Alessandro Mainente Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 hi...this is a problem wich i can't solve still now, also is a a great number of months that i'm training!!!what is the best way to learn/train a skill in term of time!?!?for example, if the objectives are 3 skill on the pommel, How often should I train them (how much time in a session)?and the best way to learn is practice a little bit everydays? or is acceptable 2-3 times a week?i usually train 3 times a week with GB methods, and the other 3 days the breakdance skills (including circles and flares in these days), but i don't know if spend the correct amount of time for a single skill, so i can't know if I could learn faster!!!someone wich have more exeperience in session/programmed training maybe can help me to solve this little problem!!thanks for the answers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Chubb Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 This would depend on you and your work capacity. If you attempt ten flairs and feel your form beginning to degrade then you maybe stop at 8 or 9. That way you never create bad habits. Of course, that is only one method I use to keep my form good. I have also done the complete opposite and tired myself out before I practice that way I don't muscle my way through moves. It is up to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandro Mainente Posted January 30, 2011 Author Share Posted January 30, 2011 for example the are some skill, in gymnastics and breaking (like back handspring or airflare, wich i'm training) that in the beginning is possible to do only one round/rep of them in a row...so how many times or for how much time is acceptable to try them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philip Chubb Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Well if that was the case I would do warm up, then practice the skills, then workout and then prehab. The practice would be however much you feel good with. Experiment and find out how many you can do with good form. After that move on to your workout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandro Mainente Posted January 31, 2011 Author Share Posted January 31, 2011 usually when i'm training for these skill i don't do the workout, because i do it in the oher 3 days and maybe it take to me to much time...think that only for the total body warm-up i take about 30-40 minutes...often the skills i training are correlated, for example, backhandspring, circles/flairs, airflairs, mill to airflair....in this situation (when i don't have to do the workout) i put only my resistance on these skill, flair for example i can do 5-6 rounds with good form in a row but training it for to much minutes takes me to much energy for the airflair, and mill to airflair...so i usually take 15 minutes for everyskills and if i do a skill with no perfect form before the 15 minutes i pass to another...this is what i do but i don't know if is the best way...in the end of session i do a lot of PNF strecth for total body... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 The easiest solution is to never train to failure of good form. Pick numbers of rounds that you KNOW you can do, like if you can do 6 flairs then only do 2-3 and stop as soon as you think a round is feeling a little difficult. This keeps your CNS from fatiguing AND it reinforces the proper movements since you will never be doing it wrong.Skills are not where you build endurance, they are where you build efficiency of movement. As you become more efficient you will be able to do more with less energy expenditure. Your body will slowly adapt with more muscle as you need it, but most of your adaptations for endurance and strength will come from conditioning exercises, which should be totally different if possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandro Mainente Posted February 1, 2011 Author Share Posted February 1, 2011 so following what you said...if i'm training with GB programs i can increase my endurance?now, if i think...when i'm training with my friends in breaking i'm the only one wich train for 1.5/2 hours no stop... i never thougth that the conditioning can be so helpful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 You will get much more endurance from GB style stuff or anything else that does not have a strong skill component. Weighted slow arm circles, crab walks and circle walks are some really specific endurance activities that would benefit your flairs, along with GB WOD work. It's too time consuming for me to just write the whole thing out, but you will find that you are easily able to perform better and better if you keep everything pretty far away from failure when training skills. It's the same basic concept as the SSC, which works quite well for the FSP as well. Let the strength exercises increase your strength and the endurance days increase your endurance, and just focus on perfection when training skills. You can't be perfect when you are tired, so never train skills to where you are tired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandro Mainente Posted February 2, 2011 Author Share Posted February 2, 2011 You will get much more endurance from GB style stuff or anything else that does not have a strong skill component. Weighted slow arm circles, crab walks and circle walks are some really specific endurance activities that would benefit your flairs, along with GB WOD work. It's too time consuming for me to just write the