Question

Seeing benefits from GTG with sPL/PE1. Any reason to think why hip extensions for MN/PE2 and seated wall extensions for HS/PE1-im wouldn't help in much the same way?

I'm trying to work on straddle compression, which is non-existent and stems from hamstring tightness (I've gathered) and a lack of hip flexion strength. I'm also, still, sadly working on shoulder flexion (which ends up sounding like rice krispies on that -im) after going back and forth on this -im since I purchased H1 in August of 2014. I also incorporate mobilities from F2 and F3 for HBP, to help open the shoulder and stretch the biceps (not going to go into too much detail on that out of respect for this forum being only Foundation 1).

I'm just trying to get past PE1 or PE2, and it is taking time. Thoughts appreciated, from GB athletes, coaches and advanced students alike.

Thanks.

I've experimented more pain with wall  extension when I was tight compared to now. if you struggle with PE1 of H1 you can experiment my same problem.

Sorry, do you mean to say experience? Or experiment? Just want to clarify, because they have different meaning, I gather though that you may mean to say experience and that since I'm having pain with HS/PE1>im, I'll likely have pain with the wall extensions (which I do, well, I mean to say I have to do them supine on the floor and the ROM is limited). I'm just trying to figure out what works for fixing this mobility issue, because I've been working on it for too damn long. 

How much are you compensating your lack of mobility with appropriated stretching session? 

I do TBs, FSs, and MSs once per week. I do a daily limbering in the morning to shake off the sleep. I focus on the -ims I've mastered (FL/PE1>im; HBP/PE1>im; RC/PE1>im; sPL/PE1>im; SLS/PE1>im, PE2>im, PE3>im) and some >ims for the shoulders as I mentioned in the OP (being from Foundation 2 and Foundation 3 for HBP). I do these lightly as I'm just trying to wake up and not make any gains in mobility, just trying to get my blood flowing and my nervous system turned on.

Thus far, however, I'm still seeing some discomfort in my shoulder flexion and I'm not sure how to handle it. I currently do the HS/PE1>im with 2.5lbs but getting it to shoulder height is difficult and not always comfortable. I keep my hands close to shoulder width, as I reckon it's not a dislocate and so the hands should be shoulder-width, but I don't see any light at the end of the tunnel (i.e. comfort, ability to hold the position for the time), that would indicate micro-progress. I'm not looking to ace the mobility, I'm just looking for tools that will allow me to do it pain-free and to then make the necessary, gradual improvements so that I can do the >im at mastery, with 5lbs for 5 sets of 10 seconds.

I also have been trying to do seated straddle leg lifts to work on active straddle flexibility but I felt like I was going to tear my lower abdominals from the cramping, and that in some cases there was minor popping (which I know can lead to a hernia). So, I'm considering transferring this out and doing hip extensions as Coach mentioned in a post years back, to try and work on active hip strength to help with my straddle up while I continue to improve on Jefferson Curls. 

The wall extension and hip extensions, I would likely include in my workouts for the time being, since there is a strong strength aspect necessitated and because Coach mentioned only using them a couple times per week. But were I to improve with them I might include them in my morning limbering/warm-up. 

If any of this seems like a bad idea or if there exist better ideas, please let me know. I am just aware that thus far the F1/H1/SS structure as planned isn't helping with these two issues and so I've had to guess at how best to self-correct for these weaknesses. 

Because you have been stuck in HS/PE1>iM for long time I would like to see if you have tight lats, record a video of your self hanging from a bar fully relax with open shoulders and a straight body. If your lats are okay you should look like this, probably not that deep but at least with shoulders at ears like headphones.

Is it acceptable if my arms aren't that muscular? Lol

What you are doing is admirable but do not forgot that if you don't find a solution for your problem probably you are working around it and not on it. have your ever had a physio visit in order to have a clear view about your shoulder problem? shoulder problems in the most of cases are a consequence of imbalances, for this reason something in your shoulders is very tight. you need to discover it and work on it specifically.

I've gone to a physio and he was stumped as my range of motion wasn't limited and wasn't painful when he had me move my arms through space and would apply some counterpressure. I can bring my arms overhead but not really 'behind my head' and when I add weight to the mix my shoulders begin to do the whole cracking thing and feel some discomfort in what seems the front deltoid (I say seems because I know that there are many muscles in the shoulder, so to say which it is specifically is beyond me, but it is in that region).

how is your shoulders extension?

Here are videos of me hanging. 

Video #1

Video #2

Shoulder extension with the bar? It's not great though I haven't been focusing on it (since I wanted to master PE1>im first). I can get my arm up to like 60-70 degrees, so not parallel.

