Push ups .... I'm stuck!

jvenna said:

I have tried the opposite approach fore these. After getting tired of always failing on the last few reps I desided to push the endurance envelope by trying to do 5x18 reps. In the beginning I only managed two full sets but now I'm back to where I can do 5 sets. Im still losing the tempo on the last reps but now its the last reps of 5x18. I think that I'll be ready to try mastery soon. Doing the RC PE2 after 5x18 pushups is hell though.

Even though Latestarter banned me from the thread I'll make a no-"that's what she said"-contribution. 

I also added more volume to the sets, so that eventually a workout would look something like this:

19, 18, 16, 13, 12. Once at that level, it was a lot easier to rearrange back to mastery at 5x15.

^

I should clarify, my exercise order is RC, FL, sPL (in first exercise session) then HBP (in second session) on the same day. So I'm fresh for the HBP work.

Later on, when stretching is not taking up so much time, I will string them all (F7) together.

I've also been stuck on pushups, and I'm trying this method:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1BBBq2R1h4

to summarise, you slow down the final repetition's eccentric phase to 30 seconds.  This should hopefully allow one more repetition at the next workout...  will report back how this goes.  

I like the sound of grease the groove approach also.  Is there more info on this somewhere?  Do you do it every day or only on days that you would have worked press ups?

LateStarter@46 said:

^

 

I should clarify, my exercise order is RC, FL, sPL (in first exercise session) then HBP (in second session) on the same day. So I'm fresh for the HBP work.

Later on, when stretching is not taking up so much time, I will string them all (F7) together.

I think separating the upper body elements from each other would effect the hypertrophy you develop.  I think FL, sPL, HBP, and RC elements are paired together for that reason.

So you want to get better at pushups, huh?

Bipocni said:

So you want to get better at pushups, huh?

"I've never done this program; I just made it up on the spot." -quote from video

It's quotes like this that should really cause you to be careful where you get your information from. Lot's of programs might make logical sense or "sound good" in theory and might make you really sore, but unless they have a proven track record, I wouldn't recommend doing them.

Contrast that with Coach mentioning how pretty much all of his athletes can bang out 100+ (the best up in the 300 range if I recall correctly) perfect form push-ups.

Really makes you appreciate that someone with his track record and knowledge has put together a program for us outside of the GST community.

Off topic I know, but that struck me as an important point to mention.

http://journal.crossfit.com/2011/02/volume-training-for-goats.tpl

this is a brian wilson article from the CF journal. Similar to grease groove, etc.  I have found this very helpful for increasing strict muscleup volume. I think the 20 minute or even 15 minute duration,  time frame is important,  as is the timing of these workouts. Doing them either fresh , after a warmup, or after a strength workout (essentially a warmup for the purposes of this training) is also key. Don't do this type of 20 minute training after a WOD and expect it to be useful;

Please take it from someone who has been doing CF for more than 7 years. Reduce number of metcons to 2 a week maximum. Choose exercises that have most carry over and do not tax specific group of muscles do them on the minute for 10-15 min 3-4 times a week (Snatch, trustees, C&P, etc) you will be much stronger, faster, have perfect technique and have plenty of energy left for other activities like gymnastics. As for just push-ups doing ring push-ups 10 on the minute for 10 min makes BW variation feel like nothing.

Since I have trouble with the sets at the later sets rather than beginning sets, would it work if the first sets have less reps while later sets have more reps?

not much time to train last weeks...but i tried one week with f1 and two times more the week just doing hbp/pe 2 with high volume, without fatigue...i did this: 12,10,8,6,4,2 reps =42 reps...it was not really hard, and i felt like hbp will get forward fast with that way. 

i will try it for the next circle and tell whats the result of it. 

Hmms said:

Since I have trouble with the sets at the later sets rather than beginning sets, would it work if the first sets have less reps while later sets have more reps?

Not sure it makes sense, this is a no-stops workout, so you have trouble with later sets because of the first ones.

Removing them won't trigger the problem, but won't give you the conditioning you're looking for either IMHO...

After thinking that I mastered pushups, I filmed myself for a form check. Upon watching the video, I noticed my elbows were flaring out. After I made the correction, I was pushed back all the way to 4x9r.

After finally working my way up back to 4x12r and filming myself again, I realized that I wasn't 100% opening up my elbows at the top and pausing for a few milliseconds like the athlete does. After making this second correction, I was pushed back to 4x9r  all over again!

The strategy I'm following now is adding 1 rep to the top set every time I do pushups:

week1 Mon) 9r,9r,9r,9r

week1 Thur) 10r,9r,9r,9r

week2 Mon) 10r,10r, 9r, 9r

week2 Thur) 10r,10r, 10r, 9r

I did 3-4 weeks at 5x11 and was feeling good. So I upped it to 5X12 ... But at the same time I sprained my ankle.

