Shoulder pain

When the pain settles post a picture or video of your son at the top of sPL/PE1. So with the scapulae protracted.

I have had a lot of patients who in this position are so weak the scapula are winging. To correct this they could only do 3x3 reps for 6-12 months. Some are so weak in the serratus anterior they can only do scapula shrugs on a bench or against the wall. I like to think of these as sPL/PE0.25 and 0.5. I get to see the extremely deconditioned on a daily basis.

http://postimg.org/image/3mwj7qbu1/

This was from a week or two back.

This is what the top of the SPL/PE1 would look like, though this is a pic from a plank.

Could you please take a look at the pic? thanks so much!

From that angle it does not look like scapula winging. When the pain settles I would take the full 12 weeks to progress through sPL. At his age there is no hurry.

so full 12 weeks for even pe1? Or could he start at 5/9

Week 1; first month is just getting back into the swing of things and not blowing it up again.

You should be really careful. You are doing a somewhat risky project strength training your son while not being a coach.

Remember, his shoulders will follow him into his adulthood, and the more of a beating they take now (and without having it corrected) the more trouble will he have later on.

I would rather intentionally stall progress to be completely sure whether or not you two are doing things right, than flying through the programs and thereby take risks which can affect the well being of your son later in life.

I would stick at week 1 until he can do that pain free. It is not exciting, but he needs to master each week pain free. At his age he has time on his side.

Okay. We don't understand one thing: when you say pain free, do you mean with 0 discomfort in terms of not having to strain at all?

I forgot to mention only time clavicle/pec pain happens is in full protraction, and shoulder pain doesn't really happen now.

No bad pain. If it is just muscle working then you can push to a high intensity. If it is a muscle working pain it will stop when the the exercise stops. If the pain is there after the completion of the exercise then do not progress to the next week.

Oh. that's good to know it's only a straining type pain that happens during exercise. he will rest for ~1 week, and because older son is having foot fracture appointment, i will have the younger one checked out (the one with the pec stuff) just in case. Then we'll return to some week 5/9 programming for PE1. Sound like a good plan?

It's basically a kind of "bad" tension pain in the pecs/clavicle that happens in a plank. Strangely, the same problem happens much less when he leans forward. Is this cause for having to go back to week 1 for every element relating to upper body? just curious

btw, unrelated: is it a reasonable goal (he set this on his own, i didn't ) to finish the entire GB curriculm within 5 years?

I would start at week 1 for exercises that cause this symptom around the pecs.

5 years is an achievable goal.

Wouldn't it take him 6 years just for F series if he did all 12 weeks? (Just wondering, he'll start at 1).

We're advising to start from Block 1 now, because of the injury.

In the future this will change.  As you complete mastery of one element, you'll start the next by doing an assessment to determine which block is the appropriate one to start from. In may cases this won't be block 1, so progress may well be faster. 

For a healthy dedicated youth, 5 years is more than possible, but time will tell as you check each PE and SE off this list. Mastering each step, one day at a time has to take priority over any set long term timeframe.

It will all make more sense as you continue with the program

It hurts for him to just protact fully (only fully, not for less). doesn't matter whether he's in a plank or not. what should he do? could it be a pec pull or something? If so, what stretches/therapy can he do? 

How about allowing the body a little time to heal?  It seems to me that most of these questions, though unanswerable now (particularly on an internet forum), will answer themselves and/or become irrelevant if the child is given a chance to get better.  

Could it be this?  Yes.  Might it be that?  Sure.  Would exchanging X for Y, subtracting the iM, and adding in three rounds of rain dancing speed things up?  Who knows.  

When in doubt, follow the program.  When you hurt, rest.  When you're better, get back to following the program.

He is resting... just doing some occasional protraction here and there to gauge whether or not that rest has paid off

But your advice is good. It's just I don't understand why there's pain any time he protracts (fully and with tension, not when he's slightly looser but still almost fully protracted).

Pain with tense protraction may simply indicate an overemphasis on or overzealous training of load bearing/tense protraction.  I can relate to the desire to know (or think you know) a specific anatomical mechanism, but absent an actual injury (and oftentimes even with one), general principles (like those Coach will bust out at the most opportune moments) usually win.

If I were in his situation (actually, when I was in his situation) I spend a lot of time trying to figure out exactly why I was experiencing pain.  It's a worthwhile endeavor for sure, but I got the greatest yields from resting and also from addressing the basic fundamentals of shoulder health (strength the back, stretch the front, roll the pecs, etc.)

Although every case is different, I'd feel remiss if I didn't suggest chest expanders and anterior delt/pec stretching on a daily (or near daily) basis.  I don't claim any scientific support for this at all, but it has absolutely changed my life, both as a specific intervention for a problem as well as for overall health/stability of my shoulders.  

Best of luck!

Thanks! What stretches/resources might you recommend?

Thanks again!

GenericGymnast said:

Wouldn't it take him 6 years just for F series if he did all 12 weeks? (Just wondering, he'll start at 1).

Start at the beginning for your rehab. Move slowly. As you become better trained your progress will likely speed up.

Since you earlier mentioned you think it's bursitis and now that he only feels pain which full protraction, that is most likely caused be not also depressing the shoulder while protracting. 

Essentially the head of the humous will ride up a bit in and hit the inflamed bursa.

Simple standing, raising the arms shoulder height, protracting and depressing is an easy place to start. He should be able to make the pain go away.

However, we still need to get that bursitis calmed down.

Also, have you taken him to a physiotherapist? This is an internet forum after all with all it's inherent limitations of being able to properly diagnose, and treat injury.

GenericGymnast said:

Thanks! What stretches/resources might you recommend?

Thanks again!

I don't mean to be blunt, but you have the resources. You just need to be patient, follow the advice and seek medical help.

Remember that pain in one location does not always mean that is the cause. Pain is a warning signal from the brain, it is not in the tissues of the body. So we need to be mindful that the pain is telling us something is not right, but not stress so much about it.

Without seeing your son in person we cannot give you any more than has been suggested.

Cole, your depression trick was amazing! He planked and did the standing drill and  the pain was nonexistent! Thank you SO much. 

When he depresses, there's a little stretch feeling on the top of his shoulder. Is that normal? I imagine so...