Jump to content
Search In
  • More options...
Find results that contain...
Find results in...
juliusoh

Cardio

Recommended Posts

braindx

I would agree with that: feel better than when you started

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Joshua Naterman

Future: Sorry about that, it sounded like you were saying something else that didn't make sense! I just wanted to make sure we were clear on what was going on in a basic manner.

Brain: Thanks for the additions. Metabolism is complicated... I hate trying to remember all that stuff. :lol:

Yes, in the end just make sure when the cardio is done you feel as good or better than when you started the cardio session and you're good as far as recovery work goes.

The HR numbers I posted are more of a safe zone. Most people aren't capable of working at their calculated max heart rate for a given intensity level because of deconditioning, and those were just my personal observations of what tends to work. Well-conditioned people will definitely be able to do more, but I am not sure that would be a better option. I'm not sure it wouldn't, either. I have no idea, that would be pretty interesting to test.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Catalyst

Whats the better time for doing these 2-3 mile sessions? On a day with no gymnastic training? after training?

I'm thinking of doing tomorrow a WOD and after running 3.6 km. Did a 5km run a month ago after some ring work, felt good.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Larry Roseman
Future: Sorry about that, it sounded like you were saying something else that didn't make sense! I just wanted to make sure we were clear on what was going on in a basic manner.

Brain: Thanks for the additions. Metabolism is complicated... I hate trying to remember all that stuff. :lol:

Yes, in the end just make sure when the cardio is done you feel as good or better than when you started the cardio session and you're good as far as recovery work goes.

The HR numbers I posted are more of a safe zone. Most people aren't capable of working at their calculated max heart rate for a given intensity level because of deconditioning, and those were just my personal observations of what tends to work. Well-conditioned people will definitely be able to do more, but I am not sure that would be a better option. I'm not sure it wouldn't, either. I have no idea, that would be pretty interesting to test.

Slizz: No problemo. Also, sorry if I over-reacted :oops: . I've been kind of stressed lately with a number of minor family problems at once. This too shall pass (or I shall) :lol: .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
norbeex3

Hey there! This Cardio thread is a nice one, I have a question on my mind related to this.

I heard somewhere that HIIT can somewhat increase your HGH levels. I know that HGH (aka. STH) causes gorwth in your connective tissues tendons etc. also in your jaw and nose. It can also cause acromegaly if there is too much of it in your body. So my question goes like this:

1. If my HGH levels are raised due to HIIT(mainly) and heavy squatting and they are constantly high my nose and jaw will grow bigger?

I know it's a pretty stupid and childish question but I would like to have someone to give me an explanation about this process :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Joshua Naterman
Hey there! This Cardio thread is a nice one, I have a question on my mind related to this.

I heard somewhere that HIIT can somewhat increase your HGH levels. I know that HGH (aka. STH) causes gorwth in your connective tissues tendons etc. also in your jaw and nose. It can also cause acromegaly if there is too much of it in your body. So my question goes like this:

1. If my HGH levels are raised due to HIIT(mainly) and heavy squatting and they are constantly high my nose and jaw will grow bigger?

I know it's a pretty stupid and childish question but I would like to have someone to give me an explanation about this process :)

With lactate threshold training, HGH spikes are generally pretty local to the tissue that is being trained, at least from what I understand. That may not be the case. Also, even though there can be significant (300-400%) spikes in HGH levels if you're REALLY working the HIIT (or any other lactate threshold training) hard that pales in comparison to the levels that people take when going for performance enhancement. We're talking like 10,000% or more. It's insane. Even that takes a while to show the symptoms you are talking about, so you really don't have anything to worry about.

The spikes from training usually return to baseline in a few hours. That is my current understanding, anyways, based on what I have read.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
norbeex3

It's good hear. Our cartilages are growing till we die minimally as far as i know so i think it will not show any symptoms then.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cole Dano
The spikes from training usually return to baseline in a few hours. That is my current understanding, anyways, based on what I have read.

