Gymnastic bodies vs Ido portal method

I know ido portal was a student of coach some years back. But they have very different approach if you compare the foundation series and Ido^s method on teaching

Idos method is you have to train 2 session a day5-6 days a week even if you are just a beginner. 

If you compare that to the foundation series is a different world to the approach how to learn gymnastic excercises.

Have someone excperience and answer why there method is so different? I know you have to work hard to be good. but 3-4 hours a dav vs around 1hour foundation work a day. 

 

I do foundation series now and is very challenging even at the beging i like it so far. And i will continue with it 

I'm interested in this discussion.  I think Ido has some awesome ideas and i love his philosophy of taking the best aspects from many different fields and incorporating them into a grand unified theory of movement.   I suspect Ido's method takes a lot more time because a lot of it is low intensity, skill and balance related.  I'm only guessing, since i've never trained under ido, but is suspect a lot of time squatting, hanging, locomotive skills, moving through unusual range of motions, mobility.  I think you could really make a lot of progress that way without getting overtrained if you can put in the time.  Foundation is more of a focus on strength and mobility, and if it were worked 3-4 hrs a day you'd get injured and overtrained (at least at the beginning).  Looking forward to hearing others' thoughts, especially if they have any direct experience with Ido.  Maybe coach or Ido would chime in.

I'll leave these here. Reddit is the only place where I have ever seen any mention of what Ido's online coaching actually is

http://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/comments/198xdk/i_just_finished_3_months_of_online_training_with/

 http://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/comments/1dsezq/the_first_negative_review_of_ido_portal_ive_come/ (this link is actually a reposted comment from deep in the comments from the first link)

 

There are also a few unbiased topics on foundation which may help.

http://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/comments/1ebe9k/anybody_got_sommers_foundation_2_yet_what_do_you/

http://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/comments/1idcsr/has_anyone_gone_through_the_foundation_one_program/

http://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/comments/1l8llw/question_about_foundation_two_by_coach_sommer/

http://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/comments/1i08v0/handstand_one_reviews/

http://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/comments/1naywg/who_has_foundation_two/

 

One comment here tries to directly compare Ido and Foundation, but obviously its just one persons opinion http://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/comments/17nny2/training_in_the_spirit_of_ido_portal/

Don't gymnasts train 2x a day , for a total of  2-4 hours every day? What we have here on GB ( or what I view it as anyway ) is the scaled down version for us "normal" folks who have jobs and lives that may not permit us to put in such insane amounts of time into our training. If you look at most of Ido's clients, they seem to be trainers or people who make a living in the fitness/sports industries. People who can afford to spend 4-6 hours a day, 5-6 days a week into training.

KingJR said:

Don't gymnasts train 2x a day , for a total of  2-4 hours every day? What we have here on GB ( or what I view it as anyway ) is the scaled down version for us "normal" folks who have jobs and lives that may not permit us to put in such insane amounts of time into our training. If you look at most of Ido's clients, they seem to be trainers or people who make a living in the fitness/sports industries. People who can afford to spend 4-6 hours a day, 5-6 days a week into training.

What we have here on GB is purely the strength and conditioning protocols and progressions used by Coach Sommer to produce outstanding athletes, minus the technical gymnastics skill training (which is where the whole 'Coach' part comes in). See the BtGB introduction for details.

Combine with the athletic pursuit of your choice (gymnastics, cirque, martial arts, whatever) for results par excellence. To me this is perfect; the Gbodies curriculum completely addresses my strength/conditioning needs in a time-efficient manner and affords me plenty of time to devote to technical training. Plus I get gymnastics strength skills and a bunch of fun along the way.

 

Don't know Ido Portal personally or professionally, so no comments on him other than I would be very surprised if you could not accomplish significant things with capoeira/wushu training plus Gymnastic Bodies.

 

Coach's specialty (at least what we concerned with here, I'm sure he has diverse other skills) is producing

a) strong/mobile/injury-free, and

b) skilled gymnasts.

You can accomplish a) by using the courses he releases and asking questions as you go (ie. this board). You can accomplish b) by finding a gymnastics coach with a comparable competitive career, record in producing champion athletes, and length of time in the field.

