Gymnastic and bodybuilding

[battman]

Hey everybody, i just started to work out, and i love doing exercises with my body. So i wanna mix it with bodybuilding ( weight lifting ) but how could such a program look like? 

 

 

[Afiya Zia]

I'd advise you to look at the Foundation series, and continue doing weights for your lower body.

[Alexander Svensson]

I'd advise you to look at the Foundation series, and continue doing weights for your lower body.

Exactly, you should make FOundation your main workout and after that you could add weight training. What kind of exercises and all that though I can't say.

[battman]

I dont have rings and All that, i only Got weights, pullup bar, dip bar. Im training in a bodybuilding gym.

[Afiya Zia]

I dont have rings and All that, i only Got weights, pullup bar, dip bar. Im training in a bodybuilding gym.

Oh.

 

I don't know if Rings are that expensive where you live; they cost me $75. You can hang them off a pull-up bar.

[Keilani Gutierrez]

upper body focus- Foundation 1-4, Movement 1-3 (when released, so it isnt clear it it involves lower body but im sure it will), Rings 1-4, Handstands 1-3.

lower body focus-Foundation 1-4, movement 1-3(pending release)

the progresions on core(abdominal, oblique and lower back) and lower body (entire hip girdle, quads, hamstring, calves) will give you a lot of power that you can further compound with olympic lifting, power lifting and all that jazz. im rook on that subject so other people can fill in that space.

I know that being able to single leg squat along with the associated knee mobility and hamstring strength developed by the integrated mobility would serve as enough prehab to undergo lifting since you've already mastered your BW. there are ways to lift with weights before that time, but im not aware of how to undertake that there are more knowledgable folks in that department

[Connor Davies]

Get rings.  Do Foundation.

 

You literally need no other work.

[battman]

But how can i use rings, in a regular gym? 

 

Right now my workout plan is like this

 

4 times a week

 

Chest/Shoulder/tricep

Dumbell benchpress 4 x 6-8

Dumbell decline benchpress 4 x 6-8

Dumbell shoulder press 4 x 6-8

Push ups 8 x 8

DIps 8 x 8

 

Legs/Back/bicep

Squat 4 x 6-8

Pullups 8 x 8

Pulldowns 4 x 6-8

DB row 4 x 6-8

Curl 4 x 6-8

[Keilani Gutierrez]

But how can i use rings, in a regular gym? 

 

Right now my workout plan is like this

 

4 times a week

 

Chest/Shoulder/tricep

Dumbell benchpress 4 x 6-8

Dumbell decline benchpress 4 x 6-8

Dumbell shoulder press 4 x 6-8

Push ups 8 x 8

DIps 8 x 8

 

Legs/Back/bicep

Squat 4 x 6-8

Pullups 8 x 8

Pulldowns 4 x 6-8

DB row 4 x 6-8

Curl 4 x 6-8

I'm not so sure about how you'd do that because where i live (Puerto rico) there are few crossfit gyms, they are starting to pop up and they have rings but....well I like the way people think here versus a gym because i have similar goals to a BB, I just opted for my training to be GST...aside from that, the pits don't have bodyweight stations(I've gone to quite a few gyms and some don't even have dip stations or legit pullup stations.

 

so you'll have to either bring them with you and hang them somewhere safely(you'll have to check out the area beforehand) or just install them off a tree(or be creative).

 

if you DO want to go the rings route, i'd suggest in checking out the Foundation series, if it's aligned with your goals

[Afiya Zia]

Rings should be hung off wherever you're currently doing your pullups.

[ASNB]

OP, I haven't done much Gymnastic strength training but I lifted weights for a long time.  Correct me if I am wrong, but you said you just started working out?  If this is the case your current lifting split is pretty high volume, I wouldn't advise you do adhere to that program as a beginner much less add gymnastic training to it.  

 

After many years of hard lifting, I would say try to build a base in the gymnastic strength elements, which people on this forum can help you with much more than I can.  And then after a couple of years add in some weight training as GPP or to get out of a rut or whatever.  

