Integrating GST Foundations with StrongLifts 5x5

[claws]

I've been a GST forum lurker since coach's very first book. But its always been an on-off business as far as following GST is concerned. Motivation is my big problem. I do it for one or two months and I stop doing. I don't have any friends who does GST. I have friends who do bodybuilding, strength training, olympic lifting. I tend to perform well and stick to schedule better when I'm with friends.

 

I convinced some of my friends who follow StrongLifts 5x5 and have no plans of abandoning it to add some GST Foundations to the current workout schedule. Our schedule is standard StrongLifts 5x5 schedule, 3 days a week, linear progression of 2.5kgs, switching between A/B/A and B/A/B workouts alternate week.

 

Workout A: Squat, Bench Press, Barbell Row

Workout B: Squat, Overhead Press, Deadlift,

 

Kindly can someone guide us how to integration GST Foundations into this?

[Doug Grainger]

Doing 2 beginner strength routines at the same time generally leads to stalled progress in both.

5/3/1 with foundation as accessory work would probably be ok for advancement in both, but would likely still be slower progress than picking one modality and seeing it through.

[claws]

Doing 2 beginner strength routines at the same time generally leads to stalled progress in both.

5/3/1 with foundation as accessory work would probably be ok for advancement in both, but would likely still be slower progress than picking one modality and seeing it through.

I understand. But if not the entire Foundation series, aren't there any elements (exercises) of Foundation series which don't directly conflict with the schedule of StrongLifts 5x5 and could be integrated?

Edited October 10, 2015 by claws

[Jesse Kim]

Like Vinca said, if you are a total beginner at working out, doing two beginner programs might not be a smart idea. It might work, if you're not a total noob, but even then, smart planning is required. The foundation series/handstand series covers a lot of areas in the body, including lower body. For the stronglifts, I believe the program includes: squat, deadlift, overhead press, bent over row, barbell row, bench press, pull up and dip. Again, a whole body program, but mainly with weights. Here is what I would recommend:

 

1) With the exception of the pull up and dip, I would take out all the weighted upper body stuff. The reason being is that if you have F1 and H1, you would be doing a lot of upper body training, and adding stuff outside of the program can be detrimental to progress. Pull ups and dips along with their respective variations are in the foundation series, and their are body weight exercises that cover the presses and rows. You shouldn't add weights, but if you want to, tread lightly. 

 

2) IMHO, lower body weighted work with upper body calisthenics is a very potent combination. But the squat and deadlift, especially the deadlift, are technical compound movements that have to respected. Unless you can't do a single leg squat or even a body weight squat, and have any major problems on your lower back/posterior chain, you can include them in the Foundation series, but do them on days you're doing lower body work. If you do have problems, master the body weight variations first then try adding the weighted squats and dead lifts. FYI, for body weight variations of the dead lift, there is something called the single leg body weight dead lift, which as the name implies, you're using only your body weight and try to touch your opposite arm with your opposite leg. Youtube can provide information. 

 

Once you get into a certain level of proficiency, I think maybe you can add some weighted work, MAYBE, but you would have to ask the experienced users in this site because they would know more than I do. In fact, Coach Sommer knows best. Weights are useful for stretching, but for strength training along with GST, you have to ask. I hope this helps. If not, excuse me for the post

[Jon Douglas]

I understand. But if not the entire Foundation series, aren't there any elements (exercises) of Foundation series which don't directly conflict with the schedule of StrongLifts 5x5 and could be integrated?

Yes, there are, especially in the integrated mobility progressions.

[Domenic Palazzolo]

Claws, I come from a Oly / Crossfit / Yoga backround.  To be honest, I struggled and tried many ways to mix in GST with lifting etc.  But after much frustration and failure, I finally came to the conclusion that Gymnastic Strength takes so much more energy and focus between Foundational + Handstands + Rings and the most important, Mobility, that I couldn't lift or progress with either at the same time.  I can lift 5.25 pounds per bodyweight as far as weights are concerned, but when it comes to Gymnastics it's a whole new world my friend, trust me..

Regardless, I wish I had a better answer for you but I just wanted to let you know what I struggled with for quite some time..

I still miss the weights but I think my tendons + connective tissue are going to thank me later..

Good Luck..

[Coach Sommer]

First things first.

 

Beginners need to master their bodyweight while simultaneously correcting often severe mobility deficits.

 

Intermediates and above may integrate weight training into their workouts.  As you are already know, you are a beginner and as such do not yet need to worry about how to integrate weights into your training.  

 

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

[Jesse Frigo]

I did SL for a while before starting GST.  Had a lot of success with it, learned a lot about lifting and my capabilities and such.

 

A few thoughts:

-GST is much better for learning to brace properly.  I hurt myself deadlifting/squatting a few times because I wasn't bracing properly.  It is probably linked to my plateaus as well.

 

-GST is much better for mobility.  I got stiff doing SL, and didn't know how to fix it.

 

-GST finds and addresses more imbalances and weaknesses.  My right side has done a lot of compensating for the left.  GST doesn't allow that to the same extent.  My left shoulder is stronger than it ever has been due to handstand and rope climb progressions.  There was never any injury there, just weakness.  I never even really noticed an imbalance with SL.  OHP and Pendlay rows never did what handstands and hinge/incline rows have done for my shoulder.  Newbies to SL are discouraged from doing additional work to find and fix issues like this, and are told that lifting more weight will fix it eventually.

 

-While SL teaches humility by starting with the bar, it is nothing like the degree of humility and patience forced upon you by GST.

 

-Carry over from GST to lifting is much greater than lifting to GST.  My OHP has gotten better from handstand work, but handstands have not improved from OHP.

 

-Stronglifts gets mentally exhausting (though this may have been because I did it for too long).  Squatting heavy 3 days a week is very hard to maintain.  The workouts keep getting longer and longer.  I feel mentally good and physically only tired after GST- never that half-broken exhaustion like heavy squats or deadlifts would do to me.

 

GST is humbling and slow.  It is a complicated program- changing exercises and rep ranges from week to week makes it hard to keep track and plan the workouts, as compared to a weight lifting program with an app that tells you everything you are doing.  The exercises appear deceptively easy to execute.  It can take months to progress on these apparently-easy exercises, which gets very frustrating sometimes.  SL has a very simple program, visibly obvious progress, and pretty good explanations of the movements.  However, SL skips mobility work, doesn't address weaknesses and imbalances that hold you back and does a lesser job of teaching excellent form.  Stronglifts will lay down a pretty solid slab for you to build your house on, while GST digs the foundation* for a castle.

 

*I swear I didn't mean to do that, but I see what I did there.