Is it too late to consider NAIGC College Gymnastics?

Hey everyone I'm 16 years old and am going to be a junior this coming school year. I got into gymnastics a few days before my 16th birthday. I did gymnastics as a kid and believe I was in a recreational class focusing on level 3 skills before I quit. I really enjoy gymnastics and would like to continue doing gymnastics in college. For those who aren't familiar with NAIGC college gymnastics its a national organization of over 100 college gymnastics clubs who compete under level 9 rules. NAIGC is open to anyone so I know I can at least be a part of a club if I choose to. I really want to actually be at the level where I am beneficial to the team rather than just training for fun.

In about 6 months or so here is what I have achieved. My goal is to have 5 solid routines with 10 skills each and have an average of around a B which would be 2.0 D-score not including requirements. I have a little over 2 years to achieve this.

Floor

-RO BHS series with good rebound. honestly probably have enough height for a back layout I just much prefer front tumbling

- FHS with pretty good rebound. My feet land in front of me rather than behind due to not having enough flexibility. My rebound is enough to do a front tuck out of it but I need to be able to get my feet behind me first.

- punch front, punch front half, and a decent punch front full. All in tuck position as I have not learned front layout yet.

- can do L sit, advanced tuck planche, and am progressing quickly with straddle press

Horse

I have mostly fallen behind on horse and for a while I didn't really care to train horse since I hated it. Just now getting full circle on mushroom. Also working decent false scissors.

Rings

- Y swings are just now getting good. Have done inlocates before. Rings are still pretty basic. I am working on the level 5 routine right now.

Vault

I am able to do a decent FHS with  block. Started doing FHS front tuck but usually end up tucking on the FHS as well as the front tuck after.

P-Bars

-kip, back uprise, inconsistent swing handstand (sometimes don't make it or have bad form hitting it), now working on moy to upper arm and will probably have it soon.

HB

kip but not nearly as good as pbars, decent baby giant, pretty good caste handstand

So Pretty much I wanted to see if I'm crazy thinking I can go from this very crude foundation to working on level 8 routines in the next 2 years. Willing to work hard and have just recently really started putting more effort into my goal.

It's too late

Blake12 said:

Hey everyone I'm 16 years old and am going to be a junior this coming school year. I got into gymnastics a few days before my 16th birthday. I did gymnastics as a kid and believe I was in a recreational class focusing on level 3 skills before I quit. I really enjoy gymnastics and would like to continue doing gymnastics in college. For those who aren't familiar with NAIGC college gymnastics its a national organization of over 100 college gymnastics clubs who compete under level 9 rules. NAIGC is open to anyone so I know I can at least be a part of a club if I choose to. I really want to actually be at the level where I am beneficial to the team rather than just training for fun.

In about 6 months or so here is what I have achieved. My goal is to have 5 solid routines with 10 skills each and have an average of around a B which would be 2.0 D-score not including requirements. I have a little over 2 years to achieve this.

Floor

-RO BHS series with good rebound. honestly probably have enough height for a back layout I just much prefer front tumbling

- FHS with pretty good rebound. My feet land in front of me rather than behind due to not having enough flexibility. My rebound is enough to do a front tuck out of it but I need to be able to get my feet behind me first.

- punch front, punch front half, and a decent punch front full. All in tuck position as I have not learned front layout yet.

- can do L sit, advanced tuck planche, and am progressing quickly with straddle press

Horse

I have mostly fallen behind on horse and for a while I didn't really care to train horse since I hated it. Just now getting full circle on mushroom. Also working decent false scissors.

Rings

- Y swings are just now getting good. Have done inlocates before. Rings are still pretty basic. I am working on the level 5 routine right now.

Vault

I am able to do a decent FHS with block. Started doing FHS front tuck but usually end up tucking on the FHS as well as the front tuck after.

P-Bars

-kip, back uprise, inconsistent swing handstand (sometimes don't make it or have bad form hitting it), now working on moy to upper arm and will probably have it soon.

HB

kip but not nearly as good as pbars, decent baby giant, pretty good caste handstand

So Pretty much I wanted to see if I'm crazy thinking I can go from this very crude foundation to working on level 8 routines in the next 2 years. Willing to work hard and have just recently really started putting more effort into my goal.

It's definitely not too late. At your age you can still accomplish a lot. The best bet is to find a gym and join a team.

I didn't start until about a year ago and have competed. I am not very good mind you but for less than a year I am proud of my progress. 2 years is plenty of time for club and I think you will be surprised how much you can do with a good coach and a lot of drive.

 Given 2 years, you definitely have enough time. Roger Harrell didn't train until HS and competed club for UC Davis though I think like Arizona they competed against the big teams.

 Bare in mind though NAIGC is growing, there are fewer clubs out west compared to the East. It's real big back east.

