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Kiyoshi

Planche assistance

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Patrick Patterson

Thanks slizzardman, as always.

Yeah, I meant Adv l-sit in that last section, not Adv tuck, sorry!

Cool, I think you've answered pretty much all my questions, there. Makes sense to have the adv frog be in the warm up but the normal tuck to be later.

Still, I was just curious about floor vs. pu-bar L-sit, since coach made a point of saying 30x3 FLOOR l-sit. Maybe just to differentiate between l-sit on rings and a non-ring l-sit (either on pb or floor or whatever)... or specifically (since atleast for me) because the floor l-sit is/seems harder than the p-bar one... or perhaps for some other reason? If it is important that it's on the floor, then I guess it seems I should be doing all the work there and not on the pu-bars. I don't have a problem with clearance or anything... it just seems that when my hands are wrapped around the bars it's easier, but when they are flat on the ground, everything is so much harder. You're right, it was great on the wrists in the begining (not an issue for me now, though).

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Kiyoshi

I have another question regarding Planche progress

How effective are holding static wall holds of lets say full or straddle planche in developing strength?

And I'm patient but I plan on at least getting Straddle planche in 6 months. Theres a video of someone else who it only took 16 days for him to get from a straddle planche to a full planche.

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Razz

16 days maybe if he already had 10s straddle planche..

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Joshua Naterman

People will do what they do hahaha! You never hear about the elbow pain afterwards when they keep working beyond their ability.

Kiyoshi, it might help but there is a lot of potential for injury. You are trying to find a way to make your tendons adapt faster, but they are limited by your metabolism and not by your choice of exercises, because you're already working your tendons ard. This is the case for everyone on earth. There is no short cut. Some of us adapt very quickly for a variety

For the kinetic strength training, if you can do wall planche push ups then you should do them! Just remember to pay special attention to your elbows and how they feel. If you feel any strain in the inner elbow, don't do them. Realistically, because you are not in a straight arm position except at the very top, which you may want to avoid for a while until you are sure your tendons will be ok, you will probably be fine doing those if you are strong enough.

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Kiyoshi

Which exercises help assist planche progress the most?

I know back levers are supposed to "tremendously" help your planche. How much do back levers really help your planche?

I can do a good tuck planche for over 20s and a flat tuck back lever for about 10 sec . If I was able to get a 10 sec full back lever , how much would that help my planche progress?

Is PPP the best exercise for planche progress?

Note, I do my static holds on my knuckles. It hurts to do them on wrists, should I retrain only using wrists or it acceptable to use knuckles?

My goal is to get a full planche this year, and the latest in a year.

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Gregor

It has been alot of written for a planche work, just look for it....

wrists hurts because you didn't do any prep work for it, you are going to quick and injury will come quick.

Planche: probably not in this year...

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Kiyoshi

Can you tell me aout the back lever and how much it helps the planche?

also why I cant get in the next 6 months, since I'm already at a solid tuck planche.

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Gregor
also why I cant get in the next 6 months

how can you do ful planche on a nuckles???

Back lever helps to some point, I can't say how much it will help you since I don't know how strong is your core body...Also back lever itself wont bring you a planche, most common problem is not back strength but shoulder and arm strength but back lever is must to do step forward.

Again I wrote (also others) many post about planche, search for it!

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Kiyoshi

Its easier to do on my knuckles

does back lever help with going from tuck to flat tuck , since it involves back strength

I cant search planche, I have tried but the search thing wont let me search it I gotta search like 3 words at once.

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Blairbob

yes, the difference between rounded and straight back work is important

if you can do a straight body back lever it means your lower back is strong enough to do a straight body planche. however, you still have to gain and train the upper body strength for it.

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Kiyoshi
yes, the difference between rounded and straight back work is important

if you can do a straight body back lever it means your lower back is strong enough to do a straight body planche. however, you still have to gain and train the upper body strength for it.

