My New Year's Resolution: Conquer HS PE2 iM

Everyone likes making New Year's resolutions, right?  Well, here's mine.  I'm going to do everything I can to finally complete PE2 iM.

 

Short story, I started in June 2014, though I didn't take HS elements very seriously.  More accurately, I was more worried about the balancing aspects, as I sucked at them, so I didn't really focus or use much attention to detail on the iMs.  I thought my mobility was improving, as the bar got higher, but I was cheating by leaning or rounding my shoulders or so many other things.

 

It was only when the Bridge stretch series was released and I saw what Orench could do and I could not that I realized I needed a lot of work.  Then in the H3 thread Coach mentioned how we as a whole were not treating our mobility seriously enough.  That clicked for me.

 

I have religiously performed my H1 workouts twice a week for about 8 months now, but the results have been slow.

 

 

To get the bar shoulder high, my grip is wider than the camera can take in.

 

 

Here is my current max height with hands about shoulder width, so mastery standard.

 

 

The scary part is that I was worse eight months ago.  I've improved, but I don't think two H1 sessions a week, with one Bridge stretch session, is giving me enough stimulus, not if I want to master it in my lifetime.

 

Over the last two or so weeks, I've added some extra mobility work on my off days.  I have all the Foundation courses, so I have been going through all the unweighted HBP mobility elements.  My shoulders certainly feel happier at this extra attention, so I'm hoping that will lead to some results.

 

Also, randomly throughout the day, I do some sub-maximal stretching.  When I walk, I try to swing the arms straight back instead of back and to the side.  When I'm waiting in line I will clasp my hands behind my back and perform the following stretch, which feels similar to the iM.

 

 

I figure if I can bring my hands to shoulder height in this position, then iM won't be far along.  The arms are virtually at the same angle.

 

I know lots of people struggle with this iM.  I'll keep everyone updated on my progress, sharing what is working.  If you have any tips or encouragement, please send them my way, as I'll need them!  With any luck, I'll look back in 2017 and laugh at how rigid I used to be.

 

That's my goal.  2016 will be the year of mobility.

That's great! I'm working on these too (unweighted at the moment, I don't have any weight as I'm on vacation, and I'm just coming back from rehabbing my shoulder impingement), and I've found that focusing on the Scapula position is the key for this exercise to feel it in the upper body and to have the right elbow position. Really focus on depressing and retracting the scapula. Even unweighted, at a wide grip I feel it in my upper back muscles. Maybe another goals would be those RC progressions? Looking at what you're on those seem to be lagging a bit behind everything else. Just read the Scapular Postion for F1 exercises and its quoted that the RC progressions should be a priority for F1-2. Maybe add in some extra sets of a harder element on some rest days. (maybe Feet Elevated Rows for you) They are harder progression, thus making regular rows easier. (also Remember to do easier progressions for a warmup, ex. Hinge Rows)

I also had problems with this iM, even thoug I started with a deficit in shoulders extension lower than yours.

Nevertheless I spent months without see any improving until I started adding supplementary mobility work.

 

There is no way to overcome a serious mobility deficit  in this exercise by sheer muscolar force alone, even if it

were possible it would require years for an adult and I think this is a point of the course where there is a

strong need for a review.

 

What worked for me is adding shoulder extension stretches but with an active work by the muscles elogated, by contracting

them in the stretched position and making them working against it, I achieved better results compared to those of a

passive stretching alone.

I started with some sets of dips with foot on the ground and legs bent, the main purpose was not to reinforce the pectoral and triceps

muscles but to build range of motion in the extension of the arm behind the back.

Then I added a stretch similar to the MN/SE11 iM, the Shoulder Extesion Pull, but starting with legs bent, like the table position,

and keeping the arms slightly bent especially at first, to scale down the exercise for the elbows and this made definitely the difference.

 

So before every set of shoulder extensions I performed a set of the stretch above, like an iM for the iM, and finally started

to progress.

With time I added a static pause of the extendend position and I started to bend the arms less and to keep them straight, this is necessary if you have tight biceps, and I try to keep the hands as close as possible each other.

 

Now I am almost at mastery, and it took much less time than all I've wasted in unproductive attempts before.

 

So I strongly suggest to you to follow a similar path, for me it was the salvation from what would have been

an endless stalemate.

You should buy the thoracic bridge series, read the gb article on shoulder extension, and do myofascial release on the pecs and back muscles.

As a light limber and stretch,  try clasping your hands and extending like you do in your last photo, but then bending over into a standing pike or pancake stretch. I generally add this stretch into my cool-down for the evening with a light weight (2-3 kg) in my hands. 