 

But to approach 2 vastly different strength disciplines full throttle simultaneously at such a volume is ill-advised.  Even when you have many years of experience  in one discipline it is best to have access to a a coach if you want to add in extra work, and to do so conservatively to avoid injury.  

 

So basically build a base of at least 2 yrs in one, I think Gymnastics is superior, and then explore hybridization, but do so very carefully especially if you reach a high level in any discipline.

 

BTW you can make something similar to rings with pipe and chains.  

 

Good luck.

[Jeffrey Wijnans]

It all comes down to the principle of specificity. You can do both but theres a trade off and you will sacrifice your full potential in either bb or gymnastics. That plus the fact your CNS (central nerve system) will be taxed hard by the gymnastics training and the heavy weights which means longer recovery times  - >  less training -> less growth -> decreases progression or even overtraining (Side note: not a big believer of this though).

 

So in short. You can do both but if you really want to get something out of it its better to choose one.

[Quick Start Test Smith]

Do you mean body building as in pure weight lifting (for the strength) or body building for aesthetics? If aesthetics, the Foundation series will supply all your demand for size as long as you eat properly and put the right amount of training in. 

 

I like to fill a shirt well and in a certain way, so I do a mini-workout at the end of the week (after I am finished with all the important work) for whatever I like doing. In some ways it's a vanity day and in some ways it's just my "do whatever you want and have fun" day. I love it. I also do 10-15 minute mini-workouts after my main workouts.

 

What the others said about full-assing one thing instead of half-assing two things is very true, but if you're a beginner, doing Foundation will give you size without any special training. You will become stronger and bigger (if you eat properly, of course). Later on in the Foundation series you may choose to add a mini-workout here and there for anything you'd specifically like to train, but otherwise Foundation is a perfect core for your training.

[Ádám Ficsór]

Here is an algorythm what you would consider:

1. Do you have money for a gym/time to travel to a gym?
If no then gymnastics.

Else go to 2.

2. What are your goals?

If only look good then bodybuilding.

If look good/getting strong/healthy/whatever then gymnastics.

That's really this simple.

[Jeffrey Wijnans]

Here is an algorythm what you would consider:

1. Do you have money for a gym/time to travel to a gym?

If no then gymnastics.

Else go to 2.

2. What are your goals?

If only look good then bodybuilding.

If look good/getting strong/healthy/whatever then gymnastics.

That's really this simple.

Your right dont get me wrong but theres also a thing called having fun. Most peopel wont become world class athletes they just workout as a hobby and with this mindset more options become viable imo. IF you want to be good stick with one thing at the time if you are ok with being fine while doing some different things you have my vote.

[Seabird]

Seems to me there are a few areas where weights are beneficial to gymnastics training. That said, there are a few caveats I've picked up - specifically, that they are both not advisable for gymnasts who are young (seems that there is only weight training with college level athletes that I've seen), and that the main benefits of lifting weights is constrained to a couple of relatively constrained areas (particularly for gaining leg strength for tumbling). 

 

What I've seen that seems particularly relevant to a beginner/intermediate level gymnasts training is single arm kettle bell swings, as a means to build up lower back strength. The cross overs from this obviously apply to a lot of areas but its been mentioned elsewhere that there is a significant benefit to manna training. I'm only starting on this exercise myself so I can't vouch to the efficacy, but coach has mentioned them in BTGB as also been a particularly useful tool for building planche strength. 

 

I'm not sure what a training program would be like for tumbling. It seems to me though that weighted vests and ankle weights/dip belt would be the preferred tools of gymnasts, but some free weight exercises have been mentioned around. I am a beginner though and don't know much of anything about that.

 

Question though, why would you want to body build? If we knew your objectives more it may be easier to give advice. Re: what you mentioned as the exercises you're doing now, you can increase difficulty through different progressions. Pushups by moving to planche pushups, multi plane pressing, handstand pushups, pullups by doing l sit pullups and weighted pullups, doing muscle ups etc., dips by moving towards korean dips etc. and weighted dips, squats by moving to the single leg squat variations and weighted single leg squat variations (very difficult) and so forth. Some of the other exercises probably may not help your gymnastic development compared with other things that could easily take up your time at the gym. 

