Where should I place my FSP work?

Yea. You do have tight hip flexors! I think that time logged is the single bggest factor there, but if you can find someone to perform some active release or similar massage on the hip flexors you may be able to speed things up, but more than anything else just slowly spending time learning to relax the hip flexors as you stretch them will help a lot. The time can't be replaced.

The primitive squat is good, but that won't address the hip flexor issues. I don't have time to get into that now, but I will work on that.

Know any good tricks to help with seated work? "Get up every 20 minutes" isn't practical for me...

While seated and keeping one leg on the ground try to raise the other leg up into the air(straight) and do little circles, eventually moving to bigger and bigger circles to take advantage of your range of motion. If you can't get your leg up its not really important, just struggle to raise that leg and you will work on all the muscles and flexibility that you need to. Do that for something like 20 seconds per leg as often as you want.

Lavastine said:

While seated and keeping one leg on the ground try to raise the other leg up into the air(straight) and do little circles, eventually moving to bigger and bigger circles to take advantage of your range of motion. If you can't get your leg up its not really important, just struggle to raise that leg and you will work on all the muscles and flexibility that you need to. Do that for something like 20 seconds per leg as often as you want.

Huh, it's actually pretty difficult to make circles like that. This should be helpful - thanks!

For your hip flexor flexibility, look up videos to stretch or release your psoas.

And as for seated work, I assume you mean decline in mobility due to constant sitting? Seach Kelly Starrett and his Executive Stretching videos.

Lack of hip flexor ROM is a major problem nowadays.

Its can also be allot more stubborn than hamstrings. In a way hamstrings are easy at least from a technical point of view.

The hip flexors are primarily the iliopsoas complex and the rectus femoris of the quadricep group. Technically the remaining muscles of the quadriceps aren't hip flexors, as they don't actually connect to the hip, rather they are knee extensors.

So if you have a hard time with the flexors, its an idea is to start with just the hip extension component, by working various lunges Warrior poses and rev planks. From there add the quads doing the fully flexed knee work lying on the floor.

The psoas it a really stubborn muscle, its so deep, its hard to really feel to even know you are hitting it.

When focusing on it try to get the sensation right at the groin.

Just a bump and an update here. I have "passed" the 3x60s requirements for the plank and reverse plank (I did sides too, for fun) and also dead hang and bar support (I used chairs and pushup handles, with bent knees for this).

I have not really played with the hollow and arch holds too much due to the back aggravation I felt earlier. I'm working on mobilizing my hips and pelvis and all that. In addition to slizzardman's pelvic thrust exercise, I've added supermans and glute bridges into my morning mobility work.

Interestingly enough, I've noticed some definite gains in "body knowledge" of that whole area. I'm now able to feel when my back bends vs my hips bending - I used to need a mirror. This makes my squats less deep, but that's a good thing

However, I think all this has kind of un-stuck my back from the rigid and stiff position it was in. I now find it difficult to sit for long periods of time. Is that expected, or am I doing something wrong?

That can be part of the transition to a healthier back. For one thing, we're not made to sit for long periods of time, but over the next month that should pass as you continue to work on your mobility. Even tuck hollow holds will benefit you, but you could also do that with the L-sit first progression, raising your knees a little above parallel by tucking your hips just as you do during the pelvic thrust. Even 10s a day will be great! Such short and relatively low-intensity stimulation of the core may be a good thing at this point, since harder work causes problems.

I was actually coming up the stairs with a bag of cat litter (25lbs) and the mail last night, fumbled for my keys and dropped the bag. When I jolted forward and snatched it before it took a (possibly explosive) tumble down the stairs, I nearly pulled something in my back. Likely the same sort of thing, I imagine - my back is loosening up but isn't as strong in this state as it is/was in the rigid state.

I'm still not completely sure I'm doing the hollow right. I used to do V-sits all the time as a static hold. The hollow position is really not too different, except for the tucked pelvis and the arms overhead, correct?

The hollow isn't much different from the shoulders to the hips. The big difference is that your torso is horizontal instead of at an angle and the middle and lower back will be the contact point on the ground.

I'm glad you didn't get hurt with the cat litter! Working the HeS RLL daily for one set will probably go a long way towards helping strengthen your now more mobile spine. It has to learn that it can be strong AND mobile, and that won't happen right away.

Slizz, my current train of thought is that a static hold of RLL (Press to HeS, pike or straddle) at 90 degrees or wherever I lose that flat back would be a great way to increase flexibility for pike and straddle. Can I ask your opinion on this?

Sorry to interrupt but I didn't want to make another planche thread (couldn't find help for my problem by searching the forum either). I'm still far away from a true planche (currently doing tuck in FSP) but it's pretty clear that my lower back strength is one of the big hindrances in achieving it. One of my other goals is to achieve the handstand press some day and I think my lower back strength is a problem in that too. I can rep for sets the headstand RLL but it doesn't seem to help in building the strength I need. Any ideas what exercises I should be doing? Maybe even something with weights?

