Whats the heaviest person you've seen do a flag, planche, muscle up, etc?

[jetpack]

I'm just curious.  How tall, and how heavy, is the tallest heaviest person you guys have seen who can do a human flag?  And how about a planche, muscle up, complete full range of motion handstand pushup, or other challenging bodyweight exercises?

 

Main reason I wonder.  I'm a pretty tall and heavy guy. 

 

I'm 6' and weigh 230 pounds.  This is mostly muscle.  While I'm not totally ripped, my bodyfat isn't very high.  I have been training for these types of things for over 10 years, but cannot even come close to doing a flag, have a long ways to go for a planche, can only sometimes do a sloppy muscle up, can do the first half of a handstand pushup, but can't go all the way down and back up.

 

I do know that taller and heavier people like myself are at a disadvantage for these sorts of things, but after all these years I'm starting to wonder if I'm just attempting the impossible, or if there are indeed people out there my same height/weight or greater who can do these things?

 

In the past 10 years I've put on over 50 pounds of muscle, had a great increase in strength, yet my actual strength to bodyweight ratio seems like it stays the same, or possibly even declines.  I'm actually worse at the muscle up than I was 10 years ago, despite being way stronger.  Even though my primary  focus on bodyweight exercises, and functional strength.

 

[Connor Davies]

The heaviest guy I've heard of to do an iron flag was about 200 pounds.  I'd say you're about a hundred pounds heavier than the average gymnast (no offense) so things are going to be harder for you.  But then I think Naterman is around your weight, and I know he can do muscle ups, front levers ect...

[Joshua Naterman]

I'm your size exactly, maybe an inch or two taller. I have done flags (we call them side levers), wide muscle ups with virtually no lean, full BL and FL, full HSPU (could only do one), and quite a lot of other things. All of this has been witnessed in person by forum members and/or Coach Sommer (not sure who saw what, and not concerned with it either ), or is on videos in my Youtube channel.

 

Obviously I don't do those things now, because I am starting my training over from the beginning, but I CAN still do quite a bit of that.

 

There is always a disadvantage, in terms of relative strength, that comes with a larger frame and more body weight, say 6'1" tall and 226 lbs, which is me, compared to a 5'3" Chen Yibing.

 

What we fail to recognize is that there is also a difference of around 20 years of structured training, and that this is what matters the most.

 

"Bodyweight strength" and "Functional fitness" are kind of buzz words, without specific meaning. Even "Gymnastic Strength Training™" is somewhat ambiguous because not everyone does it the same way. You may have bad form, or be switching exercises too often, or simply not be following a series of progressive movements that are specifically designed to take you to your goals. This is why you have spent 10 years without accomplishing what are honestly not horribly advanced goals.

 

If you get on the GB Foundation program, you will achieve your goals. Everything in the program is evidence based, and the evidence is real, live human beings. Adults, nearly all of whom have no gymnastic experience as a child or adolescent. We know this works. The problem of not knowing what to do, or how to do it, is a thing of the past for our members. We don't just do random things that gymnasts do and call it "GST" or whatever, we follow proven progressions that take real, live adults from zero to hero. That is why we get results over and over and over again.

 

The choice that everyone faces now is a much simpler one... "Should I:

 

A) Keep trying different things from different youtube videos, and hope that eventually I learn how to achieve at least some of my goals before I'm 50-60?

 

or... should I:

 

B) Get started with the Foundation series, so that I can master FL, Straddle planche, Side levers (human flags), Manna, etc etc... over the next 3-6 years, and then move on to the NEXT level, and keep on blowing my "limits" out of the water."

 

 

It really is that simple.

[frolosophy]

LittleBeastM on youtube has some impressive stuff and he's 220lbs.

[Samuli Jyrkinen]

Alexey Voevoda is a Russian armwrestler who could/can do human flags, 1/3 ROM one arm chins etc. at 260+ lbs.

[Blairbob]

 Ben Claridad has done a flag. He is the coach at MidtownStrength. He's a 105+ now but used to compete as a 105. He might be CJing 180 now but he is damn close. He is close to 150/180 1rm's.
 
He might be a bit under 6 feet. I can't really remember well as I generally think he dwarfs me.

I saw him do one this last fall or this spring when his little brother was trying to do them. So between September to April sometime. There really wasn't a great place to do them in the gym so they often do them off a wall mounted pullup bar. One hand on the bar, one pushing against the wall. So of course, Dave and I tried them too.

 

 245lbs.