Yes the HGH is only in your system for a couple of hours, as i've understood it won't turn you into the elephant man, so don't worry there. I have read that it also supports organ growth and that the abdomen may grow due to this. But this is in cases of heavy L-Glutamine supplementation. From HITT you have nothing to worry about and in fact some thing the HGH effect is almost negligible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
norbeex3

Yeah, sometimes I forgot that nature is smarter then we think and it does not do harm to our bodies. As long as we stay natural in everything we can continue to grow in a healthy way. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cole Dano

Here is an old article on the subject. Though aimed at lifters applies just as well to BW.

John McCallum - The Case For Running

Vancouver is the third largest city in Canada. It’s nestled on the west coast about 25 miles north of the American border, with the blue Pacific on one side of it and snow capped mountains on the other. “Where else,” the natives say, “can you lie on the beach all morning and ski in the mountains half an hour later?”

The northern tip of the city consists of 1000 square acres of sylvan beauty. It’s called Stanley Park, and it draws people like a magnet. On a Sunday afternoon you can see everything from a busload of nuns feeding the monkeys to 300 hippies holding a love-in.

If you’re really lucky you might see, jogging along the 11 mile path that circles the park, a broad and bulky gentleman who is perhaps the best built, probably the best conditioned and certainly the most modest man of all time. His name is Maurice Jones. He stands about 5’8”, varies his weight at will between 205 and 235, and packs more pure muscle than any six people you’ll ever meet.

Maury, as he’s called, is a truly modest man. Getting his shirt off is like pulling teeth. Getting him in front of a camera is tougher than getting your old lady in front of a firing squad.

Maury is the finished product of sensible weight training. He’s a trained athlete in every sense of the term. His muscles are enormous, yet he carries himself with the grace and agility of a cat. He’s an all-around strongman, not a one lift specialist. He performs as well on a reverse curl as he does on a squat or a deadlift. He has superb health and unbelievable endurance. Someone once said that Maury can lift anything not nailed down. They should have added that he can also run up the side of a mountain with it.

Maury’s in his middle fifties now, but he has the health, the strength, and the physique of a 21 year old superman. He has reached and maintained this level of physical excellence through the wise use of heavy weight training, a sensible diet, and mile after countless mile of outdoor running.

Running plays a big part in Maury’s program. I asked him once if he thought so much running might hinder his bodybuilding progress.

“Not a bit,” he said. “It helps.”

Let me explain one thing first. This material is not for the beginner. It’s for the man who’s been training at least a year and has made a fair change in his level of bulk and power. It’s also for the man over forty regardless of his condition. If you’re in either of those groups, running could be the most important thing you’ll ever do.

To summarize, then:

If you’re a beginner, leave running alone for now. Carry on with basic bulk and power routines. If you’re an advanced trainee with some size, or if you’re over forty years old, work the following into your training. It’ll revolutionize the way you look and feel.

There’s an old saying that nothing is perfect. It’s true of most things and it’s true with weight training. Weights provide the quickest and best means to improve yourself physically. There’s no denying it. You can convert yourself from a scrawny bag of bones to an absolute superman by training sensibly with heavy weights. Weight training is so superior to every other form of exercise that comparisons become ridiculous. But weight training, good as it is, is not perfect and we might as well be honest and admit it.

Weight training, as most of us practice it, has three flaws. Generally speaking, and unless you work specifically for it, weight training

a.) doesn’t provide enough stimulation for your heart,

b.) doesn’t necessarily ensure crisp definition, and

c.) doesn’t, as a rule, build outstanding endurance.

While the plaster is still falling, I’ll explain what I mean by that.

a.) Weightlifting is not harmful to your heart. Quite the opposite, in fact. Heavy training strengthens your heart just as it strengthens all the other muscles in your body. Weightlifters have hearts far healthier than the general populace.

