Steady state and hypertrophy for a rehab patient

Hello, everyone.

In mid October of last year, I broke both of my wrists in an accident at a martial arts practice (Yep - both of them! :shock:). I had surgery and now I have a permanent metal plate on my left radius. From May to August of last year I had been following a two-day-a-week killroy program. I brought it down to two days because apart from gymnastics I was in 20+ hours a week of other sports. I had great results in both FBE and FSP movements and managed to gain a nice amount of muscle.

I am 6 ft 2 inches (1.88 meters) and my base/natural weight is 115 lbs (52kg). I am aware of how skinny that is but, hey, my cousins are even worse . Blame it on our genetics (I have a buffet cafeteria at my college so this is not a nutrition issue. I now maintain at 2300 calories a day and with so many sports I was eating usually around 3000 calories a day.). On the Killroy program I went up to 125 lbs (56 kg) which was really great. Then college kicked in and I stopped gymnastics and only had time for a few sports...blah, blah, blah...fast forward to breaking my arms. All my physical activity came to a halt and I went back down to my base weight and I've been severely deconditioned. The only thing I kept up were my pistol squats so that I could retain a decent amount of strength, mass, and flexibility.

Currently, I can do about 3 pullups, a 5 second advanced l-sit, and a 2 second v-sit (I do both of the sits on my fingertips or fists since my wrist extension isn't strong enough). This is a gigantic step down from where I was before my accident but I was actually even surprised that I can still do an l-sit. I haven't tested anything else but I'm going to get to a park tomorrow and mess around with the rings to see where I stand now.

I'd like to start up ring gymnastics again. I have Coach Sommer's book and a pair of xtreme rings. On top of learning the skills, I also want to gain some muscle again. But, obviously, my connective tissues are much more weak now and aren't ready for me to jump right into all of this. I'm wondering if any of you know of a good way to combine the SSC with a FBE hypertrophy plan. I'm also going to be training FSP's but I have searched through the forums here and that part seems easy enough now. It seems like it would be impossible to gain moderate amounts of weight (say .75 kg a month) on an SSC cycle. I am planning on a M/W/F schedule with W being a very light day. This is what I'm thinking of doing for an SSC:

Week 1, 2, 3: Exercise progressively (In these weeks I will be gaining mass)

Week 4: Steady state week where I will just keep the same reps on everything from week 3 (let tendons catch up a little)

Week 5, 6, 7: Exercise progressively (gaining mass)

Week 8: No gymnastics. Some walking and stretching. (let the connective tissues catch up some more)

Repeat weeks 1 through 8 until summer vacation (a total of 16 weeks to vacation)

Now here is where I will employ the SSC. For the summer vacation I would stay on a SSC for 12 weeks to let everything catch up to my muscles.

This seems to be all I can come up with but even so, I'm afraid that 4 months of non-SSC FBE training will overwork the connective tissues in my wrists and cause bad crap to happen . So is this a good Idea or not? Any recommendations? Many of you are a lot more knowledgeable than me! Should I even step down to the very basics? I'm more concerned about my connective tissues than anything else at this point. My bones will be fully healed by February 1st which is when I will really start to practice. Right now, the bones are at 95% but I'm just trying to figure all this out and not dive into the deep end.

Thank you! Long post - I know it will detract many potential readers .

I think you already know the answer:

Start very slow and easy, and build up slowly.

Also, nutrition is about more than raw numbers. That is a scary weight for a 6'2 guy. Not necessarily unhealthy, but you do not have the musculature to protect your skeleton from impact properly.

I will also suggest, despite what you claim, that breaking both of your wrists points to a nutritional deficiency. Could be inhibited absorption, could be a billion things, and the right thing to do is to see a registered dietician who works with athletes specifically.

As always, this is not medical advice. Not all professionals are up to speed with all the research, but it is important to see them because in general they do good things for people. And they have liability insurance, which I do not. Anything you do as a result of this post is at your own risk. This is for informational purposes only.