Maybe one of these days I'll ask him to try a Front Lever. His little brother can probably do one ( Chris is a 77kg).

 

This was Ben's attempt at FL stuff from a few months before that. Mind you, I was not there at the time and that is dated before his Flag attempts. I've seen him do Bar Muscle-ups before with ease and a small kip though there is a video where he does 7 or 8 with a kip on his youtube. I've seen him work HS but never HSPU I think.

 

 

[PatrickMeniru]

I'm 6"0 and weigh 90kg, and can do a reasonably good flag (SL), as well as slow MU with lean.  Getting close to FL but long, long way from PL.

[jetpack]

Thanks for all the replies so far.  Some of those videos were quite motivating.

 

I think I will try to check out that "GB Foundation program".  If anyone else knows any good plans for heavy people I'd like to hear them.  As well as if anyone knows any other guys who are around my weight and can do these things, and have youtube videos, I'd love to see them.  Thanks.

[Daniel Sarnowski]

Have you considered finding a partner and being the base in an acrobatic duo? There's a lot of huge guys in the circus and most of them have other people climbing on them, hanging from them, jumping off them, being hurled through the air by them, etc. Its a great option for a bigger guy interested in gymnastic/acro training. You still get to learn the moves and techniques, but working with a smaller partner opens up a lot of possibilities that aren't there when you're training solo. 

[PatrickMeniru]

Thanks for all the replies so far.  Some of those videos were quite motivating.

 

I think I will try to check out that "GB Foundation program".  If anyone else knows any good plans for heavy people I'd like to hear them.  As well as if anyone knows any other guys who are around my weight and can do these things, and have youtube videos, I'd love to see them.  Thanks.

The only thing you really need to do is follow the F1 programme, the training methods don't need to be different due to size IMO.  The one thing that I would suggest is being extra vigilant with your pre-hab and joint conditioning because as weight increases, so does the stress on joints.  I personally have had a lot of trouble with elbow tendonitis working towards a OAC because I didn't do enough prep and tried to progress too fast.  After a year of not being able to train properly I've managed to build back up to the strength level I was at with no elbow pain by taking things slowly.

Really can't overemphasise how important patience is.

[Joshua Naterman]

In my experience, while it is very important for everyone who wants to build GST to follow the Foundation program, it becomes even MORE important for big guys like me.

 

Just about anyone, of any size, can get hurt from pursuing GST without really good guidance, but big guys are especially vulnerable to this. If you follow the F1-4 program you will not get hurt, and you will build truly well-rounded gymnastic strength. You will shatter your limits, but you will have to be patient.

 

patience = consistence long term adherence

consistent effort over time = big, big results.

[Jaros?aw Ruszkowski]

It's good to read your words Josh, because I'm a big guy and I must temper my ego in each training  

[Joshua Naterman]

It's good to read your words Josh, because I'm a big guy and I must temper my ego in each training

 

I'm always glad to help others maintain perspective

I have to do the same Keep up the good work!

[FREDERIC DUPONT]

(...) I have to do the same Keep up the good work!

 

Who doesn't, really?

[Sinom]

Bodybuilder does planch:

 

Although form is not hollow feet pointing to the floor, its pretty impressive!

 

This guy is also quite heavy:

 

MU:

 

[Connor Davies]

I've seen that planche before.  That guy is freaking huge!

[Joshua Naterman]

That bodybuilder guy is apparently 5'3, 176 lbs.

Official IFBB stats from this competition are 80 kg at 162 cm.

His name is Igor Losev, and in 2007 he did a planche press to HS with the same form, stumbled at the top, and came back down.

 

He is NOT a super heavyweight.

[Sinom]

Still pretty awesome though! Compared to standard posing and flexing we are used to see from bodybuilders!

[Joshua Naterman]

Absolutely.

 

Just keep in mind that Chen Yibing is basically the same height at 130-ish lbs, for a fair height comparison.

[Connor Davies]

That bodybuilder guy is apparently 5'3, 176 lbs.

Official IFBB stats from this competition are 80 kg at 162 cm.

His name is Igor Losev, and in 2007 he did a planche press to HS with the same form, stumbled at the top, and came back down.

 

He is NOT a super heavyweight.

Whaaaaaat!? That's smaller than me

[Marios Roussos]

 

If you get on the GB Foundation program, you will achieve your goals. Everything in the program is evidence based, and the evidence is real, live human beings. Adults, nearly all of whom have no gymnastic experience as a child or adolescent. We know this works. The problem of not knowing what to do, or how to do it, is a thing of the past for our members. We don't just do random things that gymnasts do and call it "GST" or whatever, we follow proven progressions that take real, live adults from zero to hero. That is why we get results over and over and over again.

