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Brian Li

Straight arm planche push-up

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Brian Li

Hey guys, how is it possible to do a planche push-up with straight arms? I'm not talking about maltese push to planche on rings, but I've recently seen videos of people lowering from planche to a planche/maltese hybrid with straight arms (looks like a maltese with arms close to the side) and then push back up to a planche on parallel bars.

 

It also looks like they didn't elevate the scapulae much or at all when lowering down and their body lines although not perfect, but were pretty much straight and horizontal. I thought that lower position with the extreme lean is impossible without elevating the scapulae.

 

I tried to do it on paralletes, but can't really lower all the way to the planche/maltese hybrid due to the intense strain on my wrists. How hard do you think this is? Do you think this can be done on floor and rings too?

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEAnlIH71w0

0:28-0:32

 

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=683807358351001&set=vb.518312661567139&type=2&theater

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Guest

Saw that awhile ago as well. Extremely impressive, as well as his other videos of maltese press to planche.

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Chrono

I think its scapula elevation to depression with maybe bit retraction at the maltese

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Brian Li

I think its scapula elevation to depression with maybe bit retraction at the maltese

It could be. It does look they both elevate the scapulae a tiny bit (like 1 inch) when they lower and then depress a bit on the way back up. I wish they took off their shirts so we can better see the movement of their scapulae. That "maltese" might only be possible on the parallel bars. I wonder if some gymnasts do this exercise. 

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Chrono

It could be. It does look they both elevate the scapulae a tiny bit (like 1 inch) when they lower and then depress a bit on the way back up. I wish they took off their shirts so we can better see the movement of their scapulae. That "maltese" might only be possible on the parallel bars. I wonder if some gymnasts do this exercise. 

it looks like the lean stays the same.. so for sure scapula movement !

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Brian Li

it looks like the lean stays the same.. so for sure scapula movement !

If you look closely at the two videos (more clearer in the first video due to more ROM), you'll see their bodies actually move forward a little as they lower and move back a little when they push back up which means there is more lean in the lower positions.

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Chrono

If you look closely at the two videos (more clearer in the first video due to more ROM), you'll see their bodies actually move forward a little as they lower and move back a little when they push back up which means there is more lean in the lower positions.

Yeah.. so I really don't know

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ASNB

It looks like the lean changes.  This and the video of the pseudo Victorian can only be done on parallel bars because once your hands move beyond your center of gravity you need to compensate by pulling in the Victorian to prevent yourself from falling back and pushing the bars in the above so that you don't fall forward.  using the wrist in this way in a kind of wrist curl is going to make these much easier than floor or rings because the wrist is capable of moving great weights in this way.  I can easily move a 100lb dumbbell with the wrist in neutral position both ways.  Similar to planche progressions on the floor with fingers forward but offering even more control.

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Brian Li

It looks like the lean changes.  This and the video of the pseudo Victorian can only be done on parallel bars because once your hands move beyond your center of gravity you need to compensate by pulling in the Victorian to prevent yourself from falling back and pushing the bars in the above so that you don't fall forward.  using the wrist in this way in a kind of wrist curl is going to make these much easier than floor or rings because the wrist is capable of moving great weights in this way.  I can easily move a 100lb dumbbell with the wrist in neutral position both ways.  Similar to planche progressions on the floor with fingers forward but offering even more control.

Thanks for the explanation, but I still don't really know what you mean by pulling/pressing in the victorian/maltese here. Do you mean making a hammer grip wrist flexion action on the bars or something to do with the strong cantilever of the wrists giving more support? I've always suspected that this type of maltese is only possible on the parallel bars. What pseudo victorian were you also talking about?

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ASNB

Thanks for the explanation, but I still don't really know what you mean by pulling/pressing in the victorian/maltese here. Do you mean making a hammer grip wrist flexion action on the bars or something to do with the strong cantilever of the wrists giving more support? I've always suspected that this type of maltese is only possible on the parallel bars. What pseudo victorian were you also talking about?

Exactly.  I went back and checked and you actually made that post, you called it a Victorian cross hold, the quote for that is below.  I have also attached two pics below of an exercise sometimes called a forearm lever.  For the pseudo planche the same contraction in the first pic is used to prevent falling forward and in the second pic for the pseudo Victorian to keep from falling back. You would need very stable bars as an anchor. The other thing I noticed is that there seems to be contact between his lats and triceps on the way down and that would make it easier still.  

 

Coincidentally in applying this reasoning to the CTI, it seems the main limiting factor is the circular bar and the difficulty of creating a cantilever with our grip on such a bar.  A cantilever would be possible if using a bar with a rectangular cross section, or to better illustrate the point, two bars, one on the back of the hands and the other under the wrists.  And so it seems the stress on the upper body musculature( chest, shoulders, back) in the CTI is not very impressive.

 

Anyway, if one is able to planche then the floor maltese I think would be a better progression, or working towards a planche on the rings.  The stress would be completely on the biceps, shoulders and chest in addition to having to balance.  

 

Check out the hold at 1:11 in the following video. It's like a victorian, but with the arms close to the sides. It's done on PB with only the hands and possibly the wrists supported. I thought it would be impossible to do this without support on most of your arms and that it would require the COG to be past the hips which would require inhuman strength. Is it because he is torquing the hands like in a CTI?

 

 

 

exerci4.jpghammer_front_03.jpg

 

 
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Brian Li

Thanks for clearing things up. 

 

Anyway, if one is able to planche then the floor maltese I think would be a better progression, or working towards a planche on the rings.  The stress would be completely on the biceps, shoulders and chest in addition to having to balance.  