 

Good Luck!

For me It helped with adding

Table rocks

MN Se 15 im. Do it with the same stick as you use in the HS iM2

Supine shoulder extension from the TB stretch series

^^ what Mats said + I had to use German hangs to get the required mobility. Not recommended, but there you go.

Thank you everyone for the suggestions and encouragements.  My current routine is basically:

 

Bridge series once a week.

Two dedicated mobility days a week.

H1 twice a week, plus extra mobility depending on time.

F7 twice a week, with extra mobility afterwards depending on time.

Daily attention to posture and sub-maximal stretches whenever I have time.

 

All in all, I've averaging between 5-6 mobility days a week, and my shoulders really like it so far.  For mobility, I'm doing most of the HBP iM progressions and lighter versions of the first few TB series.  I don't know if my shoulders have improved, but they feel happier, if that makes sense.

 

Mats, with your suggestions of the MN SE15 iM, do you suggest holding my hands wide or shoulder width on the bar?

Sensei JP said:

 

Mats, with your suggestions of the MN SE15 iM, do you suggest holding my hands wide or shoulder width on the bar?

Thats what I do. Shoulder wide + à hand or two.

A combination of HBP15/im and regular 15r table rocks / supine shoulder extensions in warmup changed my shoulder extension completely. I then moved towards the mn/ims to open the rest of it up, but got the biggest and earliest changes from the biceps stretches. It now feels like all strength for me, rather than trying to 'pry' open the mobility.

And keep good control (as I am sure you already are); its easy to develop a slightly off position or a lack of external rotation, and while it is a fast fix once pointed out it creates annoying downtime

Jon, I don't see how the HBP15/IM would help with shoulder extension?

Vanny,

shoulder extension limitation can come from pec / bicep or delt immobility.

then there's the whole ymmv thing

As K said, pec tightness. Im13/14 gets into pec major and I barely felt that; pec minor im 15/16 absolutely ruined me.

Jon Douglas said:

As K said, pec tightness. Im13/14 gets into pec major and I barely felt that; pec minor im 15/16 absolutely ruined me.

ditto.

Jon Douglas said:

As K said, pec tightness. Im13/14 gets into pec major and I barely felt that; pec minor im 15/16 absolutely ruined me.

Jon, which Foundation course do you feel has better mobility drills. I'm very close to having the money needed to buy one more foundation course ($10 off) and while I wont be able to do the strength elements, doing some of the extra mobility would certainly help. I'm asking in general, not just for HBP. But overall, for all 7, which course do you feel has good mobility drills?

Lots of good info here! I'm at a similar point in this movement as you Sensei. This iM in the past has tended to cause flare ups in my shoulder in the area of my AC joint ( biceps attachment?), so now I mostly focus on the supplementary exercises mentioned above. I've found that closed chain exercises like table or shoulder extension pulls allow me to go into shoulder extension without causing pain and with better ROM so I use those to work on my muscle activation and the static pec/bicep stretches to open me up. Here are a couple additional things I have been enjoying lately.

Banded shoulder extension, to help my retraction. Props to Kelly Starret.

https://youtu.be/IfLJFi_izGA

Bucket extensions, cause they're fun and make my traps feel good

https://youtu.be/srODRTgFZPY

Dylan Robertson said:

Jon, which Foundation course do you feel has better mobility drills. I'm very close to having the money needed to buy one more foundation course ($10 off) and while I wont be able to do the strength elements, doing some of the extra mobility would certainly help. I'm asking in general, not just for HBP. But overall, for all 7, which course do you feel has good mobility drills?

I really couldn't describe a 'better' set of mobility drills-- if you have no bridge, F4 FLims are going to crush you.of course, but it gets more subtle than that. F4 RC and Mn ims could easily be downright dangerous if one jumped headfirst into them. SLS, SL and HBP not so much, but unless you are working on a specific issue its hard to pick which drills will be real game changers vs. Regular slow, steady improvement.

That said, assuming you are already working your cureent level in foundation mobility, which covers a LOT, as well as stretching well, imo H1 for shoulders and H2 for pike/pancake are the best mobility bundles. There are just too many factors in picking a foundation course for this purpose as the whole point is to treat it as one progressive course in seven streams

Sorry, I don't have an easy answer here.... what I need at different stages, and possibly as I am learning even week to week depending what else I train, may be quite different from what someone else needs

tl:dr;

Do the mobility you need to now; do it harder or more frequently if necessary; look for alternative possible limiting factors if it does not respond

Jon Douglas said:

I really couldn't describe a 'better' set of mobility drills-- if you have no bridge, F4 FLims are going to crush you.of course, but it gets more subtle than that. F4 RC and Mn ims could easily be downright dangerous if one jumped headfirst into them. SLS, SL and HBP not so much, but unless you are working on a specific issue its hard to pick which drills will be real game changers vs. Regular slow, steady improvement.