But standard weight training, while good for your heart, doesn’t provide quite enough stimulation. Your heart is best stimulated and strengthened by light exercise of a rhythmical nature carried on uninterrupted for at least half an hour. Exercise of that type provides the cardio-vascular stimulation necessary for really outstanding heart health.

b.) Weight training doesn’t usually build really sharp definition unless you train deliberately for it. You can, if you wish, alter your training routines and go all out for definition. If you work hard enough you’ll probably end up fairly well defined. The trouble is, you’ll also end up so weak and dragged out it’s debatable if it’s worth it. Physique contestants who have to train deliberately for definition are a pretty weary bunch by the time the contest rolls around.

c.) Weightlifters, as a group, have far more endurance than the average man. But, here again, weight training doesn’t generally build the kind of endurance you could and should have. Like definition, you can go on a program of very high reps and build endurance, but it usually wipes out your musclebuilding progress. Endurance is developed by very high reps. You can’t do both effectively in your weight workouts.

The solution to these three problems is to supplement your weight training with exercise of an extended, rhythmical nature. This will strengthen your heart, improve your health, sharpen your definition, and increase your endurance without you having to make any alterations in your weight training or do anything to hinder your bodybuilding and strength training progress.

The best supplementary exercise, far and away the best, is light progressive running. Running will work wonders for you. It’ll improve your physique tremendously. It’ll put the finishing touches to your appearance, giving you that polished look. It isn’t generally known, but most of the top lifters include some running in their training. Bob Gajda is an ardent runner, Bill Pearl runs quarter mile sprints and Reg Park is known for his sprinting ability. The American, Russian and European weightlifting teams all run as a part of their training.

I mentioned Maury Jones. Maury was, and still is, an avid runner. In his younger days he used to load barbell plates into a pack sack and run up the steep mountain trails around his home.

If you’ve never done any running, start gradually. Use a roughly measured distance of about a quarter mile. Run at a nice easy pace. Don’t try for any speed records yet. If you can’t make a quarter mile, then keep practicing till you can. As soon as you can run one full quarter mile without collapsing, start building it up as follows.

Run one nice easy quarter-mile. Now, without stopping, walk the next quarter and get your breath back. Don’t dawdle. Walk along at a good pace.

When you finish walking the quarter, immediately run the next one. Don’t rest between laps. Jog around easy for the full lap and then walk another one.

Alternate the laps, running one and walking one, without any rest in between. Keep moving from the time you start till you finish the workout.

Gradually build up the number of laps until you can do at least ten, five running and five walking, without stopping. When you can do that, you’re ready for the next advance.

Instead of running one lap, run a lap and a quarter for your first set. Then walk the remaining three-quarters of a lap to complete the circuit. Now drop back to the one lap running and one lap walking for the rest of the workout.

As soon as you can, do a lap and a quarter running and three-quarters of a lap walking for your second set, and then the third, then the fourth, and so on. When you can run a lap and a quarter for all your sets, do as follows:

Start running a lap and a half and walking a half lap for your first set. Then try it for your second set, then the third set and so on, until you’re running a lap and a half and walking half a lap for the whole workout.

For your next advance, build your running time to a lap and three quarters and reduce the walking to one-quarter lap.

Next, move it up to two full laps running and go back to a full lap walking. Then move it up as before. Two and one-quarter laps running and three-quarters of a lap walking, two and a half laps running and half a lap walking, and so on. Build it up to three laps running and carry on as before. Then go to four laps, five laps, and so on. Deep at it until you can eight laps, or about two miles, at a nice steady pace.

As you increase the running and decrease the walking time, you can gradually reduce the number of sets. When you reach eight full laps running you should be down to one set only. Run the eight laps, walk one to cool off, and that’s it for the day.

Run at least two, and preferably three, days per week. If you’re lifting three days a week, run on the alternate days. You can run anytime of the day, early morning or midnight if you prefer, it doesn’t really matter. The whole thing will take less than an hour and you’ll never spend time more wisely.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Cole Dano

Here is an excerpt from an interesting article on a scientific approach to combining endurance work with strength work.

Since AMPK is turned on by endurance exercise, this means that performing endurance exercise after or immediately before resistance exercise will decrease strength gains. For athletes, remembering two important points about diet and the timing of training sessions can help overcome this conundrum.

