Fat Adaption Question

[Philip Chubb]

I have recently been trying to lower my carbs and switch to fat adaption. I am in the middle of doing it however, while researching it, the common belief seems to be that it would be more for ultraendurance athletes and not so much for power athletes. However, I see Ido is fat adapted and able to keep up a high volume of training as well as staying very powerful. I know part of this is recovery, but I wanted some other opinions on this. Is the research I have read just misleading or is there some sort of way to stay geared toward power workouts while being fat adapted?

[Nicholas Herreros]

I read a book about fat adaption called the Anabolic Solution by Dr. Mauro Di Pasquale. He also has a book called the Meatbolic Diet, one i haven't read. From what i learned is that you are supposed to increase your good fat intake & decrease your carb intake which would make your body switch from burning carbs as a fuel source to burning fats as a fuel source. You do need to make sure you are getting the proper amounts of protein for what you are trying to do, weather its body buliding or just maintaing and also keep a minimial amount of carbs in your diet to allow for proper protein distribution in your body. I dont remember off hand what the minimum requirements were but they are all written out in the books. I did try the diet myself for a month and did notice that my body fat was decreasing and i wasn't getting any weaker but, I got discouraged because it was recommended to eat lean red meats due to the larger quantities of "good fats'. I'm just not that big on red meat so i threw out the diet altogether. One thing that i noticed about Dr. Mauro Di Pasquale and didn't like, is that he has his own line of supplements that he seems to push but claims aren't needed to get results. Check it out and let us know how you're coming along.

[Razz]

I'm trying to sorta fat adapt but still keeping some carbs around my workout. It keeps me lean for sure and I've added almost 3kg muscle mass in the last 2 weeks even though I've consumed alcohol on weekends. Takes a shitload of food though.

[Animalonfire]

Call me simplistic, but I don't see any reason for fuel source affecting power. All you really loose out on is the ability to "refuel" mid WO, and your water intake is going to have to increase. The solution is a water bottle and a well placed meal (or just deal with some fasting).

Whatever you do, there is going to be someone who disagree's with it. In this case(fat adaption), I suggest that you shut up and get on with it just to be sure the unpleasantness doesn't affect your judgement of what's really best for you. Not that there isn't an argument against (see trianglechoke07's posts in nutrition).

I picked Dr Atkins new diet revolution as my introduction to LC read. As far as athletics go it was completely useless, so (as an athlete) don't even go there. You're probably going to have a much better time with Poliquin, Robb Wolf, Di pisquale, or Lauren Cordain (but that's only going on what I hear in the forums,because it usually takes me about a month to tackle a book). Page>page without browsing forums and google in between is a much easier way to gather info IMO.(and it brightens up bus journeys)

[Razz]

It should not affect anything under 8-10s duration but more than that and we're into glycolysis or lipolysis. The problem here is that glycolysis is a faster process than lipolysis and therefore something like a ring strength serie lasting 30s-1 minute may be drastically affected performance wise.

[Philip Chubb]

Haha I don't drink at all so the transition is not too bad. A bit of fatigue and a little brain fog that convinced me that taking the bus is sometimes a better option than driving. Besides that, it is bearable though not pleasant. My main concern is what Razz said. I want to know if my body will eventually learn to use fat at the same speed it did with carbs or am I shooting myself in the leg by adapting to fat. Does anyone know more about that specificly? My guess is that the body will become better at burning fat.

[Josh Schmitter]

I also just recently went fat adapted. Felt a little blah for a bit, but feel fine now. The one thing I was wondering is how fast do you go back to burning carbs if you fall off the fat wagon. It takes anywhere from a few days to weeks to go fat adapted depending on how many carbs you drop out, and the person...but if you say, hypothetically eat a lot of candy over the recent holiday . My question is do you switch back to burning carbs at the same rate as the fat adaption or faster. Haven't seen anything concerning that in my research...other than bodybuilding references that say when going low carb for extended periods, the weight tends to come back very quickly with only a small increase in carbs.

[Razz]

Well the bodybuilding concern is most likely because after a competition they'll go nuts and eat whatever is in sight, which in my opinion is ruining a great chance of using your insulin sensitivity when it's at its best for some serious lean gains... Oh well I never really understood bodybuilders for the most part

[Josh Schmitter]

right with ya on that one. I'm gonna do some reconnaissance on this to see what I can come up with.

