Finally conquered Swivel Hip

Been working on this ever since I started Foundation (got Foundation around June, only seriously started working on it September?)

Some helpful tips to those who are still struggling with Swivel Hips:

1. This is a hip exercise (hip internal/external rotation).  You should feel it in your hips rather than on your knees.  Putting too much pressure on the knees isn't good for your ligaments.

2. If you feel it in your knees, either you're performing exercise incorrectly or you need more work on your knee.  At least have the SLS progressions mastered past SLS/PE3.  The strength elements helps your hip adductors (especially your gracilis) which benefits this exercise and the integrated mobility helps the knee internal/external rotation.

3. Stretching the piriformis will be very helpful in the hip internal rotation aspect (or even hip external rotation).  Trigger points could also be present in piriformis, it's even possible for the trigger points to have referred pain in the knees.

4. When massaging piriformis, common mistakes is to massage it in the middle of the butt, to properly massage it, you should be doing it more laterally (rather than medially).  If massaging by yourself, I find lacrosse ball to be the deepest.

5. If piriformis doesn't help, go after the hip internal rotators (TFL, gluteus medius, gluteus minimus).  Massage the gluteus medius and gluteus minimus.  Stretch/massage the TFL.

6. Posture actually pays a big part in Swivel Hips.  Believe it or not, this was actually the one that caused the biggest increase in range of motion.  Your back should be arched.  The lumbar spine shouldn't be rounded in this exercise.

For those thinking of skipping this exercise:

A major sticking point in Swivel Hips is the lack of hip internal rotation.  Gluteus medius is one of the muscles responsible for hip internal rotation.  Swivel Hips helps to ensure you have the required mobility (such as gluteus medius) before moving on.  From sPL/PE2>iM and onwards, it's all about building strength in the gluteus medius muscle in the mobility you build up in Swivel Hips.

Gluteus medius is a frontal plane muscle so it is responsible for stabilizing the hips (especially in single leg stance) and side-to-side movement (eg. abduction).  It helps in all straddle positions because in a straddle position the hip is abducted.

Thanks for a great post and congratulations to mastering it!

Thanks and congrats!!

gospel!

never thought to arch my back on this, always figured it was hollow. i hope i have this mastered when I try it. #ohplease

I'm not going to lie- I'm one of the people that skipped ahead without having perfect form here. I still work it all the time but progress is either very slight or non-existent. I'll be purchasing a lacrosse ball today and try some of the myofascial movements you described.

Thanks for taking the time to write this post! Lot of people can benefit from it, including me

I was also thinking to get a lacrosse ball soon, and then find some good resources for those self release techniques.

I've spend a lot of Time na PE1 and iM. And I've loved every minute spend na both exercises. I'm still doing it as a warm up form sPL elements. And swivel hips are great addition during hip stretches. Thanks to sPL PE1 I've easily progressed to one arm plank and I'm very close to mastery on that element.

Swivel hips looked a lot better with my back arched but I noticed that my internally rotated leg would make my glute float upwards a bit. gonna do a mobility sesh and report back.

Keilani,

In the course video that gymnast does appear to allow his glutes to "float" a little.  There is definitely a visible "hip raise" with the internal rotation.

Is this not correct?

i'd say yes only if my form was confirmed to be favorable, which i'll film for today or tomorrow and post it.

i've seen people with form that looks so much better than mine that I know like I know that it still needs work. it looks a lot better following Hmm's cues just not there yet.

KeilaniG said:

i'd say yes only if my form was confirmed to be favorable, which i'll film for today or tomorrow and post it.

i've seen people with form that looks so much better than mine that I know like I know that it still needs work. it looks a lot better following Hmm's cues just not there yet.

Glad it helped you!  Hopefully one of the other tips finally gets you to mastery.  Have you found the problematic muscle in your mobility session?

Swivel hips is the one thing keeping me from moving to sPL/PE2. 

I was wondering if when performing the swivel hips we should just go as far as possible while keeping both glutes on the floor, or still go to touch the floor even though the glute on the internally rotated side comes off the floor? Which would be more beneficial to achieve the proper ROM in the long term?

Hmms said:

Glad it helped you!  Hopefully one of the other tips finally gets you to mastery.  Have you found the problematic muscle in your mobility session?

of course, definitely piriformis and some old injury that is responsible for my horrendous hip stability. it's getting there. I'm filming the Swivel hips right now and once again after my mobility/limbering to see how it's mobility improved. brb with the video.

ps: could you post a pic of an example of what you mean by rolling the piriformis laterally vs. medially? I hit it from a few angles and Im trying to picture the one you're describing and i can't really get a sensation when i do it sideways(laterally).

edit: here's the YT link, hopefuly it's upto snuff. I'm going to keep doing these forever though. thoughts?

So look at this image:

Do you see how in this picture, the gluteus maximus is shown through the back view while the gluteus medius and gluteus minimus are through the side view? (so this would be laterally).   That side view would be where you want to massage.

Also an important thing is, when you have your lumbar spine flexed vs extended, while sitting on the swivel hips position, you would literally feel like the weight of the butt is placed in a different place.  For example, if the lumbar spine is flexed, I feel like I'm placing my weight on the very top portions of the glutes.  Whereas, if my lumbar spine is extended, I feel like I'm placing my weight in a lower portion of my glutes.  Placing the weight on the lower portion of the glutes on the floor helps the range of motion.  I'm not sure if I explain that well or not

explanation is good, no need to worry about that. now i seem to feel it more in the anterior capsule of my hip, especially when I internally rotate. a sure sign i need to work on TFL and also keep stretching rectus femoris.