I'm struggling on 5x12 ... Not sure if it's the ankle (which doesn't hurt in push-ups) or just that I'm a gumby.

Oh well ... I will keep trying ... At this rate I will master push ups in 5 years!!!!

maolu said:

Not sure it makes sense, this is a no-stops workout, so you have trouble with later sets because of the first ones.

Removing them won't trigger the problem, but won't give you the conditioning you're looking for either IMHO...

I'm saying if you can't do 15,15,15,15,15 and can only do 15,15,12,11,10, then how about changing it to 10,11,12,15,15, so you're teaching your body to push harder as you get more tired

How much weight are y'all using on the mobility?

Maybe it's a little too much. Try lightening that load some.

Hmms said:

I'm saying if you can't do 15,15,15,15,15 and can only do 15,15,12,11,10, then how about changing it to 10,11,12,15,15, so you're teaching your body to push harder as you get more tired

That doesn't really make sense though. If you could just will yourself to work harder and do more reps when you got more tired, why not just push harder and reach mastery?

If someone has been stuck at a certain volume and hasn't progressed for a long period of time (and assuming that their form was already good and they aren't progressing in terms of form or ROM), then the cause is most likely not that the program itself is failing them and much more likely it's:

1) they are simply not willing to push themselves through the discomfort

2) they are exceeding their recovery abilities and need to cut down the frequency of training

3) their nutritional habits are lacking and they aren't giving their body what it needs to improve itself

Or

4) their rest modalities are lacking (they are chronically sleep deprived and thus their hormone levels are out of whack and their recovery is stunted)

But, I understand getting frustrated if you aren't making progress on something and experimenting with other methods. In the end results are what really matters. So try it out if you want and see if it works for you.

Next to the points, keegan made.

What could help if you hit a plateau is to make a harder version of it. in your case it could work, because you're familiar with me movement and safe and trying for a long time. 
Like adding weight so your body needs to improve as a result.

I will try this if high volume fails in my training.

But there are so many ways to go - maybe you can try a second push exercise if your revocery can afford it.

like the course says, 5-10lbs should be enough for most people. 6lbs is me when I play around with the iM, 10lbs feel like too much too soon.

Jacqui Collins said:

I did 3-4 weeks at 5x11 and was feeling good. So I upped it to 5X12 ... But at the same time I sprained my ankle.

I'm struggling on 5x12 ... Not sure if it's the ankle (which doesn't hurt in push-ups) or just that I'm a gumby.

Oh well ... I will keep trying ... At this rate I will master push ups in 5 years!!!!

Sorry about the ankle.

I'd say, just record yourself during first and last set and post it here, the best thing about this forum is the amount of great constructive feedback you're getting for free.

Lots of times I thought I was ok with my form, filmed myself in order to post for a form check and just by watching the video I spotted items to address, to the point I didn't need to post anymore, just stay put and reboot the cycle.

Lately I took the habit of doing form checks at every deload week (so when you should be fresher and capable of keeping shape no matter what) and that's how I decide if I can progress or not, regardless of having been able to complete the prescribed sets/reps.

for some element I'm doing the same PE since I begun F1 (mostly HBP and FL).

It might seem it's not an advancement, but if I compare form of the first months with the one I have now, that's a totally different exercise.

This thread Jacqui started caught my attention about 5-6 weeks ago. I could relate. I was stuck for months and doubted my athletic potential, diet, recovery, and the exercise programming. I had a stretch of a couple weeks where I had even regressed- for whatever reasons. Fast forward to this past week- finally, push ups- I'm no longer stuck!  No changes to diet, sleep, or programming. Just time, and a more focused effort on breathing. Breathing properly through these exercises probably buys you a few more reps.

What about going back to incline pushups (HBP1) and milking them for all they're worth? Consistant work at high reps may help psychologically. Remembering Pavel's description of GTG as training the execise as a skill may also help. I'm doing this to get back into GST after doing little while travelling for 3 months.

I agree with Curtisfer.

I got stuck on the first of the 15 rep exercises for SL. All I did was stay at that level, even for a four week mini and then deload when necessary. Eventually I passed it, no changes, no diet changes or anything else required but time.

Regarding the mobility exercise, I am using a 5 lb DB

hey, just want to say my progress with hbp is going well right now, changed nothing except i went back one microcycle.

so from 5x6 i went to todays 4x15 reps. im so motivated right now

it was hard, last reps i was shaking but i think you have to fight last reps for progressing through a wall, but dont overstress.

for me my elbows and shoulders have been the weak points, but i think slp Pe 1+2 helped to get more power there.

Yeah, you've to fight the reps. As long as your form and tempo are right, you've to keep going no matter what.

Final set of 5x15.

I mastered HBP/PE2 time ago but I'm rehabing a wrist thing and I'm revisiting it... I lost the endurance and I've 4kg more