Skill and Strength days

[Justin Andzel]

Do any of you guys structure your workouts so your alternating between skill days and real workout days.?Like one day you hit it hard and work toward your main goals, and the next day think of it as a purely skill day, focusing on more long term goals. For example, my goals are to master the handstand, hespu's, and muscle ups, so my main workouts are focused on hs work, hespu's, pull up and dip variations, and mu transitions, with more of a workout mindset. My skill days focus on longer term goals, and are more practice oriented with focus on back levers, elbow levers, and bridges. Every day I warmup with handstands and lsits.

Workout days are MWF, skill days are t,th,sun. Saturdays I condition at the track with 20,40,100, 200, and 400m sprints. What do you guys think of a routine like this?

[Daniel Burnham]

This is not an optimal way to train.  A good workout schedule will optimize what to work on by rotating movements between days.  You should have both strength conditioning and skill work in a well optimized training session.  Also, although all movements are "skills" in some regard, from a gymnastic standpoint the skills you mentioned are just static strength and mobility drills with the exception of handstand.  They really cannot be considered "skill work".  I understand that you may not want to work gymnastic skills and in that case there are more effective methods for achieving your goals.  Combining static strength and dynamic movements that use a similar plane of motion is pretty effective and gives you a little rest between the alternating days.

 

You would be better off following something like what is outlined in the foundation series.  If you absolutely cannot get the Foundation series you could use the killroy template until you can.  Don't dismiss this as some sort of advertisement.  The Foundation series really is that good.  I use it as my main strength schedule within my gymnastic training.

[Justin Andzel]

 I understand that you may not want to work gymnastic skills and in that case there are more effective methods for achieving your goals. 

 

Daniel-

Thank you for you input. What would be an effective way to train towards my goals?

[Daniel Burnham]

As I mentioned in the previous post. The foundation series and as an alternative the Kilroy template are more effective.

[Parth Rajguru]

You can do what you are suggesting, it's a good idea. I have used a similar template in the past with success. Handbalancing and mobility made up my "skill" sessions, and I had separate strength sessions. It's a good idea to include handstands in the beginning of each session, allowing for frequent practice of the skill.

 

Your skill sessions could include handbalancing, maintenance skills, mobility elements, and other fun movements that you want to explore. It's important to schedule play time and fun into your training, as paradoxical as this sounds.

 

Even if this approach is not "optimal" (which depends on your school of thought), it will be successful and productive, especially for a recreational trainee. If you wanted to be a competitive gymnast or other competitive athlete, then what Daniel is suggesting would be more optimal. If your goal is to be a more well-rounded mover while training a variety of movements in a somewhat limited schedule, your proposed template will be fine. At the end of the day, too many people are too preoccupied with minute details and forget to actually train. Hard, consistent, smart work is what leads to results, not any particular training split.

[Keilani Gutierrez]

This is not an optimal way to train.  A good workout schedule will optimize what to work on by rotating movements between days.  You should have both strength conditioning and skill work in a well optimized training session.  Also, although all movements are "skills" in some regard, from a gymnastic standpoint the skills you mentioned are just static strength and mobility drills with the exception of handstand.  They really cannot be considered "skill work".  I understand that you may not want to work gymnastic skills and in that case there are more effective methods for achieving your goals.  Combining static strength and dynamic movements that use a similar plane of motion is pretty effective and gives you a little rest between the alternating days.

 

You would be better off following something like what is outlined in the foundation series.  If you absolutely cannot get the Foundation series you could use the killroy template until you can.  Don't dismiss this as some sort of advertisement.  The Foundation series really is that good.  I use it as my main strength schedule within my gymnastic training.

so would you say it would be wise or un-wise to have a seperate day to work on Handstand training to be more fresh? this was a doubt i had not long ago. how would you go about it? something like upper/lower/handstand or have handstands the same days as strength before the actual strength work? 

[Connor Davies]

Handstands everyday.  It's better to get 5 minutes every day than 1 hour 1 day a week.

[Daniel Burnham]

I agree with raja. The point I want to make is that most of the things you listed aren't really skills that would be good to seperate out. I do think the things he mentioned are ok to break out. Though I will say that having mobility on the same day as strength has really helped me.

[Daniel Burnham]

so would you say it would be wise or un-wise to have a seperate day to work on Handstand training to be more fresh? this was a doubt i had not long ago. how would you go about it? something like upper/lower/handstand or have handstands the same days as strength before the actual strength work?

I saw this basic question in your other post before it disappeared. I was working strength 5 days a week with handstands on several of the days. I ended up having to move the handstand days out and concentrate on then. Especially when I started working presses. But I still do short holds everyday. Both in warmup and when needed on the apparatus I am training.

I do think there is benefit in doing it fresh. It allows you to feel and correct the position better. At least that has been my experience.

I disagree with the assertion that 5 min frequently is better than 1 hour less frequently.. This might be true if every five minute session had perfect form but that just isn't the case. Not even with the pros. Yuri will tell you handstand takes constant refinement especially if you want to do more advanced handbalancing things. I find that it often takes me several tries to feel the mistake I have made and correct it. I am still learning to correct line even with a 30 second handstand under my belt. I would just spin my wheels if I did 5 min a day. I have learned this from experience.

[Parth Rajguru]

I agree with raja. The point I want to make is that most of the things you listed aren't really skills that would be good to seperate out. I do think the things he mentioned are ok to break out. Though I will say that having mobility on the same day as strength has really helped me.

I also use mobility movements with my strength training, and it's a good practice to be more efficient in training time. Especially compared to not doing mobility training at all.

 

His "skills" include handstands, elbow levers, and bridges. If his goal is to maintain his progress on the long-term strength goals such as the back lever, this would be perfect to implement on a skill day, perhaps even as a ring routine.

[Connor Davies]

How does H1 integrate with F1?  Is it done on separate days, alternating days or the same days?

[Daniel Burnham]

 That is something that should only be discussed in h1 forum.