[Nicholas Sortino]

You'll gain fat switching back to carbs from a high fat diet. I am pretty sure the change back to burning glucose primarily is pretty quick, but you'll still add some weight during that time. Happened to me for sure... almost 20lbs in a month. Hopefully this Christmas I can avoid the carb binging that I did last year that caused this. Cookies are just so damn good though...

[Razz]

Nick it's a cheat meal/day, not a cheat month Although I'm certainly gonna gain some alcohol related weight in december, no doubt.

[Nicholas Sortino]

Nick it's a cheat meal/day, not a cheat month Although I'm certainly gonna gain some alcohol related weight in december, no doubt.

Haha, it was more like a cheat day that turned into a week, that turned into a month, that turned into 8months... Finally just go back on track in august, but even now I still suck at staying on track on my diet... I just have a seriously terrible sugar addiction... I swear that stuff is worse than crack...

[Josh Schmitter]

I hear ya. I was good for a good while...like months, but then just binged out on Halloween candy for a few days. Now I'm back to feeling that blah, back to fat adaption feeling. So i'm leaning towards the switch back to burning carbs is a quick on as well. I also love the sweet stuff...chocolate mostly, but starting today I'm making a stand . I never buy the stuff, it's only when I'm out somewhere or it's around(doesn't help I watch an 11year old boy most days until his parents are home) I just need to bring it into the more serious realm in the brain to the 'no, it's really not ok' level.

[Razz]

I love chocolate but instead I bought some raw organic cacao powder. Now I have an excuse for myself not to buy chocolate. Yes I may end up eating a bit too much whipping cream mixed with chocolate, but better than all that sugar crap at least

[Guest]

I love chocolate as well and so does my girlfriend but we always buy the darkest variety available (86% is the highest at our local supermarket). Hardly any sugar in there. Still, we are slowly phasing it out (but we're not going to get rid of it altogether though).

[Philip Chubb]

I have read up on this topic a lot lately and I like the benefits from it. I don't think one day will take you out fat adaptation though. Some runners carb up before races to basically have two tanks of gas. However, carbing for weeks can switch you back. I doubt you lost your fat adaptation so much as your body doesn't like junk food anymore. After I took certain junk foods out, my body was not happy at all when I reintroduced them. Now I cut them all out and feel pretty good!

[Tarun Suri]

I have read up on this topic a lot lately and I like the benefits from it. I don't think one day will take you out fat adaptation though. Some runners carb up before races to basically have two tanks of gas. However, carbing for weeks can switch you back. I doubt you lost your fat adaptation so much as your body doesn't like junk food anymore. After I took certain junk foods out, my body was not happy at all when I reintroduced them. Now I cut them all out and feel pretty good!

Depends what you mean by fat adaption. If you mean being in the state of ketosis then 1 meal is enough to take you out of it. By that logic, the two tanks of gas thing shouldn't apply.

[Philip Chubb]

I don't mean ketosis. I mean the body adapting to using fat as a more primary source of energy as opposed to carbs.

[Tarun Suri]

Unless I completely misunderstood a major portion of Robb Wolf's podcasts, I do believe that being fat adapted means you are running on ketones for the most part.

Can anyone confirm or destroy this?

[Razz]

I believe to run on ketones you need to be about <30g carbs/day.. I'm 50-100 I believe but still consider myself low carb.

[Philip Chubb]

I don't believe you're wrong Random. I'm just refering to a further degree of it. There is ketosis and then there comes a point eventually where your body is much more effecient at it. That is the fat adaptation I want to get to.

[Philip Chubb]

Can anyone fat adapted please give some of their experience to this? Namely, how was your performance affected. Endurance sports typically have the best benefit but what about your anaerobic work? Have your sprint times increased or decreased ect ect? Everyone's experience would be highly appreciated.

[Neal Winkler]

Plenty of studies show that anaerobic performance is harmed by ketosis. Learn about the different energy systems and you'll understand why.

[Razz]

I'm eating mostly fat and probably about 100g carbs per day, keeps me lean and I have no problem performing well.

[Philip Chubb]

Thank you Razz. Are you fat adapted or carb adapted. Either way the low carbs don't seem to affect your performance.

Triangle, I know about the energy systems and I've read studies but it is hard to find one that was carried on long enough. Not many studys go on past a few weeks which doesn't seem to give fat adaptation a chance to really get working.