First, as mentioned above, eating carbohydrate quickly turns off AMPK. Second, mTORC1 levels have to be raised for a long time to promote muscle growth, whereas AMPK needs only a short period to have its effects. Taking these two facts into account, in the last decade we have learned that to maximise simultaneous increases in strength and endurance we need to:

Do our endurance exercise before our resistance exercise;

Between the bout of endurance and resistance exercise consume a source of carbohydrate (to turn off AMPK) and protein, which supplies amino acids (to help activate mTORC1);

Restrict the number of sets performed when weight training (too many sets will increase metabolic stress and activate AMPK);

Let your muscles grow while you sleep.

For the full article -

http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/strength-and-endurance-training-how-athletes-can-maximise-their-performance-42126

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Quick Start Test Smith

That looks very intriguing, Mr. Brady. The line, "Do our endurance exercise before our resistance exercise;" is particularly interesting, since I've always read (in Thomas Kurz's work) that heavy strength work should come before the endurance work. I'm interested in reading more about that!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Rafael David

I really don't believe in cardio. I think the Chinese run because they are strong and not the contrary... Coach say the Chinese are the strongest (fact) and they like run, so they are the strongest because they run? And the INSANE strength training they do?! To me this no make sense. I believe more in what Ido and Poliquin says, not because they are better than someone, but because what they say make more sense. No ofence Coach, i respect your opinion, just to make it clear.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Joshua Naterman

I would like to point something out. That article, and that quote in particular, emphasizes that carbohydrates " Quickly turn off AMPK."

If you are constantly consuming carbs, you're never going to suffer from AMPK-related strength gain problems unless you are completely off the ball on your training volume and intensity.

This suggests that if you just make sure you're consuming plenty of carbs during and after your endurance work that you will never have any problems.

There is something else going on here too: Your muscles have dealt with all of the contractile protein damage by 3 hours PWO. If you are eating right and wait at least 3 hours to do your endurance work, once again you will have NO problems.

With traditional training methods you will still probably perform better with endurance work first anyways, because your strength training is going to inhibit your muscular output due to the damage that is done, while the endurance work will not have that effect. You are simply not doing the same amount of damage and therefore will not experience the same amount of inhibition during strength work, both due to total damage and due to the fact that you didn't even USE the motor units most responsible for your strength efforts so they are completely undamaged.

The way I am doing things this is not a concern, but that information is not available yet. There are much simpler reasons than all this hormonal stuff to do what they are suggesting, and if your pre-, intra- and post workout nutrition is in line with what I recommend then you don't have to worry about that hormonal crap at all because you prevent most of it from ever occurring in the first place.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
quad6

i haven't read every single post on this thread but since I have a question on the topic, I'll post it here:

I work in a sedentary computer job and alongside my Bodyweight/Gymnastic workouts 3x a week, I've been going for short run - 20mins at night after work. A light pace but enough to work up a really good sweat and make me feel refreshed after.

I've been doing this 3-4 nights a week lately and it's great. I never ran before. However, as an icy winter comes and people start lighting there fires at night, it doesn't seem the healthiest thing to go and run in all that smog that's outside. I just don't get time during the day.

Swimming isn't an option because the closest pool is 40mins away and I get home late enough as it is.

I thought about maybe boxing or skipping, intervals of both, maybe with high rep push-ups since I can do that inside. If I keep the intensity low-moderate, would that be comparable to running and not impact my workouts too much?

I don't mind trading off some GtGB progress for overall fitness and the good feeling I get after doing some cardio after work.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Larry Roseman
i haven't read every single post on this thread but since I have a question on the topic, I'll post it here:

I work in a sedentary computer job and alongside my Bodyweight/Gymnastic workouts 3x a week, I've been going for short run - 20mins at night after work. A light pace but enough to work up a really good sweat and make me feel refreshed after.

I've been doing this 3-4 nights a week lately and it's great. I never ran before. However, as an icy winter comes and people start lighting there fires at night, it doesn't seem the healthiest thing to go and run in all that smog that's outside. I just don't get time during the day.

Swimming isn't an option because the closest pool is 40mins away and I get home late enough as it is.

I thought about maybe boxing or skipping, intervals of both, maybe with high rep push-ups since I can do that inside. If I keep the intensity low-moderate, would that be comparable to running and not impact my workouts too much?

I don't mind trading off some GtGB progress for overall fitness and the good feeling I get after doing some cardio after work.