KeilaniG said:

explanation is good, no need to worry about that. now i seem to feel it more in the anterior capsule of my hip, especially when I internally rotate. a sure sign i need to work on TFL and also keep stretching rectus femoris.

Hi Keilani,

I'm exactly at where you currently are with your swivel hips. What stretching/limbering routine are you doing to improve mobility for the inner leg?

-Nash

winging it.

(in no particular order)

roll where sore, learn how to do the C-R while stretching where needed( im still getting acquainted with this) and doing mobility after stretching + the mobility from F-series.

my main effort as of late has been Rectus Femoris via the hip flexor stretches + sifting out tight spots in my inner and outer thighs because its causing me the most grief right now.

aside from that i've been keeping up my F + H mobility doing them daily in a non-structured "getting me loose" kind of way.

interesting enough that swivel hips have improved from working on rolling my inner thighs and stretching my incredibly tight quads.

im excited to get these as beautiful as some of the other forum members. i can see why its important because the times i've practiced sPL-im2, my thighs never go to parallel without my lower back arching. #details

KeilaniG said:

explanation is good, no need to worry about that. now i seem to feel it more in the anterior capsule of my hip, especially when I internally rotate. a sure sign i need to work on TFL and also keep stretching rectus femoris.

TFL's a likely culprit because it's both a hip internal rotator and a hip flexor

Hmms thanks for this post I was exactly looking for help with sPL/PE1 im.

I second this question.

Richard Sassoon said:

Swivel hips is the one thing keeping me from moving to sPL/PE2. 

 

I was wondering if when performing the swivel hips we should just go as far as possible while keeping both glutes on the floor, or still go to touch the floor even though the glute on the internally rotated side comes off the floor? Which would be more beneficial to achieve the proper ROM in the long term?

And my other question is once you get to the end of your ROM with your glutes on the floor would it help to try to force the leg to go lower for few second using just your legs muscles or placing a weighted plate over the knee?  

Thanks

Richard Sassoon said:

Swivel hips is the one thing keeping me from moving to sPL/PE2. 

 

I was wondering if when performing the swivel hips we should just go as far as possible while keeping both glutes on the floor, or still go to touch the floor even though the glute on the internally rotated side comes off the floor? Which would be more beneficial to achieve the proper ROM in the long term?

In the first few months, I tried to go as far as possible with both glutes on the floor (as long as the knee was fine).  I didn't make much progress with that, so I started letting the hip lift moderately (it wasn't so ridiculously high, but at the same time it was high enough that you couldn't count it as mastery).  That's when I started making the bigger progress.  However, this was around the time I started noticing my lumbar spine was rounded and I consciously started trying to arch it.  So I can't say exactly for sure which was the one that caused the biggest increase in ROM.

Alessandro Pantanella said:

And my other question is once you get to the end of your ROM with your glutes on the floor would it help to try to force the leg to go lower for few second using just your legs muscles or placing a weighted plate over the knee?  

 

Thanks

Force your leg to go low enough and maintain it without feeling too much stress on your knees.  I don't like placing a weighted plate over my knee for that exact reason.  This is a hip rotation exercise, not a knee rotation.  You want the range of motion to be from your hips, rather than having your knee substitute for a lack of range of motion in the hips.  By placing the weighted plate on your knees, you're putting excessive stress there and that's going to potentially stretch or damage the ligaments of the knees.

Hmms thanks for the reply.

Hmms said:

 

Force your leg to go low enough and maintain it without feeling too much stress on your knees.  I don't like placing a weighted plate over my knee for that exact reason.  This is a hip rotation exercise, not a knee rotation.  You want the range of motion to be from your hips, rather than having your knee substitute for a lack of range of motion in the hips.  By placing the weighted plate on your knees, you're putting excessive stress there and that's going to potentially stretch or damage the ligaments of the knees.
 

You're right about not putting pressure on your knee, I've just though to put it there because the lever is longer but my idea is simply to try to force the leg to go down with a bit of extra help. Placing an heavier weight on the legs should have the same effect.

Usually this, coupled with resist/relax and breathing works well with muscle stretches but I'm not sure if it would be useful for joint mobility.

I'll give it a try and let you know.

Alessandro Pantanella said:

Hmms thanks for the reply.

You're right about not putting pressure on your knee, I've just though to put it there because the lever is longer but my idea is simply to try to force the leg to go down with a bit of extra help. Placing an heavier weight on the legs should have the same effect.

 

Usually this, coupled with resist/relax and breathing works well with muscle stretches but I'm not sure if it would be useful for joint mobility.

 

I'll give it a try and let you know.

What my point is, even if you do go lower on swivel hips, the increase in ROM will be from knee medial rotation rather than hip medial rotation, which is what you are trying to avoid

Hmms said:

What my point is, even if you do go lower on swivel hips, the increase in ROM will be from knee medial rotation rather than hip medial rotation, which is what you are trying to avoid

I see, thanks for clarifying it.

Hmms, thanks for your insight on this!

I'm touching both knees on the floor while really focusing on the movement coming from the hips and trying keep my obliques stable to avoid too much compensation, and I started arching my back after reading your first post. Still long way to go...

Instead of using a weight for loading, what I'm doing recently is loading the stretch with my other leg. I go into the normal stretched position of swivel hips, then i take one leg and wrap it around the other leg and push with that. To be explicit, if I'm bending to the left side, I take the left thigh and lift it over the right thigh, and tuck my left foot into the left side of my right foot. I can then press further into the stretch without pain on the knee.