You don't need 10 skills, just 8 as they judge based on L9. 

With only 2 years, focus on getting as many groups as you can. This is very hard on HB but a bit easier on the other events. It will still be tough on PH but if you can get an arabian roll or side somi you can pretty much hit all your groups on FX.

I hear Nationals is way fun. Way fun.

Some of the competition at Nationals, especially amongst the men is pretty high. Especially back East. I'm sure you are familiar with the NAIGC website but if you have any questions, PM me and I'll ask my friends in NAIGC who are board members. Always good to keep in contact with them (besides the one I really liked.  ).

You absolutely can. My advice (as someone who began competing as a freshman in college) is:

- master the basics. Even if it takes you two years of just doing basic swings. Master them and get them down solid. Everything else is built on top of the basics. 

- similarly, get your basic strength in order. If you're not already, start doing Foundation or something similar. Gymnastics is half as hard and ten times more enjoyable when you're really strong. 

- for your routines, go for "easy and clean". There's no point doing a B instead of an A if you're going to get a .1 deduction for a mistake on the B skill. Your first goal on each event should be to put together a routine of 7 skills that satisfies each compulsory category. There is absolutely no reason to add any more skills or difficulty unless you can execute the skills you're adding nearly perfectly. 

- the exception to the above is your dismount. It's worth doing a B-dismount if you can, for partial credit in the dismount category (0.3 bonus).

Joshua Slocum said:

You absolutely can. My advice (as someone who began competing as a freshman in college) is:

 

- master the basics. Even if it takes you two years of just doing basic swings. Master them and get them down solid. Everything else is built on top of the basics. 

 

- similarly, get your basic strength in order. If you're not already, start doing Foundation or something similar. Gymnastics is half as hard and ten times more enjoyable when you're really strong. 

 

- for your routines, go for "easy and clean". There's no point doing a B instead of an A if you're going to get a .1 deduction for a mistake on the B skill. Your first goal on each event should be to put together a routine of 7 skills that satisfies each compulsory category. There is absolutely no reason to add any more skills or difficulty unless you can execute the skills you're adding nearly perfectly. 

 

- the exception to the above is your dismount. It's worth doing a B-dismount if you can, for partial credit in the dismount category (0.3 bonus).

That's actually a great idea. I'll go look through the CoP shortly.

I'm having problems with being able to train high bar as my hands rip rather easily despite having decently think calluses. Will grips help this problem at all? Various people tell me different things but I'll probably go ahead and get some since I'll need them eventually. I'm also right in the middle of the medium and large size grips so I'm not sure which ones to get.

You'll need grips anyway to seriously train swings. They don't prevent rips but aren't as bad as bare hands on the bar in my opinion.

Your hands will adapt to the workload. Just make sure to build up slowly. Also shave your calluses if they get too hard and thick.

Blairbob said:

 Given 2 years, you definitely have enough time. Roger Harrell didn't train until HS and competed club for UC Davis though I think like Arizona they competed against the big teams.

 

 Bare in mind though NAIGC is growing, there are fewer clubs out west compared to the East. It's real big back east.

 

You don't need 10 skills, just 8 as they judge based on L9. 

 

With only 2 years, focus on getting as many groups as you can. This is very hard on HB but a bit easier on the other events. It will still be tough on PH but if you can get an arabian roll or side somi you can pretty much hit all your groups on FX.

 

I hear Nationals is way fun. Way fun.

 

Some of the competition at Nationals, especially amongst the men is pretty high. Especially back East. I'm sure you are familiar with the NAIGC website but if you have any questions, PM me and I'll ask my friends in NAIGC who are board members. Always good to keep in contact with them (besides the one I really liked.  ).

Thanks! It's inspiring to hear from so many people that it is possible with enough effort and hard work.

Well that's good I thought level 8 competed 8 skills and 9/10 required 10 skills. This probably won't ever effect me but only a certain number of C/D elements are allowed, correct? Anything above a D still gets .4 value, right? Only D I might ever learn is punch double front.

From YouTube videos I know competition is very high amongst the men. Very obvious that many of the guys were probably level 10 before college. Hopefully by my sophomore or junior year in college I might be able to compete with the big guys!

Daniel Burnham said:

You'll need grips anyway to seriously train swings. They don't prevent rips but aren't as bad as bare hands on the bar in my opinion.

Your hands will adapt to the workload. Just make sure to build up slowly. Also shave your calluses if they get too hard and thick.

Yeah I've decided I really need to get grips. Not sure If I should go with Velcro or the loop kind. Also if I'm literally right in between 2 sizes would it be best to go with the smaller of the two sizes since the grips will stretch ?

From YouTube videos I know competition is very high amongst the men. Very obvious that many of the guys were probably level 10 before college. Hopefully by my sophomore or junior year in college I might be able to compete with the big guys!

