Cross Form Check

Almost there???

i'd say not close

Form looks alright, but you didn't even hold it at all.

Where are you with the rest of your ring strength? You should have a ring handstand as an absolute minimum before you start any cross training.

https://www.gymnasticbodies.com/forum/topic/8084-preparing-the-elbows-and-biceps-for-iron-cross-training/

You just have to hit pause if you want to see me hold it, haha.  

Just wanted to make sure I'm heading down the right path in terms of form.

I am well aware of the recommended prereqs.

thenail001 said:

Just wanted to make sure I'm heading down the right path in terms of form.

 

I am well aware of the recommended prereqs.

Corrected. 

It's not about form, it's about the right prep. Even with perfect form you'll destroy your elbows without the correct conditioning.

So the answer to your question on form is, show us your ring planche variations. 

For some reason I could only get the video to upload at 10x speed! (jk)

thenail001 said:

 

For some reason I could only get the video to upload at 10x speed! (jk)

Needs some work.  Id like to see a press from L into planche before learning cross.  That and pressing to Handstand show that you can handle some more straight arm movements on the rings.

thenail001 said:

you didn't hold it thought

what is your bodyweight?

Somewhere around 160-165#

korija said:

you didn't hold it thought

I counted 2 seconds.  Or am I missing something?   I know he's checking his form, but can we not give him some credit for the strength displayed?

As others have said, it looks as though you need to spend more time on the pre-reqs before actively training the cross, but if you're just trying it out to see where you're at strength wise you're looking pretty strong.  

And I know coach would say 2 seconds of improper form isn't 2 seconds worth counting; which I should agree with so I will.

Since I'm not yet training crosses I'm not going to advise you on them

Congrats on your first hold though, that must feel good

Yea it was cool... I had a specific reason to try to test myself that day.  Actually it was more than cool

I often wonder the background of people offering advice, but most of that is probably my ego.

Take it as well-intentioned and often a necessary ego check, but ensure that in the end you are getting advice from people who are in a position to give it to you

In your position I'd dig hard on Daniels advice in particular and keep crosses for when you feel particularly strong and want to try it rather than programming it into conditioning yet, but we have sources here that can dial in what you need much better than I can

The recommendations I have and what are basically just echos of what I have learned from coach are to give full preparation so you can actually work the skill. Just hitting it for 2 seconds is cool but not the most efficient way to build that strength. Remember we don't want to stop at cross we want Maltese. Always plan ahead and overcompensate with strength.

thenail001 said:

 

I often wonder the background of people offering advice, but most of that is probably my ego.

If you go over the thread I linked to above, you can see Coach's recommendations in his own words. If you spend a bit more time here, particularly if you purchase Foundation and spend more time in the private course forum, you'll get a much better sense of Coach's views on preconditioning.

Foundation may seem like it's 'too easy' your you at this point. But there are some members here who have completely transformed their advanced skills by resetting and focusing on the 'basics'.

Looks good, congrats! Just make sure your shoulders and especially elbows are strong enough to work crosses or you can injure yourself.

Where are you at in other strength elements and can you do a one arm front lever with the body facing sideways?

Thanks.  Yes.  Very much appreciate your comments Daniel, it makes sense. "Just hitting it for 2 seconds is cool but not the most efficient way to build that strength. Remember we don't want to stop at cross we want Maltese. Always plan ahead and overcompensate with strength. "  

Foundations is definitely not too trivial, far from it, I still have many deficiencies and each time I revisit elements I learn something new.

Cannot do a 1 arm front lever, never really been much of an interest of mine.

Oh and PS, I don't want to stop at maltese, I want front lever press victorian  (jk)

thenail001 said:

 

Oh and PS, I don't want to stop at maltese, I want front lever press victorian  (jk)

Haha. That's what I like to hear. Sometimes when I am discouraged at training I will go play in the ring pulley and do front lever Victorians to cheer myself up.