Jon Douglas said:

You can accomplish a) by using the courses he releases and asking questions as you go (ie. this board). You can accomplish b) by finding a gymnastics coach with a comparable competitive career, record in producing champion athletes, and length of time in the field.

Even if you do find a coach for your option b there is absolutely no guarantee that coach has any experience in adapting this stuff to adults. And that is a critical distinction. It's one thing to teach kids this stuff over many years. It's another to try and adapt it to adults who think they are already strong. Coach has been working this out for several years now.

I have no idea how ido trains. I do however know that several of his students have messages me asking me to help fill in holes in their program. Especially with regards to manna and the advanced planche progressions. I generally tell then that they should get foundation series and their questions will most likely be answered.

To emphasize what Daniel said and the amazing progress he has made on the manna, I saw a post from Ido on his facebook saying it was IMPOSSIBLE for an adult to build up to a manna.  

 

I think the choice should be pretty obvious especially considering the enormous cost difference between the two.  

xray said:

To emphasize what Daniel said and the amazing progress he has made on the manna, I saw a post from Ido on his facebook saying it was IMPOSSIBLE for an adult to build up to a manna.  

Exactly where did he say that?

On his facebook profile: http://goo.gl/PJw6gS

Are you not aware of the fact that everything you have never seen happen must be impossible? It's common knowledge.

Arto said:

Are you not aware of the fact that everything you have never seen happen must be impossible? It's common knowledge.

exactly

I just want to reiterate what Jon said: Foundations is not a stand alone program, it's designed to supplement other skill work. 

 

For me, I use Foundations to supplement my natural movement, martial arts, and a few other random bits and pieces such as dance.  With Ido's program you definitely won't have time to be doing anything else.

MMarty said:

On his facebook profile: http://goo.gl/PJw6gS

I don't see anywhere where he says it's impossible.

Craig said:

I just want to reiterate what Jon said: Foundations is not a stand alone program, it's designed to supplement other skill work.

For me, I use Foundations to supplement my natural movement, martial arts, and a few other random bits and pieces such as dance. With Ido's program you definitely won't have time to be doing anything else.

Hmm. I got a different impression. Maybe i missed it but what makes u say its not a stand alone program? Whenever i posted about doing skills outside of F1, people here told me to stop and just do F1 exclusively.

That said, i dont use it as a stadalone, i do a complete ring strength workout after.

In the beginning of F1 the strength elements are not very challenging its the mobility elements that will most likely be the challenge. I think coach even mentioned thameetingt for adults lack of flexibility was the major problem. Thats exactly myissue i have with f1 - pittiful mobility and while it makes sense to fix a deficit before moving on, sometimes the time it would take to do so might not be practical. At least thats my opinion. Im not willing to spend months or possibly years working on things like skiers. So my solution is to use it as a warmup and do strength training after. Ive got limited time so i need to prioritize my time on goals i want to acheive, i cant put those goals on the backburne until my flexibility gets better. Im progressing thats for sure and i just dont think i would be where i am w/o my work after f1. But i do like the progressions all laid out with F1 and H1 and i will move thru it in time, just not as fast as i thought or hoped.

The problem with ido from what i understand is paying a lot of money for something you cant even see what it is how long can u afford to pay him and what do u do after u stop working with him. Also that time commitment is pretty demanding i dont know too many adults that have 3 dhrs to spen o working out.

jwalker497 said:

Hmm. I got a different impression. Maybe i missed it but what makes u say its not a stand alone program? Whenever i posted about doing skills outside of F1, people here told me to stop and just do F1 exclusively.

That said, i dont use it as a stadalone, i do a complete ring strength workout after.

In the beginning of F1 the strength elements are not very challenging its the mobility elements that will most likely be the challenge. I think coach even mentioned thameetingt for adults lack of flexibility was the major problem. Thats exactly myissue i have with f1 - pittiful mobility and while it makes sense to fix a deficit before moving on, sometimes the time it would take to do so might not be practical. At least thats my opinion. Im not willing to spend months or possibly years working on things like skiers. So my solution is to use it as a warmup and do strength training after. Ive got limited time so i need to prioritize my time on goals i want to acheive, i cant put those goals on the backburne until my flexibility gets better. Im progressing thats for sure and i just dont think i would be where i am w/o my work after f1. But i do like the progressions all laid out with F1 and H1 and i will move thru it in time, just not as fast as i thought or hoped.