What I would do in your situation is start having protein every hour, on the hour. At the very least, I would have 30g of protein every 3 hours. I would probably mix 15g of whey with 15 ounces of non-homogenized whole milk. Homogenized if that's all there is. The whole milk is to delay gastric emptying and to provide carbohydrates to go with the protein.

I would also suggest that you start eating 7-8 times per day. 3000 calories is worthless if you're getting it in 3 meals, your body can't absorb that much and actually use it. Even if you ate a billion grams of protein and carbs, your body will only be using something like 90g of protein and 300g of carbs. That's not quite 1600 calories. The rest will go to fat and not to building lean mass. That also means that out of a 24 hour day you are spending 24 - 9 = 15 hours in a catabolic state. Do you think you can build muscle properly when you are spending 62.5% of your time in a catabolic state? No, you won't. Hence some of your issues.

Now obviously, you may be eating more often than that and the above is specifically for the three meal per day people. They have absolutely no idea how far from ideal that diet is for performance purposes. Think about the numbers above, and then think: you're only eating 2300 calories now. How is that spread out? Is there 6-10g of protein for every hour you won't be eating? Are you spending more than 3 hours not eating at a stretch? Do you have tons of different veggies in there? I'm assuming you're getting enough carbs since that's what college cafeterias specialize in, but who knows... are you getting enough carbs?

This thought process will help you get what you want, and perhaps understand why things were how they were and part of why your bones broke.

Again, I will suggest strongly that you consult with a registered dietician who specializes in working with athletes. It will be more than worth it.

As always, this is not medical advice. Not all professionals are up to speed with all the research, but it is important to see them because in general they do good things for people. And they have liability insurance, which I do not. Anything you do as a result of this post is at your own risk. This is for informational purposes only.

What sports were you doing. Sports with lots of moving around? Swimming, or soccer, or lacrosse, etc?

Eat like a bear and do some lower body barbell lifting. I could care less if you back or front squat or deadlift or hex bar deadlift, but do something. Do a SSC for FSP+FBE's. If you care to, add in some volume with easier FBE progressions than you program for strength for hypertrophy.

And eat.

slizzardman said:

I think you already know the answer:

Start very slow and easy, and build up slowly.

Also, nutrition is about more than raw numbers. That is a scary weight for a 6'2 guy. Not necessarily unhealthy, but you do not have the musculature to protect your skeleton from impact properly.

I will also suggest, despite what you claim, that breaking both of your wrists points to a nutritional deficiency. Could be inhibited absorption, could be a billion things, and the right thing to do is to see a registered dietician who works with athletes specifically.

As always, this is not medical advice. Not all professionals are up to speed with all the research, but it is important to see them because in general they do good things for people. And they have liability insurance, which I do not. Anything you do as a result of this post is at your own risk. This is for informational purposes only.

What I would do in your situation is start having protein every hour, on the hour. At the very least, I would have 30g of protein every 3 hours. I would probably mix 15g of whey with 15 ounces of non-homogenized whole milk. Homogenized if that's all there is. The whole milk is to delay gastric emptying and to provide carbohydrates to go with the protein.

I would also suggest that you start eating 7-8 times per day. 3000 calories is worthless if you're getting it in 3 meals, your body can't absorb that much and actually use it. Even if you ate a billion grams of protein and carbs, your body will only be using something like 90g of protein and 300g of carbs. That's not quite 1600 calories. The rest will go to fat and not to building lean mass. That also means that out of a 24 hour day you are spending 24 - 9 = 15 hours in a catabolic state. Do you think you can build muscle properly when you are spending 62.5% of your time in a catabolic state? No, you won't. Hence some of your issues.

Now obviously, you may be eating more often than that and the above is specifically for the three meal per day people. They have absolutely no idea how far from ideal that diet is for performance purposes. Think about the numbers above, and then think: you're only eating 2300 calories now. How is that spread out? Is there 6-10g of protein for every hour you won't be eating? Are you spending more than 3 hours not eating at a stretch? Do you have tons of different veggies in there? I'm assuming you're getting enough carbs since that's what college cafeterias specialize in, but who knows... are you getting enough carbs?

