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hype

Maltese vs full planche, which is harder?

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hype

Topic title says it all,

Which one is harder? Maltese or full planche?

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Toni Laukkavaara

What i want to know is, which one is more benefical to learn first if you want to learn them both

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Sunjata

From what I could tell, I always thought the maltese was more difficult because it's essentially a planche but wide-armed, and if on the rings it's a horizontal iron cross. 

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Daniel Burnham

What i want to know is, which one is more benefical to learn first if you want to learn them both

Planche IMO. Are you ready to learn either?

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Ivan Pavlovic

I think that maltese is harder. :)

Edited by Paf

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Toni Laukkavaara

Planche IMO. Are you ready to learn either?

yeah omw to planche. Never trained maltese

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Coach Sommer

Maltese, as it is substantially more demanding on the biceps and brachialis.

 

It is also worth noting that a straight planche is rated a 'C' and a maltese is rated a 'D'.

 

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

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Daniel Burnham

Maltese, as it is substantially more demanding on the biceps and brachialis.

It is also worth noting that a straight planche is rated a 'C' and a maltese is rated a 'D'.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

Now I have not gone beyond straddle planche in terms of horizontal static holds but from what I understand is that people with strong crosses typically do better with Maltese because of this requirement

My experience is that most gymnasts tend to like Maltese as they worked it straight from cross. One of the guys in the gym I go to got first on rings in JO this year and has said the same. He said he can do both but planche is harder to stay steady.

Another friend has never been really strong in crosses and prefers planche.

Also funny side note. One of the gymnasts competed against Allan the first time they entered level 9 and said that they had an oh crap moment when they saw his pbar routine.

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Jon Douglas

Also funny side note. One of the gymnasts competed against Allen the first time they entered level 9 and said that they had an oh crap moment when they saw his pbar routine.

Was there a particular moment? Or the whole routine? :)

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Brian Li

I have both full planche and full maltese and the maltese is much harder for me. I achieved full planche before maltese. The planche is only harder to balance than maltese, but I have to use much more strength to get into and hold the maltese.

There are actually some gymnasts that find maltese easier than planche such as Gregor. I once heard that there was some gymnast who had a full maltese on rings, but not even straddle planche on floor. I'm pretty sure most people will find planche easier since it is a less disadvantaged position.

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Brian Li

Now I have not gone beyond straddle planche in terms of horizontal static holds but...

Didn't you say you held a 1-2 second full planche on PB before?

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Daniel Burnham

Didn't you say you held a 1-2 second full planche on PB before?

Yes, was refering to rings here.   ;)

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hype

Hmm okay, but when I reach the straddle planche, should I start working on maltese or should I go for the full planche before?

Cause I heard that the difference of difficulty between straddle and full planche is extremely high

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Daniel Burnham

Hmm okay, but when I reach the straddle planche, should I start working on maltese or should I go for the full planche before?

Cause I heard that the difference of difficulty between straddle and full planche is extremely high

Why don't you worry about that when you get there. Personally I think planche on floor and pbars comes first. Realistically there are several steps between straddle planche on rings and Maltese or full planche.

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Brian Li

Hmm okay, but when I reach the straddle planche, should I start working on maltese or should I go for the full planche before?

Cause I heard that the difference of difficulty between straddle and full planche is extremely high

Where are you at in your planche progression? You should have a solid and long straddle planche hold before working on full planche or maltese. I recommend to achieve full planche first before training for maltese unless you are part of the minority that find planches harder, then I remember Coach said to move on to maltese work. Make sure you train planche with hands backwards (when you can safely train it of course) to condition your elbows and biceps tendons for maltese (that alone would not be enough actually).

The difference in difficulty between straddle and full lay depends on how wide the straddle is. It can be really close to full lay if it's a very narrow straddle or it can be really far if it's a wide straddle.

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Brian Li

Yes, was refering to rings here.   ;)

Cool, how many seconds of straddle planche can you hold on rings and what was your max hold for it on floor and p-bars? Just wanted to see the disparity of hold duration of your straddle planche on rings and floor and bar counterparts.

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Carmen Schult

Where are you at in your planche progression? You should have a solid and long straddle planche hold before working on full planche or maltese. I recommend to achieve full planche first before training for maltese unless you are part of the minority that find planches harder, then I remember Coach said to move on to maltese work. Make sure you train planche with hands backwards (when you can safely train it of course) to condition your elbows and biceps tendons for maltese (that alone would not be enough actually).

The difference in difficulty between straddle and full lay depends on how wide the straddle is. It can be really close to full lay if it's a very narrow straddle or it can be really far if it's a wide straddle.

i remember him also saying to train iron crosses after straddle planche and before maltese?!

 

https://www.gymnasticbodies.com/forum/topic/13809-why-does-straight-arm-cause-biceps-hypertrophy/?p=135409

Edited by ajoOba

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Jon Douglas

i remember him also saying to train iron crosses after straddle planche and before maltese?!

 

https://www.gymnasticbodies.com/forum/topic/13809-why-does-straight-arm-cause-biceps-hypertrophy/?p=135409

Brian here is talking about maltese on floor as distinct from on rings :)

I don't think anyone would argue with cross/sPL before ring malt....

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Daniel Burnham

Cool, how many seconds of straddle planche can you hold on rings and what was your max hold for it on floor and p-bars? Just wanted to see the disparity of hold duration of your straddle planche on rings and floor and bar counterparts.

Post surgery I have not tried to hold straddle planche on rings and won't for several more months. Before I was able to hold 4-5 sec before loosing protraction. On floor I could hold straddle planche for about 10 seconds pretty consistently. Pbars was a few seconds longer.

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Brian Li

Brian here is talking about maltese on floor as distinct from on rings :)

I don't think anyone would argue with cross/sPL before ring malt....

Yes I was talking about floor maltese and floor planche, but I do recommend having iron cross before that too to build up the elbows. The only reason I didn't do iron crosses first is because I didn't have enough room for that in my ring setup and don't have access to a gymnastics facility. I remember Joshua Slocum say that the floor maltese is comparable to the rings maltese in terms of elbow stress. I spent a lot of time with hands back planche then gradually widened the distance of the hands until I became comfortable before moving to 2X shoulder width grip.

I've heard of people being able to hold a straddle floor maltese for much longer than straddle planche on floor so apparently this phenomenon appears in the floor counterpart too. There are also different types of malteses on rings too which can be easier for some people.

Disclaimer: I do not claim to be an expert. I'm just speaking from my personal experience and from what I heard from others too.

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Brian Li

Post surgery I have not tried to hold straddle planche on rings and won't for several more months. Before I was able to hold 4-5 sec before loosing protraction. On floor I could hold straddle planche for about 10 seconds pretty consistently. Pbars was a few seconds longer.

Nice! Good luck in your recovery. I have the same experience of being able to hold PB planche longer for at least a few seconds more than on floor. Never tried rings planche yet, but am not surprised that it's so much harder. I have heard of gymnasts being stronger in the rings counterpart than on floor and bars counterpart, but that should be only a very small minority.

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Daniel Burnham

Nice! Good luck in your recovery. I have the same experience of being able to hold PB planche longer for at least a few seconds more than on floor. Never tried rings planche yet, but am not surprised that it's so much harder. I have heard of gymnasts being stronger in the rings counterpart than on floor and bars counterpart, but that should be only a very small minority.

A guy in my old gym had a better straddle planche on rings than floor. He always fell on his face when he did floor. He and I both attributed it to just not practicing balancing from the hands as much. On rings pretty much everything gets transferred to the lean of the shoulder and the arms take a ton of force. Easy to see why coach uses it as an iron cross prep step.

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