I can take a stab ...

It is hard to replace running, to find something that has a similar effect. Can you perhaps find a used or trashed treadmill, elliptical or even stationary bike? Those seem to be the closest to me in terms of the aerobic aspect and mental effects.

I can add that smoke is different than smog. Smog depends on sunlight to form, whereas it's more a particulate issue with smoke. You could wear a disposable filter mask that covers your nose and mouth to cope with that, which also helps with the cold, moisturising the air. Obvoiusly if you are choking it's a sign to stop :) So you may still be able to run outside, if you are not concerned about slipping.

I've run in smog but certainly it's not ideal. I don't think that it's neccessarily unhealthy unless you are sick. But on days when air quality outside is bad, quite often it is also bad inside. So I'm not sure there is a way around it.

What do you think?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
quad6

Thanks, yeah I should say 'smoke', a sort of smog made out of smoke forms :) and you can smell it as soon as you venture outside here on winter nights. But a mask is perhaps something to try. I will see how it goes.

I suspect as you say, running isn't easily replaceable. I'm not inclined towards a stationary bike but maybe I could look for a cheap not-too-large treadmill or even... rowing machine?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Larry Roseman
Thanks, yeah I should say 'smoke', a sort of smog made out of smoke forms :) and you can smell it as soon as you venture outside here on winter nights. But a mask is perhaps something to try. I will see how it goes.

I suspect as you say, running isn't easily replaceable. I'm not inclined towards a stationary bike but maybe I could look for a cheap not-too-large treadmill or even... rowing machine?

The nose knows - no? :)

Rowing for me is more a pain than a pleasure. I can do 5K before contemplating suicide. It just doesn't seem to kick up the endorphins for me like running and elliptical do. I'm not a big fan of the bike either, and just use it if rehabing my calf as little is involved.

But in any case doing aerobics 3-4 times a week, even mixing in some skipping with shadow boxing or bag work shouldn't

hurt your progress.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
thematrixiam

I have no educational background in kinesiology. So I will not try to offer anything in terms of what will work for people or why it works.

But I know what I have done.

I have gained and lost excessive amounts of weight/fat/muscle in a short amount of time at least 4 times that I can count. I am starting my fifth.

The time that I was at my best I was working out 2 to 3 hours in the gym. One hour was devoted to Cardio. I started with solely full body cardio. Specifically Tae Bo Advanced (aerobic). When I got so that was super easy I added weights. I did simple exercises working one muscle group a day. Doing full body weight training in one week. I still maintained the hour of Taebo Cardio. After that got easy I moved to Arnold Schwarzenegger's 3 day full body work out. I still maintained my taebo cardio. Eventually I started switching up my cardio to do HITT on tread mill, cycle, and row machine. All while doing the 3 day full body cycle twice a week.

Most body builders I have talked to have said that that is completely crazy. That being said, it could very well have been. But I do know one thing. I changed my body drastically over one summer. I was lifting as much or more than the university football players were, at my peak.

So, does cardio stop gains. Quite possibly. But I'd say there was something working well for me, and it wasn't steroids (despite the fact that many people actually thought I did do them).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Joshua Naterman
I have no educational background in kinesiology. So I will not try to offer anything in terms of what will work for people or why it works.

But I know what I have done.

I have gained and lost excessive amounts of weight/fat/muscle in a short amount of time at least 4 times that I can count. I am starting my fifth.

The time that I was at my best I was working out 2 to 3 hours in the gym. One hour was devoted to Cardio. I started with solely full body cardio. Specifically Tae Bo Advanced (aerobic). When I got so that was super easy I added weights. I did simple exercises working one muscle group a day. Doing full body weight training in one week. I still maintained the hour of Taebo Cardio. After that got easy I moved to Arnold Schwarzenegger's 3 day full body work out. I still maintained my taebo cardio. Eventually I started switching up my cardio to do HITT on tread mill, cycle, and row machine. All while doing the 3 day full body cycle twice a week.

Most body builders I have talked to have said that that is completely crazy. That being said, it could very well have been. But I do know one thing. I changed my body drastically over one summer. I was lifting as much or more than the university football players were, at my peak.

