Designing my own program? Harder than I thought!

Hi Coach et al,

I've been lurking on the forum for a while. Though I'm not a gymnast nor I pursue the dreams of becoming one I have gotten a copy of Building The Gymnastic Body just because out of curiosity and the fact that I love every material that is strength training related. I'm amazed the valuable and well written information about the gymnastics training basics and maybe a little more the book gives. I wish I was 17 discovering this training method just now. But that's not the case, so I'm gonna try to get the best out of it at 30. I've been training mainly with weights for 11 years of which 3 years is with kettlebells that I'm still doing. I'm recovering from a serious ankle injury therefore I'm just getting back into training with my RKC class. Besides kettlebells I pursue bodyweight and other fitness goals for 2012. This is where I need your help to structure an effective and not too complicated routine. I know it was asked by many before but I can't seem to find a topic that would particularly address my concerns.

The goals are as follows:

Being able to hold a free handstand and do +1 HSPU - currently I'm able to hold a wall handstand and perform 5 HSPU

Being able to perform one arm chin for one or more reps - currently I'm able to perform 6 strict form pull-up or 12 chin ups

Strengthen my lower back, especially in the sacrum area to help stabilize the sacrialic joint

I was thinking of incorporating the SSC for some of the static holds as well as some bodyweight exercises. But simply can't get it all together though I kinda almost there in figuring out. Please help guys

Of course everyone's advice is welcome.

Thanks in advance for your reply.

Gergely

Beginners should either employ the Killroy70 program, do the GB WOD; or do SSC for FSP&FBE in a very similar fashion to the K70 program.

5 HSPU on a wall, floor, or parallettes or rings? There is a bit of a difference.

To do the last, you will need test the various FSP and FBE to see what you can do. Even if you don't do a SSC, this is good to give those people embarking on the GB WOD an idea where they are and how they should scale it down for them should they need to scale it.

You somewhat have an idea where you are regarding the FBE.

Before embarking on a path to mastery of the FSP such as the levers and planche, it is recommended to master the preFSP series (which can also be something done as a warmup). Each position should be able to be down 3x60 with short rest in between holds. It is:

Pronated and Supinated Hang

Straight arm plank

Reverse plank (like a crab walk but with straight legs)

Hollow hold

Arch hold (superman)

1 arm side planks (these are sort of difficult)

Parallel Bar support (doing this on rings is a bit more difficult and straight arm plank on rings should be mastered prior)

German Hang on rings/bar

It is recommended to master an L-sit before levers and planche because it requires a strong enough core to hold. It's a bit dependent on active hip flexibility to do it on the floor (which is preferred) but PB/fingers/fists is sort of acceptable.

Yeah, it is pretty much the same with me. Just I am older and I have started weight lifting just 5 years ago. At first gymnastics seemed something impossible to me but now I want to do it finally. I've dropped quite a lot of weight so it is time for me to try it out. And I am also stuck how transition from typical BB workout and design a proper gymnastics workout. I have access to a standard gym and no access to a real gymnastics equipment besides the ground. I intend to buy rings in a couple of months.

I have started with basic exercises for the planche and the front lever already.

So I am also very interested in this thread.

Blairbob said:

Beginners should either employ the Killroy70 program, do the GB WOD; or do SSC for FSP&FBE in a very similar fashion to the K70 program.

I'm sorry. Maybe I am blind but where is it?

Hey Blairbob, Thanks for taking the time to read and reply on my post.

Actually I've been practicing L-holds for a while and can hold a L-sit on mini PBs for about 15-20 sec. Also tried the floor version but that I could hold only for a fraction of time, most was around 3 sec. The 5 HSPU I can do with wall support of course. That is why one of my goals is to be able to do the same free balancing.

I understand the protocol discussed in the book and the Killroy70 program, but honestly it seems too much work for my goals and the given workload I already receive from kettlebells.

So basically I would like to put together and easy-to-follow routine that would get me closer achieving my goals I mentioned in my previous post.

Guess employing the Killroy70 program taking out the more complex FBEs and FSPs would get me there. I thought of something like this:

FSPs

L-sit

Planche

Back Lever

Front Lever

FBEs

Push/Press

Dip/Curl

HSPU/Row

Leg/Core

Progressing to harder versions by the end of each 8-12 week cycle (kinda SSC)

Do you think this would get me off to a good start? Thanks again.

Yes. Combined push/pull and multi plane pressing or pulling is for the intermediates. Then again, pullovers are pretty simple but they are mostly pull+core strength. There is not of a lot of pressing strength involved with them unless you are talking about a pullover/backward roll/felge on rings.

If you want a free HS, including a free HSPU on the floor or rings, you will need to spend some time doing HS. There is no way around it.

Treat your KB work as conditioning. I'm not that familiar with TGU but that would seem something in the KB realm that is more technique and strength involved. Honestly, I only swing KB doing TGU or KB snatches or C&J from time to time focusing on them as a conditioning tool and that's all I care to use them as. No flipping KB or swinging or spinning them around.

For the SSC FBE, just do 1 press/pull/leg/core a day. There is actually 5 families of core exercises in BtGB though some of the straight pull exercises also work pull strength while there are 3 of leg exercises so you'll have to figure what to do about that.

Thank you BlairBob it's much clearer now. Take care.

I have found the Killroy70's program but it is too much for me at this point. I need to build some more core strength. I have decided to train 3 times a week with weights doing 4-3-2 repetitions. The split would be chest, back, shoulders and I'll fit legs and abs in these days too. I'm also trying to lower my BF to 7-8% which would mean lose 10-12 pounds.

Should I do the basic gymnastic exercises everyday (like in Killroy70's program) or only on days when I do not lift weights? Should I take rest days (not even cardio workout). I am 35 and I am not recovering very fast. Maybe I should lower the overall volume too.

You want to do a bodypart split and gymnastics and build core strength.

Ditch the bodypart split. I don't believe in bodypart splits for any but advanced athletes anyways. But everyone in globos wants to do them. Meh. :?

Press, squat, deadlift, 2-3x/week. Do some L work and hollow/arch before the lifts. Or after. Throw in some Vups or lying leg lifts. For core strength with a bar, you can also do StiffLegDeadlifts or RomanianDeadlifts or GoodMornings, or back extensions (with weight if you wish) or crunches on a swiss/yoga ball.

Perhaps look into a minimalist program if your recovery is poor. Check sleep quantity and quality to make sure recovery is good.

Untrained people and beginners will have somewhat impaired recovery ability because of a lack of work capacity. It's something that takes time.

Thank you for your advice, Blairbob. I've been lifting weights since 2006 but I've never done much BW exercises. I don't really like splits but I don't know any better, except circuit training which is more fun. It is just difficult to do when the gym is full.

I've managed to lose lots of body fat and weight last year. I am in the best shape in my life but I don't feel strong enough for gymnastics yet.

My main problem is severe inflexibility in the hamstrings, waist and shoulders.

Yes you are right. My quality and quantity of sleep is not very good. I really have a problem to sleep for more than 5-6 hours after that I wake up. I guess that's the primary reason why my progress is so slow.

I'll get rings in a couple of months too (I have to import them because there aren't any available locally).