The competition ranges a lot. Local meets generally aren't that competitive. There are maybe 4 teams and a few individuals at nationals that are pretty good. Some have even been on NCAA.

Two of the guys I trained with made finals and one got first on floor. He is very competitive but club is more about having fun. Don't expect everyone to be super serious and there aren't a lot of spectators to make you nervous.

Blake12 said:

I'm having problems with being able to train high bar as my hands rip rather easily despite having decently think calluses. Will grips help this problem at all? Various people tell me different things but I'll probably go ahead and get some since I'll need them eventually. I'm also right in the middle of the medium and large size grips so I'm not sure which ones to get.

What you need is tough skin, not thick calluses. Calluses that are too thick tend to get caught on the bar and tear. You'll find over time that your hands can accommodate more and more work: you just have to take it slow. (Also, you're eventually going to see similar issues on pbars, horse and rings). It also takes time to learn how much punishment your hands can take before they're at risk of tearing. Here are some things I do to keep my hands in good shape:

- If your hands hurt a lot, give them a break for the day.

- If you develop any particularly thick or hard calluses, file them down.

- Buy a lanolin-based moisturizer. Put it on your hands before going to sleep each night, especially when they hurt. Hand-E-Balm is excellent for this.

Blake12 said:

Well that's good I thought level 8 competed 8 skills and 9/10 required 10 skills. This probably won't ever effect me but only a certain number of C/D elements are allowed, correct? Anything above a D still gets .4 value, right? Only D I might ever learn is punch double front.

I'd recommend double checking the rules, but I believe the NCAA is pretty much FIG rules, in which you need only 7 skills to receive a full execution score.

Blake12 said:

Yeah I've decided I really need to get grips. Not sure If I should go with Velcro or the loop kind. Also if I'm literally right in between 2 sizes would it be best to go with the smaller of the two sizes since the grips will stretch ?

Always err on the side of shorter when it comes to high bar grips. Long grips can lead to grip lock. Grip lock can lead to your forearm snapping in half. Or into 14 different pieces, some of them protruding outside of your skin.

http://www.naigc.net/RulesMA.php Modified L9 with no skill restriction.

No idea where and when and how you're training but some MAG gyms do a PH/FX/HB split alternated with SR/V/PB. I liked this split, we used and I have (when training and coaching) and it's pretty decent (though for little guys I generally like PH more frequently so they can get their circles in the early levels).

Velcro or buckles doesn't really matter that much. I like Velcro but it will wear out over time and you have make sure nothing gets in the velcro.

Get some grips for HB if you intend to swing big or anything serious.

@Daniel

I noticed the skill level ranges quite a bit from videos. If you don't mind me asking what college's club do/did you compete for? I also want to be on a fairly competitive team since sadly I realized my love for gymnastics a little too late to be competitive before I'm 18 and would like to have that experience. Do you know of some of the more competitive clubs that train a large amount of hours per week? Also I read that most clubs have no outside coaching so if you know of any clubs that hire coaches I'd like to look into those colleges.

@Joshua

Thanks for the tips! You have been very helpful!

I do not have any knowledge of their training but Texas A&M was very competitive this year. I must say that you should probably pick your college based on other factors than their club sports.

I am with Georgia tech. They only practice for about 4 hours a week but I and my competitive friends practice many more on our own. I have not had a full time coach.

A&M has one guy who is really good but I think he graduated this year I think. Do you know if UT made nationals this year? Of course I would base my decision off of things other than gymnastics! For example, I would never go to A&M and I live an hour away!

4 hours a week isn't that much I've only looked into A&M and UT. They both practice 4 times a week with A&M practicing 12 hours and UT 8 hours if I remember correctly.

Blairbob said:

http://www.naigc.net/RulesMA.php Modified L9 with no skill restriction.

 

No idea where and when and how you're training but some MAG gyms do a PH/FX/HB split alternated with SR/V/PB. I liked this split, we used and I have (when training and coaching) and it's pretty decent (though for little guys I generally like PH more frequently so they can get their circles in the early levels).

 

Velcro or buckles doesn't really matter that much. I like Velcro but it will wear out over time and you have make sure nothing gets in the velcro.

 

Get some grips for HB if you intend to swing big or anything serious.

Yeah that's the split that my gym uses although we usually do a little bit of floor at the end on V/SR/PB days. I was thinking I'd go with Velcro since they seem more convenient.

As far as training I was training 2 days for 2 hours at first. Then I moved to 3 days 2 hours with one being 3 hours. Then I broke my arm and lost interest a bit since I was just started to get decently strong so I was only going like once to twice a week for 2 hours. Just recently I've decided to go 4x a week for 2 hours with one of them being a private lesson for 3 hours with one of the coaches who I'm pretty good friends with. Figured 4x a week is a pretty good schedule for now since training too much too soon would probably lead to injuries.