When I am bored I do one-armed overhead deadlift to ring press handstand... in my dreams, which might be weird sometimes.

Its easy to fall in love with applause and cheers from your bros in the gym and YouTube. That cross you did in the video was not held nor did it show a definite stop. This gets no credit per gymnastic code. Your straddle planche was shaky as well.

As much as you may like to check things off of your gymnastic list you also need to keep your ego where you keep your shoes while in the gym. I would much rather see one of my athletes do a solid 5 second Adv tuck planche than a 1 sec straddle planche. Mastery is a strange word that we just don't generally like it seems. We want to go to that next thing so bad we forgot why we were doing this one progression in the first place. While training the cross you should accidentally hold it for your first time. It shouldn't be a camera event where you summon all of your Ki and pretend you have to do this or your girlfriend will die. Keep up the training! You are a very strong dedicated Athlete.

-Ryan

Coach, Judge, Athlete

RyanC said:

Its easy to fall in love with applause and cheers from your bros in the gym and YouTube. That cross you did in the video was not held nor did it show a definite stop. This gets no credit per gymnastic code. Your straddle planche was shaky as well.

 

As much as you may like to check things off of your gymnastic list you also need to keep your ego where you keep your shoes while in the gym. I would much rather see one of my athletes do a solid 5 second Adv tuck planche than a 1 sec straddle planche. Mastery is a strange word that we just don't generally like it seems. We want to go to that next thing so bad we forgot why we were doing this one progression in the first place. While training the cross you should accidentally hold it for your first time. It shouldn't be a camera event where you summon all of your Ki and pretend you have to do this or your girlfriend will die. Keep up the training! You are a very strong dedicated Athlete.

 

-Ryan

Coach, Judge, Athlete

He didn't hold it in the OP video, but he did hold one for 2 seconds in his second video which is below the post with the straddle planche.

To be fair, he didn't say he mastered it. He just said he achieved his first cross on the second video. Achieving a skill and mastering a skill are two different things. Also, a 1 second straddle planche is still much harder than a 5 second adv tuck planche unless you were referring to one with a very wide straddle.

Anyways, how is your cross coming along so far? I remember you were training it 1 or 2 years ago and then stopped for awhile after Coach told you to hold off on it until you got a stronger foundation.

B1214N said:

"He didn't hold it in the OP video, but he did hold one for 2 seconds in his second video which is below the post with the straddle planche."

 

Thats what i was talking about. That wasn't a hold. A hold should show a definite stop and be held for 2 seconds. If i were judging High School then thats a cross. If i'm judging JO or FIG then thats a no credit. I only mention that because i was right there where he was. Just kicking in my 2 cents. Who knows? Maybe he'll take it maybe he won't.

 

 

"To be fair, he didn't say he mastered it. He just said he achieved his first cross on the second video. Achieving a skill and mastering a skill are two different things. Also, a 1 second straddle planche is still much harder than a 5 second adv tuck planche unless you were referring to one with a very wide straddle."

 

To be fair he didn't say that. His situation looked very similar to mine a couple years ago. So i was just keeping the conversation going. You are right. He is a very strong guy. I'm a little mad too because he's only 165#

 

"Anyways, how is your cross coming along so far? I remember you were training it 1 or 2 years ago and then stopped for awhile after Coach told you to hold off on it until you got a stronger foundation."

 

After i stopped training it i had a string of injuries. I pulled a muscle near my lat that literally took a year to heal, i partially tore my biceps after not warming up for my back lever, I hurt my wrist after hitting a curb and flying off my bike. I had to really keep my ego in check to heal. Now i'm about halfway thru Foundation. I almost have my complete pike. So i'm working my Press HS up to ring level before i begin any cross training without support. I play on the dream machine sometimes and do crosses but thats it. This time i'm going too slow. Not rushing at all. I think by November i'll have my press and begin training seriously again. But only after putting it on video so that people as detailed as myself can tell me to do more work on something.