whole thing out, but you will find that you are easily able to perform better and better if you keep everything pretty far away from failure when training skills. It's the same basic concept as the SSC, which works quite well for the FSP as well. Let the strength exercises increase your strength and the endurance days increase your endurance, and just focus on perfection when training skills. You can't be perfect when you are tired, so never train skills to where you are tired.no problem for the answer Slizz, you wrote the essential Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted February 3, 2011 Share Posted February 3, 2011 Let me know how that works out for you please! You should notice that this works very well. As you maintain your skills through perfect practice you should notice that they get easier and easier as the strength and endurance you build from conditioning sessions increases! In a way, your skills practice becomes the best measure of how your conditioning is working for you. You should be getting stronger and better in your skills practice without seeming to try very hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandro Mainente Posted February 3, 2011 Author Share Posted February 3, 2011 no problems...i'll tell you how this mothod works for me!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandro Mainente Posted February 7, 2011 Author Share Posted February 7, 2011 as i promised i tell you...after 3 days of training, i've increased the number of flair from 3 to 6, not perfect but i don't pike the hips on the back (passing from planche position) and from 1 round of elbowairflare to 3 in only one week...I did not think that the GB programs would be so helpful in order to increase strength and endurance!!!today i got the last improvements, and i was surprised of it!my goal was increase the time of the full BL hold! 6 weeks ago was max 12 sec...i think wasn't so bad!!i was folowing for the basic static position the progression on 60 sec tuck, after 60 flat tuck, 15 sec straddle, 15 sec 1/2 full lay, and full BL...the same for PL and FL...only for my curiosityi've tried a method to increase the BL work (that i had just achieved) using the embedded cycle of the GB book for about 6-8 week...today..at the end of the 6th week...i did only one hold!!! to not miss the time i've filmed myself, and i hold the full BL for 41-42 seconds!!! maybe for a professional gymnast is normal...but for me that i'm a beginner is a incredible gain of time...in terms of strength and endurance!!! i think that if i do the hold at the beginning i can do it better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joshua Naterman Posted February 8, 2011 Share Posted February 8, 2011 That's awesome! Killer back lever!!! Are you doing full lay PL and FL too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alessandro Mainente Posted February 8, 2011 Author Share Posted February 8, 2011 unfortunately in front lever and planche i'm not so strong as BL, maybe i have a lack of strength in my shoulder, in the last month i've just finish to develop the straddle press to handstand!with the PL i progress more slowly, now I have a straddle planche for max 7-8 sec if i try it at the beginning of the training, i can slow down from handstand to straddle planche but i'm far far far away from the full planche (wich is my dream...)!!!the same thing i can say for FL...now after i had followed the embedded cycle also for PL and FL (in tucked position), i reach more than 1.15 minutes on tuck PL without problem, and my flat tuck FL is more then one minute as the PL, i'm following your tip of increase the weigthed pullup!!!i've read that for front lever is a great thing perform some sets of front level pulls and for me these are not a problem...BUT i'm finding very difficult the transition from flat tuck front lever to the straddle front lever...and i don'nt know why...usually also if i'm tired i can hold the flat tuck FL for more then 40 sec...but the straddle seems to be impossible...for the PL i think to pass to the next progression (in the next embedded cycle) using the flat tuck PL..maybe i can improve more fast, only with the cycle using the PL tuck i got the strength to do in a row Headstand, push to handstand, go down to tuck PL with straigth arm, hold for 10 sec, press to handstand, go down to headstand...maybe i can't progress because i don't do often a week of unload, but i don't know how i can combine the unload with the embedded cycle!! if the cycle is of 6-8 week, when i can do the unload (that is preferable every 3-4 weeks)? with the unload i'm talking about cut down the volume of 40-60% doing one set for exercise! but in the cycle is preferable do 2-3 set for basic position so i don't know what i have to do at 100%...and for the "breakdance skill day where is not involved the use of rings" what is the best unload?the best thing i can do is explain what i usually do in breakdance skill day..-30-40 minutes warm up fo total body-15 minutes for everyskill, where i usually try a skill for 10-12 times (if i have to get the first round of a skill i try only IT, if i had a round without problem i try to combine it, or try do to multiple rounds)-the skill are windmill to 1990-airflare/elbowairflare-flair/windmill to flare-1990isometrich PNF stretchyou can easily find a video on youtube to get easily an idea of these movements... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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