I see , thats what I though would happen.

so how would i start the transition from tuck to flat tuck, everytime I try pull my legs out I do a weird swing up and then down.

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Blairbob

it would be easier to press to the flat tuck from an inverted pike/basket position

you could get into the position from inverted hang and just try lowering, this is harder but it makes sure you start in the correct position which isnt always the case if u try to press into it from a basket

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Kiyoshi
it would be easier to press to the flat tuck from an inverted pike/basket position

you could get into the position from inverted hang and just try lowering, this is harder but it makes sure you start in the correct position which isnt always the case if u try to press into it from a basket

sorry for confusing you, are you talking about BL I meant from tuck planche to flat tuck planche. When im in a tuck and I try to bring my legs out I swing up and then down. How can I work on the transition of tuck to flat tuck planche? cause I cant even get into a good flat tuck to begin with. I can hold a tuck planche over 30s

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Blairbob

How strong is your L-sit? Some people would recommend building your tuck planche till 60s in one repetition.

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Kiyoshi

Its only about 15-20sec but I have started working on that now so it should get better.

yeah I can hold a tuck planche for about 30sec. But I just wanted to start working on getting ready to do the flat tuck planche by knowing how I get into it. Also how would I know when I'm getting better at tuck planche or when Im at 60sec ? cause I do like 3 sets of 20 sec. So I never can tell if Im getting better or by how much. do I increase it to 2 sets of 30 sec? I will just find out i guess

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Blairbob

Your advanced tuck planche attempts will be limited by your L-sit strength.

Kiyoshi, simply test your max tuck planche. Just don't let your form degredate when you're testing it.

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Kiyoshi

I didnt know that L-sit had an impact over planche like that wow

I will keep practicing my L-sit more and more. How good of an L-sit should one have to move on to advanced tuck planche ?

You think I can get a straddle planche in the next few months? I practice everyday and my good form tuck planche is around 30sec. Is a 60sec tuck planche likely for me in the next few months using coaches style of working a total of 60 sec a day?

also I was wondering if my planche progress would double if I train it for 2 min a day instead of one so a total of 120 sec a day.

or I wouldnt get maximum benefit?

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Blairbob

Well, it sort of depends. If your max is 30s and you are using 15s work sets, I could see where more than 60s of total volume could be workable.

Everyone should try to get their L-sit to 1m.

Straddle planche will probably not come in the next few months, well maybe a one shot wonder at best.

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Kiyoshi

When I do L-sit , its harder on my legs than on my arms. I feel cramping in my quads, and they start shaking. I dont know what that is all about. Same for whenever I try straddle-L . It hurts so I stop. How do I prevent this from happening?

How long does it take to get a 15 sec L-sit to 60sec if I train it everyday for total of 60sec?

Same question for my tuck planche, it seems like it will be a long time for me to get a 30 sec tuck to a 60 sec. I am prepared to do whatever it takes to get it though. But, I want to make sure I'm using my time as effectively as possible.

So for Planche specific training , I do a total of 120sec. Usually 3x20 sec , and one more time. And I do elevated PPP 3x10. Every day.

I'm still having trouble going from tuck to adv tuck , is it only a lower back strength issue? I am working back lever and archups for that .

How long would it usually take to add 10 sec to a static hold if trained every day? Let me know if theres any other way to improve progress faster.

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Blairbob

The quad cramping gets better over time.

I do a total of 120sec. Usually 3x20 sec , and one more time.
3x20=60+20=80 or 1.33m not 2m.

How long would it usually take to add 10 sec to a static hold if trained every day? Let me know if theres any other way to improve progress faster.
There is an old story about a young man aspiring to master the sword from Japan. Every time he told the master he would train more and more, longer and harder; the master would tell him it would take him longer to master the sword.

Coach told us this at the seminar and repeated it a lot. Be happy where you are and allow it to take time. Quick routes sometimes leads you to injury. It's like the dark side.

Some people could train every day, it really varies per individual.