That said, assuming you are already working your cureent level in foundation mobility, which covers a LOT, as well as stretching well, imo H1 for shoulders and H2 for pike/pancake are the best mobility bundles. There are just too many factors in picking a foundation course for this purpose as the whole point is to treat it as one progressive course in seven streams

Sorry, I don't have an easy answer here.... what I need at different stages, and possibly as I am learning even week to week depending what else I train, may be quite different from what someone else needs

tl:dr;

Do the mobility you need to now; do it harder or more frequently if necessary; look for alternative possible limiting factors if it does not respond

Looking at the courses and seeing how much each course had in progressions wise for the different elements that I feel I need to work on (SLS, RC, HBP) I'm gonna go with F2, and that makes sense because it's the next step after F1, so I'll be ready to go as soon as I complete F1. I Already own H1, so I'm working on those mobility drills, and it'll be a long way before I'm ready to start H2 in terms of handstand ability, and I'm already working on my Pike, Pancake and MS with stretch courses.

Dylan Robertson said:

Looking at the courses and seeing how much each course had in progressions wise for the different elements that I feel I need to work on (SLS, RC, HBP) I'm gonna go with F2, and that makes sense because it's the next step after F1, so I'll be ready to go as soon as I complete F1. I Already own H1, so I'm working on those mobility drills, and it'll be a long way before I'm ready to start H2 in terms of handstand ability, and I'm already working on my Pike, Pancake and MS with stretch courses.

Sounds like the way to go

One month update.

 

I've been hitting my shoulders with mobility work about five times a week, and they have never felt better.  I've discovered new ROM and, more importantly, it seems easier to get there.

 

Somewhere, Coach mentioned how the body starts to crave mobility work, like a plant soaking up water.  That's how my shoulders feel.  Last week, I had a rest day, then two really long work days.  I went those three days without doing any mobility, and by the end of the third day my body started to complain.  "Hey, what are you doing?  Where's our mobility?!"  I won't be making that mistake again.

 

I've shown improvement in the iM:

 

 

As well as the hands-clasped together stretch (pretty big improvement here, actually):

 

 

True, it's not mastery yet, but it's about as much improvement as I could expect in a month, I imagine.  Also, I should add that the MN iM that Mats suggested feels FANTASTIC when done at just over shoulder-width distance.  I could live in that position if I weren't worried I was overdoing a weighted stretch.

Nice progress!

Another thing that helped me immensely after the mobility work had prepared the way is to increase the load even if I wasn't at mastery level.

Usually I trained with a weight of 1.5-2kg but when I increased it gradually to 4.5kg it made an incredible difference in the muscles activation, and the 2kg weight become so light that in only three training session I used to increase the weight I reached the horizontal position of the arms with it.

It seems that to 'reawaken'  the muscles needed for this exercise it occurs to pass a certain value of the weight used.

 

There would seem a logic to it that you do need a minimum of weight to get the muscles to activate properly. I am currently still on HS/PE1-iM due to ridiculously tight shoulders and will probably be so for another few cycles. I am currently using only 2kg on that iM too. If I get stuck for too long I may increase the weight. Nice one Stefano Baral

If I can't reach the end range of motion, is it better to keep hands shoulder+hands width and slowly try to raise the arms higher as I work the mobility or should I strive to keep the hands the widest necessary that allows me to reach 'mastery' level ROM and then slowly bring my hands inward to shoulder width? Given the way in which we're supposed to HS/PE1>im I am thinking that we attempt this >im in the former manner, but I am unsure. Thanks in advance.

March update.  Today is actually my birthday (good thing Thrive gets Sunday off, because I have a lot of chocolate heading my way!), and I was kinda hoping I'd give myself the present of shoulder extension.  Well, not quite, but I'm getting closer, millimetre by millimetre.

I'm about 10 degrees away from horizontal, but I imagine it's like the splits, where the final few inches are the hardest to overcome.  I've been a little lax over March to my mobility, just because of life, but with March Break and Easter winding down I should be be back to normal.  Maybe I can have that shoulder extension by the summer.

Daniel, I do four sets with arms wider than mastery width, whatever allows me to get to horizontal.  On my final set, and for these photos, I go to mastery width, as it feels slightly different and I want to hit both positions.