First Knuckle / Dorsal Push-ups

Yes, Brookfield is the master, and I have learned from his mass-printed feet. Mastery of Hand Strength is a book no serious athlete should be without. Same with Kelso's Shrug book. They have very valuable information that you don't find anywhere else.

One of the best things you can do is a pin-mounted wrist roller. Regular ones are crap, but when you take a pvc pipe and slide it onto a dip bar or a power rack safety pin, you have the perfect wrist roller. You'll want to sand the pvc surface so you can grip it with heavy weight and no slippage, and to attack the rope just learn to tie a proper right angle knot. You could also use a hose clamp to secure the rope. Then you're free to use as much weight as you like.

Thanks guys!

I had read that post of Ido's before, and do read his blog as well... always great stuff.

I have read some of those John Brookfield things too, also great. I've taken Slizzard man's advice from before about doing pull-ups etc... using fingers (as much as I can). Some day I will do thick bar work. But for now, in my simple routine I'm focusing on, I'm following coach's wrist pre-hab routine.

So... my basic question about the first knuckle push-ups is the same. The push-up in the video at 1:45 isn't a push-up, all the kids in the shot simply have their elbows locked, arms straight, and hop up and down on their fingers. No pushing-up. Other than Ido mentioning somewhere else about a more "advanced" version of the first knuckle (ie. going up on the 1st knuckle for the descent of the push-up instead of the ascent), I can't find any description or video of these push-ups anywhere else.

Why am I confused? Because basically when I descend into the lower part of the push-up I find it impossible to transition up on to the first knuckles, I can only do it after pushing all the way back up to the top part of the push-up. Even doing these on knees with piked hips to relieve as much weight as possible, still I can't really do it. I can do it on the wall. But perhaps I'm doing it wrong or have the wrong idea. I've done it on the wall and with knees/piked hips for more than 8 months and still no development, however in that time my wrist push-ups have developed tremendously. So... I think maybe I'm doing it wrong or simply don't understand the movement. I can really feel where/how this exercise is working the forearms/wrist and I think it'll have a big impact on my planche work (which I've been struggling with after hitting a wall about 6 months ago).

If anyone else does do these, could they share their experiences/enlighten me? Thanks again.

I call these first knuckle pushups, the ones on the video@1:45 MCP pushups.

MCP what? MetaCarpalPhalangeal. You end up being supported on the MCP ridge of the hand. Where the fingers seperate from the palm.

I can tell the boys, MCP's and they know what I mean.

It's similar to the difference between shoulder flexion and extension. Much easier to say cat stretch and german hang stretch since shoulder extension is just like a german hang. Or you can call it behind the back or maybe BtB "crab".

slizzardman said:

Yes, Brookfield is the master, and I have learned from his mass-printed feet. Mastery of Hand Strength is a book no serious athlete should be without. Same with Kelso's Shrug book. They have very valuable information that you don't find anywhere else.

One of the best things you can do is a pin-mounted wrist roller. Regular ones are crap, but when you take a pvc pipe and slide it onto a dip bar or a power rack safety pin, you have the perfect wrist roller. You'll want to sand the pvc surface so you can grip it with heavy weight and no slippage, and to attack the rope just learn to tie a proper right angle knot. You could also use a hose clamp to secure the rope. Then you're free to use as much weight as you like.

Can you highlight some of your thoughts on these books? I can see the first one applying to bodyweight training but the other one seems to be focussed on barbell training? Do tell if I am inaccurate based on a quick look.

Kelso's shrug book is primarily covering the importance of moving the scapula with resistance in all planes and directions. You can do shrugs from an inverted hang, a tucked FL or BL if you are strong and certainly with heels or knees on the ground if you are not, you can do them in handstands, you can do them in planche or planche lean, L-sit, dips etc.

The concept, which is that strength training your scapular muscles in all directions will directly improve all of your upper body strength, is solid no matter how the training is accomplished. Weights are in some planes easier to perform correctly, but in the end it is all about your personal motivation. Shrugs are very important.

slizzardman said:

Kelso's shrug book is primarily covering the importance of moving the scapula with resistance in all planes and directions. You can do shrugs from an inverted hang, a tucked FL or BL if you are strong and certainly with heels or knees on the ground if you are not, you can do them in handstands, you can do them in planche or planche lean, L-sit, dips etc.

The concept, which is that strength training your scapular muscles in all directions will directly improve all of your upper body strength, is solid no matter how the training is accomplished. Weights are in some planes easier to perform correctly, but in the end it is all about your personal motivation. Shrugs are very important.

Great. Im glad to have this reply from you. Learnt something completely new. Thanks.

PS: Do see if you can comment on my warmup / mobility / re/pre-hab thread.

Where is it?

slizzardman said:

Where is it?

Here..

Return to BtGB after months of Inujry... Pls advise on the following please:

WARMUP & MOBILITY: Help: My Warmup, Mobility, Prehab/Rehab is TOO Long & Tiring

WORKOUTAdvise on my 1st KillRoy70 derived WORKOUT - Parts tried 1-2 weeks

Now my signature also

The Youtube link to first knuckle pushups is not there anymore. Does anyone have the resources to post an example video of First Knuckle and Dorsal Push-ups? I would love to see it. Thanks!

Crap, that kid had some good videos including the TOPS series.

Can you redo some of that stuff, Sliz? I don't have a camera anymore since I'm not working at a gym.

Blairbob said:

Crap, that kid had some good videos including the TOPS series.

Can you redo some of that stuff, Sliz? I don't have a camera anymore since I'm not working at a gym.

Seriously- why delete a YouTube account if you've got valuable content on it? Just leave it up, man!

My confusion with the first knuckle push up comes with the description. I looked at ldo's channel and couldn't reconcile it with that. When I read it, it sounded like the first knuckle curled under, so that the fingernails would be on the ground. But in the video it just looks like the palms come off the ground and the practitioner elevates onto the fingertips...

My bad, that old TOPS wrists and ankles video is still up. I'm not sure which one was taken down but it's all good.

Blairbob said:

My bad, that old TOPS wrists and ankles video is still up. I'm not sure which one was taken down but it's all good.

Are you talking about trianglechoke7's video? Because that one appears to be gone.

Ok, I'm going to just point something out real quick. Slizzardman has stated his position and reasons why, and everyone else has stated theirs with respective reasons. If the Dorsal Pushups are indeed the same as the Wrist Pushups that are in the Gymnasticbodies Youtube video(Not blairbobs Future Stars one), why does Coach state them here as 2 separate things?

viewtopic.php?f=17&t=61&start=15

Coach Sommer said:

Begin with Dorsal Pushups, then Wrist Pushups, then First Knuckle, then Finger Pushups and finally Fingertip Hopping.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

Dorsal push ups are totally different. Anatomically speaking, it is a terrible name since dorsal push ups are not performed on the dorsal aspect of the hand (which is the back of the hand), but it is what it is.

My fault. I just saw where this was resolved about halfway down the second page. Apologies for any time wasted.