This thought process will help you get what you want, and perhaps understand why things were how they were and part of why your bones broke.

Again, I will suggest strongly that you consult with a registered dietician who specializes in working with athletes. It will be more than worth it.

As always, this is not medical advice. Not all professionals are up to speed with all the research, but it is important to see them because in general they do good things for people. And they have liability insurance, which I do not. Anything you do as a result of this post is at your own risk. This is for informational purposes only.

Man.

Would it be easier for someone like me to bulk up? I'm not that tall, 5'6" 1/2 to 5'7".

Hah. I'm 5'6" myself and having bulked up to 205ish personally I can say for me it was not easy, but there are so many factors to the ability to gain muscles that are genetic. Could right a book on this easily and still not answer the question really.

Cover the basics of nutrition and a smart training plan and see how your body responds then adapt to what happens. One thing you learn as you work with more and more people is how varying the responses to stimulus can be. One plan will NOT work optimally for everyone, period. The basics are the basics start there and adjust to produce desired results.

I had given up on this post long ago, but thank you for the responses, everyone.

Blairbob, I was in capoeira, aikido, and soccer (goalkeeper). For legs, I am currently doing jumping pistol squats onto a knee-height bench with 30 lbs weighted vest for 5 sets of 3. Would you recommend that I leave that and switch to barbells or were you just recommending weights in general?

I had been toying around with movements and doing a lot of prehab movement after I wrote up my original post. I started an SSC on feb 1st that is as follows:

-15 second tucked back lever then pullout into a 15 second tucked front lever then muscle up (no false grip as I'm still working on flexion flexibility) into 15 second tucked l-sit for 4 sets. Rest 2 minutes between sets.

-10 second frogstands for 6 sets

-various pulling and pushing FBE varies day by day. Usually horizontal rows because they let me better focus on scapular retraction and regular dips on PB.

-5 sets of 10 full hanging leg raises

-5 sets of 3 30lb jump pistols

-scapular retraction, false grip, etc work

active flexibility work

Is this too much too fast?

Slizzardman,

I have been doing Aikido for 4 years so I would say I've mastered the art of falling safely - regardless of musculature. Specifically, I broke my wrists by screwing up a running backflip in a capoeira session. My wrist hyperextended.The radius was shattered and the tip of the ulna broke off. The right wrist sustained a minor hairline fracture on my growth plate which hadn't closed yet. Thank you for the advice though but I probably won't consult someone about my bone health. My surgeon said my bones were healthy and that good enough for me. I'm not an expert, but I think a backflip causes a lot of rotational momentum and horizontal velocity (like a wushu 720 butterfly)? Im guessing all this force traveled down the wrists as they impacted the ground.

About nutrition. I am a full time college student. In a dorm, without a kitchen, and on meal plan. Recently fired..wait..no...laid off ...from my job. While I would really like to eat 6+ meals a day, I don't have the capacity to do so. My bank account showed $120 last week, so minus other living expenses the protein every 3 hours is also out of the mix. I really can only eat 3 meals a day and nothing more than 3 meals a day. Sometimes I could afford groceries so I try to buy fruit in bulk. Do those things count as meals? Or did you mean big meals, not snacks?

This said, I try to get in as much milk as I can every meal. Usually two or three glasses. Like you said, college cafe's specialize in carbs, so milk is the bulk of my fat and protein. Would you suggest I stop eating 3000 calories a day then, considering a lot of it is getting wasted?

Like I said, I don't have an issue with bulking up. I gained roughly 7 lbs since I last wrote here - even though a lot of that could be water or fat or something else I have no knowledge of. In the past, I have noticed that I have a tendency to bulk up easily when I exercise. I don't follow a strict diet. Just milk and carbs. Lots of carbs. Usually three potatoes a day and various grains and veggies (sometimes quinoa) make up the bulk of my carbs.