On a side note today I learned front layouts! I still bend my knees a bit and sometimes have leg separation but I'm holding the arch! Also, as soon as I learned the proper technique for a front layout it instantly made my front twisting straight. My front half is good with occasional minor form breaks. However, with fulls I sometimes don't get them around and if I do I go running out of it in the direction I'm twisting. Any ideas on how to correct this or do I just need more repetition since it's a blind landing? 

 Hard to critique your front full without video. Learning a pike 1/2 out is very common and then adding another 1/2 to that.

 Front landings are basically learned by awareness and timing. Reps.

 On the front full, set arms wide then pull to increase twist. Think "Y"

 We often tell parents not to get Velcro with the kids because they will wrap it over and over and waste time. It's not such an issue with adults.

 Every gym practices different. Some only have 2 or 3 practices on campus or off campus though some gymnasts go to local clubs to increase hours.

Some coaches can actually pay for coaching but it's tough to find someone who will coach those later hours. A lot of it is self coaching amongst the former gymnasts (which often are or were coaches themselves in their high school or college years).

Blairbob said:

 Hard to critique your front full without video. Learning a pike 1/2 out is very common and then adding another 1/2 to that.

 

 Front landings are basically learned by awareness and timing. Reps.

 

 On the front full, set arms wide then pull to increase twist. Think "Y"

 

 We often tell parents not to get Velcro with the kids because they will wrap it over and over and waste time. It's not such an issue with adults.

 

 Every gym practices different. Some only have 2 or 3 practices on campus or off campus though some gymnasts go to local clubs to increase hours.

 

Some coaches can actually pay for coaching but it's tough to find someone who will coach those later hours. A lot of it is self coaching amongst the former gymnasts (which often are or were coaches themselves in their high school or college years).

Next time I get the chance I'll record it. Will learning to twist out of a pike still be helpful even though today I was twisting with a nearly perfectly straight body?(slight hallow)  I'm fairly certain I'm not twisting too early but that could be it. Early twisting usually causes the flip to not be vertical and it looks sideways right? 

I really wish back tumbling was as easy as front... haha. I spend most of my floor time on back tumbling and can't even do a proper back tuck out of a back handspring! Meanwhile with front tumbling I can do FHS rebound, punch front, half, almost a full, and front layout!

Also I was wondering if a whip is an A or B skill if anyone knows

 Whip is a "B".

 Get the code off FIG gymnastics.

Most twisting involves some tilt.

Back tumbling is generally easier than front tumbling but quite often some people are better than one at the other.

Honestly, it's hard to say without seeing video.

Learning the pike half out just teaches a late twist instead of what people often consider a "Barani" twisting technique. So maybe it's not your problem. Dunno.

Blairbob said:

 Whip is a "B".

 

 Get the code off FIG gymnastics.

 

Most twisting involves some tilt.

 

Back tumbling is generally easier than front tumbling but quite often some people are better than one at the other.

 

Honestly, it's hard to say without seeing video.

 

Learning the pike half out just teaches a late twist instead of what people often consider a "Barani" twisting technique. So maybe it's not your problem. Dunno.

I've noticed that pretty much all routines have almost entirely back tumbling. I suppose it doesn't matter if I'm the opposite. I'm some what scared of back tumbling while front tumbling doesn't scare me even if I'm trying something I know I can't do. I think playing soccer for 10 years perhaps allowed me to progress with front tumbling faster since I already have pretty good leg strength.

Is a punch front 1 3/4 necessary to work on punch double fronts? I'm pretty sure once I get better control with front landings I could learn punch double front. 

What's the advantage of doing front tumbling out of a FHS? I've noticed that FHS are pretty uncommon in gymnastics. Most people just run punch for front skills but to me it seems like FHS would make twisting passes easier and more controlled. My second guess is most gymnasts just don't have enough room but these are just assumptions.

In MAG, if you leave out front tumbling, you loose getting credit for an element group. I'm not sure if the same is true with WAG. You don't tend to see a lot of front tumbling in WAG.

If you're front handspring is good, you can use it as a tumbling accelerator or you can just use a front layout and "whip" it as an accelerator into a front tumbling pass. You can also use a back 1/2 or 3/2 into a front tumbling skill.

No idea about the necessity of 1 3/4s and double fronts. I played with double fronts but never to the point of on floor (off spring boards or tramp/double mini).

I think it might be a good idea to know how to roll out of a missed double front in case **** happens. Maybe you punch off a dead springboard or just run out of power or mess up somehow.

Good point about knowing how to roll out of a bad punch for double fronts.

Yeah I know that you have to have a strength element, front, back, etc. Can gymnasts usually get more height out of a front handspring than just punching?

 It's like this, if your front handspring or back handspring are poor ( sometimes because of crappy shoulders ), you still back or front whip instead.