I agree, even though I can't do the straight arm planche push-up or that narrow PB maltese yet. My wrists are the main limiting factor in this case as I can only lower about halfway from the full planche on PB before my wrists can't take the stress. I can hold the normal maltese (wide arms) on paralletes and also the floor maltese, but only for a very short time on floor. I haven't trained on rings in a long time because I don't have a good place to hang them where I have sufficient space for the arms.

 

I still would like to be able to do this one day though, as it looks pretty cool and I think it's harder than a normal full planche push-up.

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Chrono

Thanks for clearing things up. 

 

I agree, even though I can't do the straight arm planche push-up or that narrow PB maltese yet. My wrists are the main limiting factor in this case as I can only lower about halfway from the full planche on PB before my wrists can't take the stress. I can hold the normal maltese (wide arms) on paralletes and also the floor maltese, but only for a very short time on floor. I haven't trained on rings in a long time because I don't have a good place to hang them where I have sufficient space for the arms.

 

I still would like to be able to do this one day though, as it looks pretty cool and I think it's harder than a normal full planche push-up.

 

when I look at those videos again.. they stay with pretty much not retracted scapula ... the lean changes pretty dramatically so I think when you lean in the planche above the natural shoulder lean your body lowers down and the scapula elevates naturally too ...

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Brian Li

when I look at those videos again.. they stay with pretty much not retracted scapula ... the lean changes pretty dramatically so I think when you lean in the planche above the natural shoulder lean your body lowers down and the scapula elevates naturally too ...

Yes, their scapulae elevate slightly in the lower position while the lean also increases.

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Michaël Van den Berg

Mods, wouldn't it be a good idea to make a 'street workout' sticky in the Community Forum, i.e. a single thread where everyone can dump their street workout videos? That would make it easier to ignore them ;)

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Mikkel Ravn

Mods, wouldn't it be a good idea to make a 'street workout' sticky in the Community Forum, i.e. a single thread where everyone can dump their street workout videos? That would make it easier to ignore them ;)

Wow, grumpiness level: Expert

I thought the straight arm press up was pretty awesome.

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Michaël Van den Berg

Don't take it too seriously, I like to 'poke' a little every now and then  :) I watch these vids like anyone else and every now and then I'm pretty impressed. It's just that I'm a little OCD and if it were up to me I'd make the forum even more structured than it already is...

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Brian Li

I don't want to open new thread for what im going to show you guys , so i'll put it here 

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=698720606859676&set=vb.518312661567139&type=2&theater

first move is sick

 

Cool, that's a very wide grip MU.

 

Mods, wouldn't it be a good idea to make a 'street workout' sticky in the Community Forum, i.e. a single thread where everyone can dump their street workout videos? That would make it easier to ignore them ;)

I want this thread to be about this one exercise only and not about street workout.

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ForzaCavaliere

I think he just retracted his scapulae, then added a bit of legitimate 'extra lean' at the end. Very impressive. 

 

 

Mods, wouldn't it be a good idea to make a 'street workout' sticky in the Community Forum, i.e. a single thread where everyone can dump their street workout videos? That would make it easier to ignore them ;)

This isn't even about SW D: It's just about a particular move which 'happened' to be performed by an SW athlete.

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ASNB
B1214N  Just thought, try it with some hardcore wrist-wraps.  I used them when i first started training planche bc my wrists needed some time to adapt.   The elevation of the scapula may be to drive the center of gravity towards the legs and compensate for the extreme lean.  This may also take some pressure off of the wrists.

 

 

 

 

 

That straight arm muscle up is badass.

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Brian Li

B1214N  Just thought, try it with some hardcore wrist-wraps.  I used them when i first started training planche bc my wrists needed some time to adapt.   The elevation of the scapula may be to drive the center of gravity towards the legs and compensate for the extreme lean.  This may also take some pressure off of the wrists.

 

 

Thanks, I will take that into consideration. My wrists can handle the PB full planche pretty well so for now I'm just going to stretch and condition them further by leaning more progressively until they can handle the narrow PB maltese.

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Christoph Pahl

Please excuse me to back-jack this hijacked  thread and make a comment on the starting videos: For a very simple physical reason this is possible with perfect body line only on rings (if  it is possible on rings at all). In the bottom position, his body is straight. His centre of mass is between his hands, else he would rotate. The width of the grips is adjusted in a way that this works out correctly in this position - for him!

 

When pushing up, the effective length of his arms (i.e. measured along his body axis) diminishes. This length is influenced by 2 angles, downward and sideways, say. So in the top position his centre of mass would be too far in direction of his feet: He simply *has* to pike to not rotate.

 

On rings, when lowering from planche to maltese, you inevitably have to widen your hands a bit to keep the effective length of your arms constant. Else you'd rotate. Is this done on the floor at all? Perhaps you can wander your hands a bit outwards, but certainly not inwards for pressing up.

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Brian Li

His pike was minor at the top so that can't be the reason he was leaning a lot less than in the bottom position.

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Brian Li

I just found a video of a maltese/swallow performed on the gymnastics parallel bar apparatus. I heard from Gregor that this skill used to be competed, but got banned due to rule changes of no strength elements on PB routines. I would like to hear Coach's opinion of this particular maltese on PB. I'm sure this takes much less strength than a wide arm maltese except for the wrists which would also need to be very flexible here. What value did this skill have back in the day?

 

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Coach Sommer

Nice video clip of a former US National Team member Jay Thornton.  :)

 

The swallow on parallel bars is very 'different' from a wide arm maltese performed on the floor.

 

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

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