Here's a great idea...don't land on your hands after spinning and flipping around. Land on your damn legs. Rotational force, mumbo-jumbo, don't land on your damn hands. BWxG-forcexmomentum and goodbye using your hands if you land on them.

Dude, just drink plenty of milk and eggs if you are broke. Supplement with some 80/20 hamburger from TraderJoes or HotDogs. Whatever.

You could eat buckwheat like Sliz does or just make do with ramen and rice, man. Just make sure to eat plenty of veggies because rice+ramen is like asking for constipation. Not so much a problem if you take some fish oil, though.

Eating 6 meals is dandy, but hell 3 is fine. The chinese at their Oly WL camps only eat 3 and laughed at 5-6 saying that takes way too much time out of the day.

Get a mini fridge and a gallon of milk. Maybe a hot plate or Foreman grill. Smuggle some extra food out of the cafeteria if you can.

About nutrition. I am a full time college student. In a dorm, without a kitchen, and on meal plan...While I would really like to eat 6+ meals a day, I don't have the capacity to do so.

Have you tried putting a little extra on your tray and then taking the leftovers with you? If you grab an extra apple or stuff a dinner roll with eggs etc no-one usually criticizes you for quietly taking it away. It may not be as good as a propperly ballanced and measured extra meal, but its better than nothing.

So how do the people in prison get jacked up? They have access to perfect diets and 6+ meals a day?

Warrior said:

So how do the people in prison get jacked up? They have access to perfect diets and 6+ meals a day?

This is what I don't get about a lot of people here on this forum and various bodybuilding and weight loss sites. If you've ever read Convict Conditioning 2, Paul Wade (I don't want to dispose too much information) talk about how we only need 3 meals a day and we don't need to go crazy with protein and strict diets - and Paul is clear evidence of that.

I look at that nutrition page on this website and I see so a lot of people recommending supplements, branched acids, vitamins, omega pills, etc. Never feel hungry! If you're hungry, you ain't gaining! Blah. Somewhere along the line, overdosed nutrition always gets in the way when someone asks about hypertrophy here or anywhere else. My original question wasn't even answered. It was sidelined by "You so damn skinny, guy. Eat this way ~~~". I don't want to insult anyone. I very much appreciate the information, or I would not have replied with other nutrition suggestions. But there are a thousand and one ways to tell me how I'm supposed to eat, and I already stated that nutrition is not a problem. Or "don't jump onto your hands" - which is a quite bloody obvious tip, thank you.

As I said earlier, I know how to bulk up. The actual question still stands. Maybe I didn't make it clear: how does one efficiently combine SSC with FBE and induce moderate to good amounts of hypertrophy at the same time? If no one wants to help with THIS question, then perhaps we should lock the thread.

Do you SSC with FSP and what not. For FBE, use a ramp of easier progressions to sneak in more volume, do the SSC with it if you wish and add in back off sets of an easier progression and higher rep range to focus on hypertrophy.

Or hell, just do German Volume Training. I'm not a fan of it but it worked for my friend and he basically survives somehow on a nil budget in college.

Blairbob said:

Do you SSC with FSP and what not. For FBE, use a ramp of easier progressions to sneak in more volume, do the SSC with it if you wish and add in back off sets of an easier progression and higher rep range to focus on hypertrophy.

Or hell, just do German Volume Training. I'm not a fan of it but it worked for my friend and he basically survives somehow on a nil budget in college.

Thank you.

The German Volume training looks very interesting.

I have no idea about anything concerning your limits due to your recovering injury... All I can say is I recommend you do as much dynamic strength work in your program as possible for muscle growth when you're bulking. So a nice mix of static holds (FSPs etc) to go along with that, but incorporate as much dynamic strength work in your workouts as you can handle. Talking about the basic mass-builders here. Chins, dips.