So, does cardio stop gains. Quite possibly. But I'd say there was something working well for me, and it wasn't steroids (despite the fact that many people actually thought I did do them).

This sounds remarkably similar to what I did on the USS Fort McHenry. I just used the elliptical and in calm waters the treadmill for my 45-60 minute sessions and the ramp going up from the well deck along with the elliptical for HIIT, and I actually lifted more often than you did most of the time! I got steroid accusations too. I actually got tested 3 times in two weeks once, and that was when I was at my strongest. Obviously there were no steroids involved, just like you. WHat was your cardio schedule? I was doing 45-60 minute sessions once a day for 6 days a week and when I was doing HIIT I was doing every other day so 3 days one week 4 the next.

Bottom line: Until you're getting to seriously ridiculous strength or endurance limits you shouldn't run into problems with cardio and strength as long as you're eating enough, and HIIT is going to be even less of a problem than an hour of moderate cardio, which itself isn't going to be a problem.

It is fair to say that there will be some genotypes and perhaps phenotypes that have trouble with this much cardio and strength gains, but there are an awful lot of people that have done stuff like this and completely reshaped themselves in a hurry.

Matrixiam: Great work and thanks for sharing! It would be super cool if you post some before and after pics!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Nic Branson

Interesting thread. Cardio work has seemed to be quite varied from athlete to athlete. Always interested in personal experiences. Personally I do very very little, well at times close to no cardio or conditioning work. With the season up here I get the mountain bike out and after not riding through the long snowy winter with only some swings here and there I'll have a heart rate around 130 where the person I ride with is at 165 and fighting to keep up. Now if I add cardio to my routine it burns me out very very quick, even once a week I notice a recovery difference. As for body comp. Gaining weight is my hard part, losing weight or body fat I can change within a week with nutritional timing. Genetics can be a funny thing. One of my most enjoyable things is figuring out the quirks in my athletes. Once you can start narrowing in on their triggers and how their body adapts what you can do really opens up.

You people on surface ships. Subs lead to eating and push ups, pull ups, etc.

(now to go read this entire thread fully and see what I missed)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Joshua Naterman

HAHAHA! Yes, surface ships for the win!!! :P

I don't do hardly any cardio at all now, not that THAT is a great thing, but because of how clean my diet is I am just getting shredded. There's no other way to say it. Very little effort going in, other than clean eating which is easy because I have grown to love it, and tons of results coming out!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Nic Branson

Diet is how I control mine here as well. Not as clean as yours, partly a lack of good produce at times. I should add that lower intensity cardio doesn't phase me, but say working on my KB snatches 100+ in 5min or less does kill my recovery if I don't back off of high tension.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
thematrixiam

When I started my cardio was the Taebo advanced video which is roughly 60mins. It's silly to say I'm a guy and I do workout videos, but it's true. For those of you that don't know what Taebo is it's basic martial art moves put into a routine with varying difficulty and intensity. It also works the whole body fairly well.

I did that 6 days a week. Up until it was doing virtually nothing for me. I got to the point that it was just endurance training. By then I was already pretty ripped so I didn't mind dropping the Taebo and switching to something else.

That's when I started doing the HITT training after my regular work out. Depending on how intense my work out was I may have separated the cardio to another time. For example do cardio in the morning and weights in the evening, or visa versa. I find weights in the morning are better. It felt like I have more time to repair.

I did the HITT work 6 days a week as well. The amount all depended on how much energy I had and if I had other things I wanted to get done in the day. But typically it was 10 mins for each. tread, bike, row. Sometimes I would do elliptical because the treadmills always seemed to be full.

as for before or after.

I don't have a good before or after picture for the first time I worked out. I honestly didn't think about it.

I have a mid shot here. It's close to what I was at my peak.

abs.jpg

Here's a fun before and after

before. 2007 dec 31st

dec31st.jpg

mid june 12th 2008

jun12th.jpg

after Sept 12th 2008

2008muscle.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Joshua Naterman

Nice!

Did you do the comic book artwork?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now

×

Important Information

Please review our Privacy Policy at Privacy Policy before using the forums.