The problem with ido from what i understand is paying a lot of money for something you cant even see what it is how long can u afford to pay him and what do u do after u stop working with him. Also that time commitment is pretty demanding i dont know too many adults that have 3 dhrs to spen o working out.

What you have been asking about are not skills in the sense we are talking about here. Muscle ups and the like. Eventually strength in excess of mobility will roadblock you anyway either by injury or not allowing you to progress to truly impressive feats.

F1 and h1 is a complete program at first. Eventually you will get to the point where real skill work is possible for you to do. I'm going to speak in terms of gymnastics because that is what I know. If you can't do the holds in foundation one you will not be able to do pommel circles, will not have the stamina and control to do giants. You should also be reasonably good at handstand to tumble correctly.

With that said there is nothing wrong with enjoying what ever other physical endeavor you like. F1 does indeed work as a great supplement because you are building a foundation of strength you probably should have had in the first place. Enjoy the benefits a prepared body brings you!

Ido's program is very expensive for what is essentially a list of exercises with no demonstration and little explanation.  I've heard they don't do very well at keeping contact or answering questions either.

 

In comparison, the GB program is much less draining on the finances, has clear demonstrations, and a forum of people to consult. 

 

The goal of foundation is to build a body that can handle the demands of gymnastics skill work without actually working the skills(which is a completely different element).  

As was stated before, doing foundation definitely gives you some freedom to pursue another form of movement at the same time which is definitely an advantage over Ido's program. 

Thanks Daniel and Yuri, clearer & shorter summary than mine

Rightly or wrongly, anyone that calls himself "Guru Extraordinaire" triggers my spidey senses...

Hi all,

Frankly, I'm surprised at the degree of negativity here. I believe the poster was not asking which program is better. He was simply asking what is the difference between the programs. They certainly have different reference points are are not trying to accomplish the same thing. I would have though we could all appreciate anyone trying to make people healthier and move more. Obviously if you're looking for gymnastics training, then the specificity of foundation is best for you. However that doesn't make it best for everyone. Let's have a positive discussion about the pros and cons of different training methods, and which people might be most benefitted from which activities.

I fully agree with Yuri. I actually tried out Ido's online coaching two years ago and I found it very underwhelming (especially considering that I paid $900 for three months of coaching - I'm almost ashamed to admit that I did).

 

Regarding the original post of this thread - the main reason why Ido's programming differs so much from what is offered in Foundation is that his workouts include a little bit of everything and he uses Poliquin's methods of periodization. Foundation on the other hand is purely focused on basic GST and mobility. Hence the shorter workouts (to which you can add other activities if you're physically up to it).

 

So you can't really compare the two, IMO. They're completely different methods with different goals and different philosophies.

 

If you're interested in (paraphrasing Yuri): "building a body that can handle the demands of gymnastics skill work" and building a truly strong and mobile body the Foundation and Handstand series are definitely the way to go.

Thank you for sharing your experience Michael; I think it has tremendous value to the members of this community.

No problem. I would like to emphasize that I'm not bashing Mr. Ido Portal - he has found his niche in the world of Movement, which is great. And he is good at what he does - I respect him for that. But his attitude and ways of running his business leave a lot to be desired.

FredInChina said:

Rightly or wrongly, anyone that calls himself "Guru Extraordinaire" triggers my spidey senses...

I don't think Ido ever called himself a "Guru Extraordinaire". The video that called him that was made by another person. 

 

Ido may not be as experienced and good as Coach Sommer in the gymnastics department, but he is very knowledgeable in strength training and has personally achieved some great stuff.

B1214N said:

I don't think Ido ever called himself a "Guru Extraordinaire". The video that called him that was made by another person. 

 

Ido may not be as experienced and good as Coach Sommer in the gymnastics department, but he is very knowledgeable in strength training and has personally achieved some great stuff.

 

NEVER argue with spidey senses...

FredInChina said:

NEVER argue with spidey senses...

Where did he say that?