[battman]

I want to look bigger, much bigger, but at the same time, i want to be strong. So my overall goal is to look bigger, and get stronger. I have no intentions, on start in competetion, in either bodybuilding,powerlifting,gymnastic.

[Ronald]

I want to look bigger, much bigger, but at the same time, i want to be strong. So my overall goal is to look bigger, and get stronger. I have no intentions, on start in competetion, in either bodybuilding,powerlifting,gymnastic.

I totally agree with ASNB...

 

I've been lifting weights for many years for bodybuilding mostly, and I can tell you my biggest mistake was not building a strength foundation. I am no expert by any means, but I can at least tell you what I've learned from personal experience.  IMHO you should build a strength base. As a beginner you can gain strength very fast... and working on high volume like your routine is not optimal. you can do both weightlifting and gymnastics together, but you will have to limit the exercises for both. there's no need for 2 types of dumbbell bench press and 8 sets of pushups IMO.

 

I recommend Jim Wendler's 5/3/1 routine (look it up) where you do 4 weightlifting exercises (Squats, Deadlifts, Bench Press and Shoulder Press) on 4 days a week (1 each day), and after the exercise for that day you do assistance exercises that you choose. Which is where you can easily add the gymnastic exercises/progressions as assistance. (which also include dips/pull ups etc... if you've read F1)

 

Keep that up for 2 years, and you would have built an excellent strength foundation which will make you gain size "INCREDIBLY FAST" after you start going for higher volume... starting with high volume without strength will make you gain for some time, but not ideal for long term success.

 

If I could go back in time, for when I started working out, that's exactly what I would have done.

[Connor Davies]

If I could go back in time, for when I started working out, that's exactly what I would have done.

If I could go back in time to when I started working out, I would do F1.

 

No seriously, I daydream about this all the time.

[ASNB]

Wendler's 5/3/1 is for very experienced lifters.  Someone just starting out will do nothing but destroy their joints attempting that protocol.

 

Battman, gymnastics will add size to a beginner.  Any kind of resistance training will add size if you eat right. I have rarely met someone who ATE properly the first year and didn't add 20 lbs to their frame.  A man in his late teens or early twenties  may need 5000k of quality calories to gain.  So if you want to grow, eat!!  

 

How you train is of secondary importance to your ability to gain size especially for a beginner.  Gymnastics will save your joints and make them stronger. 

 

I know what it is like to want to get bigger very fast, but there is no quick fix for this one.  You have to be patient, smart about your training, and treat your body well, so that when you do get there eventually you can still move like a normal human  .  

[Ádám Ficsór]

I want to look bigger, much bigger, but at the same time, i want to be strong. So my overall goal is to look bigger, and get stronger. I have no intentions, on start in competetion, in either bodybuilding,powerlifting,gymnastic.

I'm not sure if multiple goals are benefical, because you could end up like the most crossfit guys, accomplishing really nothing. Maybe you would follow a not retarded street workout routine. You can do much more exciting exercises than in the gym, but doesn't require as much balance and flexibility like in gymnastics. Because of this they're much more capable to build bigger muscles.

[Ronald]

Wendler's 5/3/1 is for very experienced lifters.  Someone just starting out will do nothing but destroy their joints attempting that protocol.

 

Battman, gymnastics will add size to a beginner.  Any kind of resistance training will add size if you eat right. I have rarely met someone who ATE properly the first year and didn't add 20 lbs to their frame.  A man in his late teens or early twenties  may need 5000k of quality calories to gain.  So if you want to grow, eat!!  

 

How you train is of secondary importance to your ability to gain size especially for a beginner.  Gymnastics will save your joints and make them stronger. 

 

I know what it is like to want to get bigger very fast, but there is no quick fix for this one.  You have to be patient, smart about your training, and treat your body well, so that when you do get there eventually you can still move like a normal human  .  

 

Wendler is also for beginners. "http://www.jimwendler.com/2011/09/531-for-a-beginner/"

 

The difference between beginner's training and advanced training has nothing to do with exercise selection. it has to do with loading parameters, volume and progression / periodisation. it will not destroy his joints... far from it, it will make him stronger provided he uses correct form (with the help of a professional) and adequate loads.