I really have no idea how long it will take to turn a 15s L-sit into 60s. I started training L-sits roughly 17 years ago and don't remember exactly other than our sensei said do them and we would. This pretty much continued for a few years and they were pretty simple by the time I picked up gymnastics in college around 22 though I didn't really work them for about 5 years. I don't remember how long I could do them when I started gym nor how long I could do them 6 years ago. At my best 1-2m and it's varied since then.

How many dips or headstand pushups can you do? This will give us an idea of how much upper body strength you have.

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Kiyoshi
The quad cramping gets better over time.

I do a total of 120sec. Usually 3x20 sec , and one more time.
3x20=60+20=80 or 1.33m not 2m.

How long would it usually take to add 10 sec to a static hold if trained every day? Let me know if theres any other way to improve progress faster.
There is an old story about a young man aspiring to master the sword from Japan. Every time he told the master he would train more and more, longer and harder; the master would tell him it would take him longer to master the sword.

Coach told us this at the seminar and repeated it a lot. Be happy where you are and allow it to take time. Quick routes sometimes leads you to injury. It's like the dark side.

Some people could train every day, it really varies per individual.

I really have no idea how long it will take to turn a 15s L-sit into 60s. I started training L-sits roughly 17 years ago and don't remember exactly other than our sensei said do them and we would. This pretty much continued for a few years and they were pretty simple by the time I picked up gymnastics in college around 22 though I didn't really work them for about 5 years. I don't remember how long I could do them when I started gym nor how long I could do them 6 years ago. At my best 1-2m and it's varied since then.

How many dips or headstand pushups can you do? This will give us an idea of how much upper body strength you have.

I meant that I would do 3x20 twice. so its 120 sec total .

I know of that story, but I just want to make the most out of my time whether it be slow or fast.

I have progressed fast on my tuck planche though, I could only do about 2 sec tuck planche and in about a month I was able to do about 20 sec. I dont know why, but I was training it more often that month.

I have really good dipping strength, I would say its my best strength. I was able to do 15 bulgarian dips on the rings on my first try. Which are said to be the hardest in the btgb book .

I really need to work on headstand pushups, i want to do handstand pushups but havent gotten to them. I plan on working on them soon. I was able to do 10 +45 lb pushups with my feet piked on my dresser on my first try . Its like the 2nd progression in the book to handstand pushups. Does the balance of handstands just come to you one day or do you start noticing you getting better?

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Blairbob

the reason your tuck planche went up so fast was merely you were strong enough to begin with

all things considered, it looks you need to train more in the L-sit and BL as that seems to be your weak point if it is true you can do 15 bulgarian dips. L-sit work, skin the cats, BL, DL.

handstand work merely takes time and effort for the most part.

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Alexander Moreen

I agree with blairbob for the most part, however since you do so much planche training at tuck I wouldn't be surprised if you were trying to extend to advanced tuck without any additional forward lean. I would take out the ppp and add in planche leans instead to teach you to lean farther forward.

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Kiyoshi
the reason your tuck planche went up so fast was merely you were strong enough to begin with

all things considered, it looks you need to train more in the L-sit and BL as that seems to be your weak point if it is true you can do 15 bulgarian dips. L-sit work, skin the cats, BL, DL.

handstand work merely takes time and effort for the most part.

I see, I will practice L-sit more. My BL is pretty strong I can actually do a half lay BL for 10 sec.

What is DL and skin the cat?

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Kiyoshi
I agree with blairbob for the most part, however since you do so much planche training at tuck I wouldn't be surprised if you were trying to extend to advanced tuck without any additional forward lean. I would take out the ppp and add in planche leans instead to teach you to lean farther forward.

oh I havent been doing much forward lean , I just try pulling my legs back. Which causes me to swing and fall.

I'll give it a try with forward lean.

I see, so no PPP anymore? Are Planche leans more useful? I tryed them before but can hold them for only like 1 sec. How long should one be able to hold a planche lean to get the most out of them or for max use.

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