Oh yeah, forgot to mention that I'm not yet able to do the wall HS RLL. I don't have enough shoulder strength nor flexibility. Those are other things I have to work on.

Bent arm wall HS straddle, then pike. You can adjust variances of bent arm of course or have your head on a higher mat than

slizzardman said:

The hollow isn't much different from the shoulders to the hips. The big difference is that your torso is horizontal instead of at an angle and the middle and lower back will be the contact point on the ground

So I am doing it right. I just did 3x40s of hollow hold and 3x35s of arch hold on a whim. I could have done more of the arch, I'm sure, but I did all three hollow holds first, which kind of wore the whole area out a bit.

I should have these two finished soon.

millhill said:

Sorry to interrupt but I didn't want to make another planche thread (couldn't find help for my problem by searching the forum either). I'm still far away from a true planche (currently doing tuck in FSP) but it's pretty clear that my lower back strength is one of the big hindrances in achieving it. One of my other goals is to achieve the handstand press some day and I think my lower back strength is a problem in that too. I can rep for sets the headstand RLL but it doesn't seem to help in building the strength I need. Any ideas what exercises I should be doing? Maybe even something with weights?

There is an entire lower back section in the book. You will find a complete guide to building up your lower back. I highly suggest that you start with the very first exercise and slowly build up from there, even if you find you can do some reps of other exercises. Leverage-based fitness is not like weightlifting... these exercises are not like different dumbbells. They all train important core elements that build upon each other, and skipping around will rob you of most of the benefit you could be receiving for your effort.

You can, and should, add weight to the HeS RLL when you are able to. When you're doing sets of 10 in pike with legs completely straight, from toes to the floor to full HeS and all the way back down, never bending the legs once, then you are going to benefit from a few extra lbs.

Thanks guys for the replys. I guess I'll just add some of the easier variations from the book and work up from there. Most of them I can do for many reps but maybe I can just add some weight to make them harder.

I think that for your particular difficulty, if it is in fact correctly diagnosed, that horizontal RLL are going to be your most important exercise for a while. However, try this: a palms up back lever. We train palms down for biceps tendon conditioning and preparing the shoulder joint for the specific stress of BL, but test yourself with the palms up version and see if you can extent to a straddle at least. If you can, then lower back is not your issue. If you can not, then you definitely need to work those RLL! Either way they will help, but that test will help you determine what is holding you back. If it isn't lower back, it is arms and shoulders. Many people THINK they don't have the lower back strength, but really their body is not allowing them to lift or straighten because the arms and/or shoulders can not handle the extra resistance safely. That is neuromuscular inhibition. You will have to strengthen the arms and shoulders to move past that one if it is the issue.

Ok, thanks Slizz for the answer. I'll try that, when I get to a bar. I think that my problem at the moment is both lower back and shoulder/arm strength. I'm not sure which one is weaker at the moment, though.

Updating my progress here. I've slipped behind in actually working on the FSPs, as I've been trying to work on pelvic/hip/lower-back mobility, and all that jazz, and have been working on hollow/arch static holds. It's funny - I can do 10+ standing ab wheel rollouts, but a 60s hollow hold is too much :S

Anyway, I retested on a whim and got 20s max tuck L-Sit and German Hang (probably could have gone more on the L-Sit and probably should have gone LESS on the hang)... so I did a few sets of 10s. I'll probably stick these two in while I'm working on the holds and mobility stuff. But it's nice to see this work have some actual use.

Anyway, I'll throw those two into my Tues/Thurs workouts. Once I get the arch/hollow holds, I'll retest my maxes for all 4

phrak said:

Updating my progress here. I've slipped behind in actually working on the FSPs, as I've been trying to work on pelvic/hip/lower-back mobility, and all that jazz, and have been working on hollow/arch static holds. It's funny - I can do 10+ standing ab wheel rollouts, but a 60s hollow hold is too much :S

Anyway, I retested on a whim and got 20s max tuck L-Sit and German Hang (probably could have gone more on the L-Sit and probably should have gone LESS on the hang)... so I did a few sets of 10s. I'll probably stick these two in while I'm working on the holds and mobility stuff. But it's nice to see this work have some actual use.

Anyway, I'll throw those two into my Tues/Thurs workouts. Once I get the arch/hollow holds, I'll retest my maxes for all 4

That does seem crazy to me. I find a 60s hollow easy but I cannot do a single standing ab wheel rollout.

The bottom of a an wheel roll out is a harder hollow position if done correctly. How long can you stay at the bottom of a roll out?

Lavastine said:

The bottom of a an wheel roll out is a harder hollow position if done correctly. How long can you stay at the bottom of a roll out?

Oh, I don't hold it very long, just enough to have an adequate pause. If I hold it too long, things typically start cramping :S Maybe I should work on a hold at the end

I'm also fairly certain I'm not at max ROM (maybe 3-4 inches short).