preference would be for you to take those same pressing exercises and spread them over three separate workouts; handstand pushups on one day, planche pushups on another and dips on still another.

So does this mean doing something like this on monday, wednesday and friday?:

Monday:

appropraite planche holds in sets of 50% max

HSPU's: 5X3

Pullups (weighted): 5X4

Hanging Leg raises: 5X5

Pistols: 5X4

Wednesday:

appropraite planche holds in sets of 50% max

Tuck planche pushups: 5X3

Rows(weighted): 5X5

Ab wheel roll outs: 5X5

Pistols: 5X4

Friday:

appropraite planche holds in sets of 50% max

Dips (weighted): 5X4

Pullups(weighted): 5X4

Ab wheel roll outs: 5X5

Pistols: 5X4

Is this routine ok? I really need to know how good or bad it is and what can be improved. Thankyou so very much!

[George Launchbury]

Hi gymrob,

I'm not Coach Sommer, but what I can see is that your basic plan per workout seems to be:

> push static

> push dynamic

> pull dynamic

> core

> legs

That's still 2:1 on the push:pull ratio. My suggestions would be to put a static pull in there as well (front-lever?) and maybe put some external rotation of the humerus in as well, as I believe the lats and pecs both internally rotate the humerus? Thinking about it ...just because you're on a three-days-a-week schedule, doesn't mean you can't work around a six-days-a-fortnight schedule instead? This might be handy as you can work on a two and three day cycle at the same time, and you're still back to the start every fortnight. In the below schedule, each workout has:

1 ...two static holds (push or pull) get three workouts per fortnight each

2 ...three dynamic pushes get two workouts per fortnight each

3 ...two dynamic pulls get three workouts per fortnight each

4 ...two core exercises get three workouts per fortnight each

5 ...one leg exercise gets some work every session

6 ...pre-hab and stretching gets some work every session

As you can see, the push/pull focus also alternates in that one workout has an additional pushing exercise, and the next has an additional pulling exercise. Over time this evens out to be a 1:1 ratio of push:pull.

For example:

Monday

1) Planche progressions

2) HSPUs

3) Weighted pullups

4) Ab-rollouts

5) Pistols

6) Pre-hab/stretching

Wednesday

1) Front-lever progressions

2) Tuck-planche pushups

3) Weighted rows

4) Hanging leg-raises

5) Pistols

6) Pre-hab/stretching

Friday

1) Planche progressions

2) Weighted dips

3) Weighted pullups

4) Ab-rollouts

5) Pistols

6) Pre-hab/stretching

Monday

1) Front-lever progressions

2) HSPUs

3) Weighted rows

4) Hanging leg-raises

5) Pistols

6) Pre-hab/stretching

Wednesday

1) Planche progressions

2) Tuck-planche pushups

3) Weighted pullups

4) Ab-rollouts

5) Pistols

6) Pre-hab/stretching

Friday

1) Front-lever progressions

2) Weighted dips

3) Weighted rows

4) Hanging leg-raises

5) Pistols

6) Pre-hab/stretching

I don't know if this helps, or is something that you've thought of but kicked into touch because it's a little complicated for your tastes? Maybe it will help someone else? Maybe I should get some sleep because I'm starting to ramble on. Unless someone comes along and shoots my thinking down I will probably move onto something like this at the end of the month when I have hit my March goals (hopefully)!!! I like the idea that things get paired with different exercises from session to session.

My only criticism might be that nothing really gets any focus, and might be a little bitty to progress quickly? Hopefully one of the more experienced coaches/trainers will help out?

Anyways.

Goodnight,

George.

[gymrob]

Hey George,

Thanks so very much for the suggestions and putting that routine together it really was what I think I was looking for. It looks so good that I will most definately use it. God I don't stop asking questions but here is what I was thinking:

I was thinking of following this routine for around 10 weeks. After this should I just change the exercises?

How long should such workout take time wise? I mean say I had 3 mins rest in between sets and say 2 mins in between exercises, that's gonna take over an hour. I'm guessing around 1 hour 20 mins. Is this too long? Or not because it is a strength workout mainly?

Finally, do you warm up for this kind of workout? I usually just do a bit of light jogging and dynamic stretching normally between 5-10 mins.

Thankyou

[George Launchbury]

Hey gymrob,

Warm-up sounds fine. I tend to row for 1km at varying intensity to start off with, since I want to warm up my upper body more than my legs. I also do some work with bands to warm my shoulders through as many angles as I can manage.

To save time you could superset/alternate opposing movements, such as pullups and dips for example. This cuts your rest down between sets to 0:45 - 1:30. And since your 'resting' muscles get some dynamic recovery during the alternate exercise, I'd probably start with 1:00 and see how you go. I'd also probably go straight from exercise to exercise, using the time taken to relocate as any recovery you might need. You're generally working different areas anyway.

NB - maybe setting two goals, one for time, and one for performance would be wiser. Whichever happens first is the signal for a new cycle? For example, one might set a goal of 10 weeks, or 5 HSPUs ...starting a new cycle when one of those criteria is met? That would cover you for if your goal was too high for one cycle, and if your cycle was too long for your goal.

Over that 10 weeks I would cycle the intensity, so you have periods of overload, load and deloading. There was a thread concerning this, but didn't really get any responses with any solid suggestions for timescales or ratios between them. Until I get some superceding information, my personal view on it is quite well summed up by my approach to chin-ups using assistance machine that I have gotten solid gains with so far:

Increase - aimed for 5x3, but invariably toward the end a number of them were negatives.

Consolidation - eventually I could manage 5x3, and then started adding a rep to each set, almost a case of increasing endurance in the movement. When I could do 5x6, I dropped some assistance weight, and started again trying for 5x3.

NB - Coach Sommer has written about underloading, which I would guess means a further short period of reduced load and higher reps? Maybe 2-3 sessions? I will look into that further.

Since you are doing a large variation of movements, I'm not sure you would need to change up the exercises so often, as long as you're cycling intensity, and making minor changes such as grip width, angles, etc. By doing this you are effectively changing the exercise anyway by altering the angles and pathways involved.

There are definitely people better placed to answer some of these questions on the forum, should they have the time, and I too would be interested in their take. Especially regarding cycling of intesity and exercises. I don't really have enough experience of training others (or gymnastic conditioning per se) to consider myself well informed on the subject.

I might also suggest that you swap out half of your Pistol sessions for some posterior-chain work, such as the bodyweight hamstring curl (described here) or stiff-legged deadlifts, etc?

Regards the session being too long ...that is quite subjective, and my advice would be to see how it goes. Depends on your ability to recover, training history, nutrition and sleep, etc. If you feel like you're over training, either cut back on the exercises, or have longer rests in between workouts - there is no rule that it has to fit neatly to the calendar week (but it is nice if it can ).

I liked the plan, too ...and was going to start using it myself. However I (wisely, I hope) decided that it was probably too much for me right now, given my current levels of conditioning. If you do use it, I'd be interested to hear how it works out for you.

Cheers,

George.

[Ortprod]

First: nice George, your writing is wonderful.

Second I had the same type of routine for a LONG time. Stick with it and listen to George.