 

Josh, don't take this the wrong way as I have been working on F1 and H1 diligently for the past 14 and 10 weeks respectively, but is there actually any evidence out there? It's hard to use coach's athletes as evidence given the fact that they didn't just follow F1 and H1 to become the athletes they are. Even Daniel B's reported results can't be considered evidence of F1's efficacy since he spends a lot of extra time doing formal gymnastics training.

 

As far as I know (which isn't very far at all), there isn't anyone on here that has started the foundation series from scratch and achieved the level of performance or body composition of coach's athletes by following that program alone. I'm not disparaging the program, I personally follow it and love it, but I do so based on blind faith in Coach's experience rather than on any evidence (whether it be anecdotal or scientific).

 

Let me know if I am mistaken in my thinking; I would absolutely love to be shown some real examples of results following long-term use of the foundation program.

[FREDERIC DUPONT]

(...) is there actually any evidence out there? (...) I would absolutely love to be shown some real examples of results following long-term use of the foundation program.

 

Yes, you're it!

B)

[Daniel Burnham]

Josh, don't take this the wrong way as I have been working on F1 and H1 diligently for the past 14 and 10 weeks respectively, but is there actually any evidence out there? It's hard to use coach's athletes as evidence given the fact that they didn't just follow F1 and H1 to become the athletes they are. Even Daniel B's reported results can't be considered evidence of F1's efficacy since he spends a lot of extra time doing formal gymnastics training.

 

As far as I know (which isn't very far at all), there isn't anyone on here that has started the foundation series from scratch and achieved the level of performance or body composition of coach's athletes by following that program alone. I'm not disparaging the program, I personally follow it and love it, but I do so based on blind faith in Coach's experience rather than on any evidence (whether it be anecdotal or scientific).

 

Let me know if I am mistaken in my thinking; I would absolutely love to be shown some real examples of results following long-term use of the foundation program.

There aren't many people who have started the "foundation Series" from scratch per se, but the foundation series is a refinement on what coach has been teaching for years passed to us in an easy to understand manner.  There are people who have been working on coach's program from day one, including me who have achieved a lot.  Just take a look at the Success Stories.

 

I do train gymnastics nearly daily but that is a recent development (8 months now).  I was making great and steady progress before then after I started following some of the training laid out on here.  Almost all of my strength development comes from the F and H programs. I see way more carry over from them to my gymnastic skills than vice versa.

 

The Foundation series has only been available to the public for a little while now but people are already making huge improvements.  Even those who have done a lot of GST before are finding the F series to be very helpful.  I have not doubt that in a few years we will see a bunch of monsters around here due to the F series and their diligence in keeping up with it.  

[Joshua Slocum]

Josh, don't take this the wrong way as I have been working on F1 and H1 diligently for the past 14 and 10 weeks respectively, but is there actually any evidence out there? It's hard to use coach's athletes as evidence given the fact that they didn't just follow F1 and H1 to become the athletes they are. Even Daniel B's reported results can't be considered evidence of F1's efficacy since he spends a lot of extra time doing formal gymnastics training.

 

As far as I know (which isn't very far at all), there isn't anyone on here that has started the foundation series from scratch and achieved the level of performance or body composition of coach's athletes by following that program alone. I'm not disparaging the program, I personally follow it and love it, but I do so based on blind faith in Coach's experience rather than on any evidence (whether it be anecdotal or scientific).

 

Let me know if I am mistaken in my thinking; I would absolutely love to be shown some real examples of results following long-term use of the foundation program.

There's no rock-hard evidence that Foundation will make you look and perform like one of Coach's athletes. No adult has yet followed Foundation all the way through to the end. On the other hand, many people are pretty far along and have made tremendous gains in both performance and body composition. So there is solid evidence that Foundation is greatly beneficial to beginners.

[Daniel Burnham]

I would also like to mention that Coach's program is really the only one out there that provides any evidence at all.  Most books use fitness models or have to use illustrations because there isn't anyone they have trained who can actually do the things listed.  

Now there are some programs that have videos but their end goals are so low that many people here could already film them from F1 or F2 work. 

 

I run into people following programs trying to learn planche or similar from people who haven't even figured it out themselves.  A gym I went into the other day was using bent arm progressions for planche from a guy who hadn't had planche progress in over a year!!