Our range of motion is limited if we can not complete HSPE1/iM with weight​ and without pain.  ​A typical physical therapy exam does not assess ROM in this position.  GB prescriptions challenge the norms found in physical therapy graduate school teachings.  I continue to look forward to Alessandro and other's feedback for you;  as this may be more accurate for your specific circumstance.

Yeah, when I visited the physiotherapist that's what I gathered. He was basically like "you're fine, but thanks for the money..." and I was like "no sir, I'm not okay, you don't get it. HS/PE1>im is not attainable for me at mastery..what can I do to fix it!". So, basically, what I gathered from visiting the physio is that for the average person I don't have any shoulder issues but in terms of GST, when I apply weight and go overhead with shoulder width grip, it's not pain-free.

Edit: So, to my other question, would the hip extensions be a coherent approach to fixing the lacking straddle compression for MN/PE2? I need to bring my hips closer to vertical and thought this a good exercise to incorporate to fix this.

So, does anyone have any potential solutions? Or should I stay the course and keep at it? I'm not looking for any silver bullets, but just tools that can adequately help fix my issues pain-free. Thanks, for the input so far.

Again, I'm referring to MN/PE2 and HS/PE1>im.

MY pov of about overhead movement is that when there is balance between muscles with no previous alterations the arthrokinematics  (that is how, what and when an unit works along certain force lines) is pain-free. on the other side if there are imbalances the arthrokinematics could present alterations and this leads to pain. I will show for you here a simple test you can do and tell us the result.

-you need to lie on the floor in supine position

-hold feet on floor with knee angle no more than 90°

-arms over head straigth  near the ears

- do not arc the lower back. it's imperative to push the lower backl into the floor.

DO the test with feet at 90°, then with legs extended completely

i would like a photo of the view from the ceiling and from the side (phone on the floor).

Ps: be accurate on the test position

Daniel Taylor-Shaut said:

Here are videos of me hanging. 

 

Video #1

 

Video #2

Looks good !  Does the position feels comfortable to you ? I was asking because one of my friends that workouts with me has tight lats and it's what gives him issues with getting full shoulder flexion.

Hi Daniel

I have been fighting through what seems to be a very similar problem for the last 6 months. HS Pe1 im at shoulder width causes a pain in my right shoulder. Almost like I'm pinching something. I don't feel the correct muscles working even though I get close to arms at 180. When I perform Alessandro's test it was very revealing. My left arm just naturally touched the floor with everything from wrist to shoulder touching. My right arm could barely touch the floor like something was tight holding it back. I found a very good ART practioner and after a few sessions he was able to release a lot of tension in the muscles in and around my scapula which have allowed me to get my right arm to touch the floor much easier in Alessandro's test. I am nowhere near healed yet but I feel I'm on my way. What I have found helpful is doing passive back bends over a foam roller. This has improved my thoracic mobility which has helped my scapula move better and to get in better position. You have Thoracic series which I'm sure has similar stuff. I'm looking to get that soon in hopes it will help me further. Also I've very carefully attempted HS pe1/im and find if I keep my hands a little further apart than shoulder width I feel the trap muscles working better. I think the problem is if your arms have uneven flexibility one arm pulls the other arm back further then comfortable and it causes pain. Not sure if you're still in NY but if you are and you would like to see the ART practioner you can PM me and I can give you his info. I'll be carefully watching this thread cause it's very frustrating working for months on very basic exercises and not being able to do them correct and pain free.

Hey, so I just did the test, I've found that I can get my left arm down with knees bent and legs extended. I've also found that the right arm hurts in this position specifically in the right shoulder in the area where the shoulder and bicep meet. Getting the right shoulder to the floor is difficult but I can get my elbow and wrist down to the floor (but it's an odd angle since the shoulder is uncomfortable). 

Chuchodani, the hanging positions were comfortable, yes. Supine on the floor however and actively bringing my arms back was not comfortable.

Sounds like a tight pec minor, especially with the test results that you describe.

Without photos I can't judge. video is better btw.

Alexander Egebak said:

Sounds like a tight pec minor, especially with the test results that you describe.

So to handle this? I stretch.....

Yes, try lying on your stomach and reach out with your arms to the sides. Now while touching the floor with your arm raise it 20 degrees upwards. Next roll on to your hips while touching with before-mentioned arm. The other arm should reach behind your back as a counter weight. You should feel this stretch in your pec minor and shoulder capsule.

Here are photos from each angle.

Alexander Egebak said:

Yes, try lying on your stomach and reach out with your arms to the sides. Now while touching the floor with your arm raise it 20 degrees upwards. Next roll on to your hips while touching with before-mentioned arm. The other arm should reach behind your back as a counter weight. You should feel this stretch in your pec minor and shoulder capsule.

The side chest stretch, no?