Crossroads

Hi all

I've been a bit of a lurker on these forums, but recovery from a nasty illness (the setbacks in my weightlifting strength) and becoming a Dad has given me time to think and wonder about my fitness/strength direction.

I'm 31, been lifting in a "Starting Strength" style for a few years, not impressive weights by a lot of standards, but doing ok. I'm 6 foot 3 n 1/2 odd inches, weighing in at 81KGs (yes, tall thin, long limbs, deadlift better than squat). I've done pretty well from it, maintaining a relatively good physique. I've also deviated a little and added Kettlebells and Ross Enamait styled training as either alternate workouts or supplemental training.........

.....then I found this site. Damn you people! This stuff is interesting, fun and HARD. I want to give it more of a focus (Yes I've ordered Coach's Book), as the weights are starting to loose my interest and motivation (Back squats bore me no end). I'd like to keep the kettlebells in the mix, and I'm cycling a lot more these days (fixed gear bike, great fun). My big questions are:

- I'm probably utilising the good hormone response from things like back squats and deadlifts, can Gymnastic Strength Training™ equal this? (am prepared to work at it)

- Has anyone else given up the iron and made good progress? (especially maintaining, even adding more lean muscle mass)

- Being 31, longevity and long term training are starting to pique my interest, would Gym. Strength (with Kettlebells and Cycling thrown in) be a good way to go?

PS - Thanks for any advice, pointers, links etc . I'm currently using a doorway bar for lever practice, parallettes for frogstand/tuck plance/L-sits and have rings attched to the doorway bar (limiting my overhead height for handstands/inverted stuff on rings). I would attempt to change this scenario if the advice encourages it!

Cheers!

I started off bodybuilding, and switched over to gymnastic style training on the rings, with a lot of success. Really, it depends on your interests and goals. Bodybuilding style training gave me a lot of muscle size but I wanted a greater strength to weight ratio--that and carrying around a lot of size hurts after a while... I've managed to maintain most of my upper body size (very little loss), however, I've lost a good amount of leg size due to the lack of really heavy strain on them like during my iron days.

If you're looking for a lot of strength, this is the place to be--it's functional, and it can give you a lean, muscular physique, if you're willing to be patient. It takes longer than it would with weights, but it's more valuable muscle, as it can perform better than it looks it can, even, when often bodybuilders look stronger than they are.

You won't get the same kind of hormonal release without the squats and deadlifts, but you can still get in some tough leg work (one-legged squats, etc.) that's pretty good for you.

The main determiner in adding lean muscle mass is nutrition, not training, but that's a conversation saved for the nutrition section. If you want, send me a PM and I can give you some advice from my personal experience--I managed to add about 85-90 pounds of muscle on my frame with the right nutrition a few years ago, and have maintained the muscle I described above utilizing some of the same principles. I also want to get into personal training, so I welcome any practice.

Good luck, man!

i gave up traditional lifting... i power lift, olympic lift, do gymnastic style training and hiit... i've gained +40lbs from march to august... the transformation has been amazing... i started at 6' 190lbs and now i'm about 238lbs... i feel like i get a better workout and my joints don't hurt... it has been an amazing transformation...

Thanks guys

Any advice (even negative, therefore making me more aware) is encouraging me to "make the break" so to speak.

Getting a little older is making my goals change a bit, never been one for the roid-raged look, but I want to be fit and strong for as many years as I can, especially for my new family. As I creep up with poundages in my lifting I gotta wonder if I really can maintain that sort of thing or it's going to cause some issues later. I know there's many older folk still lifting happily, but I can't bear to think about back squats being in my life for so many years!

Am also hoping the gymnastics strength stuff can travel with me too. Chuck some Rings in the backpack (along with the never ending diapers, bottles, wipes, creams, formula - for the boy of course )

I'd be grateful for any more tips/thoughts on the conversion from being an Iron Lifter (although I really do love the kettlebells)

I'm also interested in gymnastics, weights, and kettlebells. It's not possible to combine all three with full programs in each. It would lead to serious overtraining. There are ways to cycle them, though. Here are some observations:

- Gymnastics is very skill-intensive. You need at least 3, preferably 4 or 5 gymnastics workouts a week in order to improve.

- There's a lot of overlap between gymnastics and upper-body weight work. I improved my military press without doing any presses at all and just doing press handstands (and not even handstand pushups)!

- Deads might be a better fit than squats for people who do gymnastics too, because the increased leg size will make planches and levers very difficult.

- Kettlebells are great for conditioning but if you do a lot of snatches it might be too much for your shoulders combined with gymnastics. Do swings instead.

- If you like olympic lifting, you can get all the "explosiveness" benefit just by doing high pulls. This will keep you from beating up your upper body too much.

So this is one way to design a cycle that focuses on gymnastics and also maintains the other skills. You can have other cycles that focus on the other activities after you develop some basic gymnastic skills.

So I'm thinking along these lines (remembering the weekday work of 10KM each day on a fixed gear bike )

Monday

Deadlift 3 x 5 -alt- Single Leg Deadlift with 2 Kettlebells

HSPU's 4 x 6 (floor with wall support)

Pullups, mixed grip 3 x 12

Tuck Lever 6 x 10 secs

Tuck Planche 6 x 10 secs

Tuesday

Kettlebell Swings - Hand to Hand, 3 x 20 -alt- Heavy 2 Hand Swings

Weighted Ring dips 3 x 6

Ring Rows (elevated feet) 3 x 12

Tuck Lever 6 x 10 secs

Tuck Planche 6 x 10 secs

Wednesday

Handstand practice

L Sit 6 x 10 secs

Thursday

Sumo Deadlift High Pulls (Barbell or 2 Kettlebells) 3 x 5 -alt- Power Cleans (Barbell or 2 Kettlebells)

Weighted Pullups 3 x 6

One Arm Pushups 6 x 2 l,2 r)

Tuck Lever 6 x 10 secs

Tuck Planche 6 x 10 secs

Friday

Front Squats -alt- Pistols

Pullups 3 x 12

Ring Dips 3 x 12

Tuck Lever 6 x 10 secs

Tuck Planche 6 x 10 secs

Saturday

Handstand Practice

L Sit 6 x 10 secs

Sunday

---nuthin ---

I'd love to get to the point where my Tucked Levers and Planches allow me to do the pullups and pushups variations respectively. I'd imagine replacing some of the other push and pull exercises with those.

I have to admit, I'm really busting to get hold of my copy of Coach's book. I feel there's heaps I could be doing to train, but the world of Gymnastic Strength is pretty new to me and I don't really know where to start, despite reading whatever I can (The T-Nation article has been the easiest to absorb).

Once again, thoughts?? Is this the right track? I'm under the impressions that Coach's book will clear things up, but I just want to kick start the new line of thought/effort.

Cheers all

Just remember to put any gymnastic work before the other things. So do your tuck planche and tuck front lever before your deadlifts and such.

Cheers all!

chauinc - will do my best, I guess I have the tendency to go for the weight stuff first because, although it's heavy work, I've become used to it being my most demanding exercise. I guess it's probably very taxing on the CNS prior to the Gymnastic Strength stuff, so I'll rearrange the order a bit. May have to ease off the weight in the lifts, or drop reps.

I also used to train 3 days a week, getting used to more (but hopefully shorter sessions) will be a change!!!

Progressing from the Frog Stand to Straight Arm Frog Stand and now teetering into the Tuck Planche (and starting to extend one leg a bit in the tuck lever!) has really got me addicted!!! Even making my own Parallettes was awesome !!!

Thanks again for the wise words folks!!!