DIFFERENT SWINGS , how many how often... (question to a gymn

Finally this month I managed to sign up to a adult gymnastics class, it is really fun, serotonin is attending too. I am planning to use part of the 60min free play to practice the movements that I can not practice normally at my gym:

-high bar swings

-ring swings

-parallel bars support swings

-pommel horse lateral swing and others basic swings

-mushroom circles,

-then some fun with cartweels, round offs, and basic tricking...

The question is : how I am supposed to train this movements, by repetitions, by time? Usually I´ll only train once or twice a week(WOD as scheduled at the morning) because of my timetable.

Pd. after wrecking my hands the first day I am buying grips!

Don't have an answer for you, but that sounds great.

I've been looking at doing the same and there is a summer course coming up that i think i will try. Coach did make sure to remind me to not let that get in the way of the foundational strength work though!

I have a set of PBs that i made (have to post ics sometime) and use pull up bars for basic tap swings. I'm glad you found a facility to try those movements, there is something very satisfying even at the most basic level. I has my ladies doing some basic swings this morning and they really had a great time.

Of course WOD is the base of my template(lets say 85% with the seminar prehab and some barbell squat and leg exercises next), this gymnastics classes are only possible once or twice a week, but this two days with only 10 swings(with poor technique and poorer range of motion) of each type have let me sore for 3 days, really is amazing, and very fun (and some times scary!).

It is worth asking your local clubs. Mine used to be just for kids and teenagers (if they improve as they grow they go to Barcelona or Madrid for kids, or the seminar club for girls) but they created the adult classes some months ago.

Apparently adult gymnastics is becoming more popular in Europe.

I was speaking with the owner of the local gymnastics store when we were considering doing the seminar here. (Though i'm very happy it wound up being in Mallorca, such a beautiful location, many excellent memories)

He said that due to demand all the local clubs have begun offering adult gymnastics. I hope that is a positive trend and the clubs get more support.

Looking at the what's on offer, there are a number of different adult programs on offer here now. I've jut been waiting until i feel i've at least gotten some basic strength first.

Mr Brady said:

Apparently adult gymnastics is becoming more popular in Europe.

I was speaking with the owner of the local gymnastics store when we were considering doing the seminar here. (Though i'm very happy it wound up being in Mallorca, such a beautiful location, many excellent memories)

He said that due to demand all the local clubs have begun offering adult gymnastics. I hope that is a positive trend and the clubs get more support.

Looking at the what's on offer, there are a number of different adult programs on offer here now. I've jut been waiting until i feel i've at least gotten some basic strength first.

Here in Denmark many of the parents of the kids I'm coaching have been requesting adult programs too. Definately a good trend to see

In answer to your question. At basic level training, don't bother training for time. For almost all swings shoot for 5-15 swings of PERFECT (In the beginning they will not be perfect, but try) repetitions. That is one way to do it, the other way is (only if you have a at least semi good work ethic) Do as many perfect swings as possible, when your form starts to suffer stop.

Those are a few ways to train, but for beginning training swinging elements they would probably be the best for you.

Also DO NOT use grips!!! You are greatly cheating yourself if you do! It will be years before you need grips (You will be doing higher level skills than giants). Trust me, you will get rips, it will hurt. But in the end it is worth it, it will help get your hands quite stronger, you will develop callouses and rips will become less frequent. It might be a pain, but everyone has to do it. And even with grips you will still get rips.

Enjoy your training!

Newguy said:

Also DO NOT use grips!!! You are greatly cheating yourself if you do! It will be years before you need grips (You will be doing higher level skills than giants).

Are you recommending giants without grips?

Yes. The skill should be learned without grips, only later when doing giants in combination with higher level skills should grips be used.

hahaha... I've tried everything, from grips to bare hands, socks, wool gloves and plastic pipe, but whenever I attemp HB swings I have to jump off after few reps because I feel that my hands are gonna ripping off. I don't want to stop training for a week because of too much ego.

All I can say is that after months of twice a week practice, the only acceptable swings are on PB, nothing perfect though.

I usually do 3 sets on each apparatus only to the point when I'm still in full control, it can change from time to time. I once pushed a little bit further on pb swing reps to only find myself loosing control and falling off badly, luckily i didn't get injured, just hurt...

For men, I would use grips, especially any adult males. Still, grips are not necessary until you are starting to swing really big while being technically correct. Being able to swing big with poor technical execution + grips is a bad idea for your shoulders.

At this stage, you need to only worry about the basic swings and not skills.

Basically, I would spend some time tumbling and swing on 2 events.

Generally HB&PH pair well just as PB&SR. However, PB's get pretty rough on the hands when you start doing basket swings. Fortunately, upper arm swings don't trash your hands really nor do support swings.

For rec students, I generally shoot for 5 sets of total swings. First set is 5-10 lazy swings just to loosen things up. Then focusing on 3-5 swings per set so they don't trash their hands or their swing doesn't deteriorate because they lose their energy.

For PH, I would focus on swinging with your legs together in front support by leaning shoulder to shoulder. As well, I like to begin all beginners with swinging in a stride/split support. It's more difficult but in a way a little more simple than the straddled support swing. Again 5 sets or so of 3-5 swings on each side.

You could spend some time in the bucket. Again 5 sets or so shouldn't take long. It sort of depends if you can do a basic circle in the bucket or not. I generally have beginners just put their feet in the bucket and walk around on the mushroom/toadstool in a circle. You can also do walks like this while in support with your feet walking on the floor.

Don't swing in support on High Bar or Parallel bars till you have a decent support hold and the ability to shift weight aka walks.

High Bar and Pommel Horse? I usually associate Parallel Bars and Horse.

Edit: does it have to do with the tap swing? (I had a discussion about the horizontal tap of the horse recently)

Newguy said:

Yes. The skill should be learned without grips, only later when doing giants in combination with higher level skills should grips be used.

Maybe it just sounds worse to me because the gym I grew up with had a high bar that was textured like sandpaper

Well, I somewhat oversimplified my response. I was talking with an incredible gymnast earlier today (Literally incredible, her brother has been invited to the Olympic trials, and she is a year or two younger than him and almost as good as him) And she was saying that she originally learned all sorts of skill without grips including giants, flyaways, I think even some release moves. But then she started using grips and had to relearn several skills. And now that she is used to grips, she has trouble doing skills without them. So it is a toss up. But unless you are planning on getting kovacs or other really high level skills, I would not use grips (SOMEONE CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG)

I was saying that it is best to learn the skills without grips, but if you do get up to that insane level then it won't take "too" long to relearn the skills.

Thank you all for your insights!!!, I´ll be practicing swings and not skills but the bar is not smooth, it has lots of tiny rust spots that make it like like sand paper, that is way we want the grips. My initial idea was not using them even our coach told us that we don´t need them. But then he showed us how to swing at the high bar just 30 secs. When he stepped down he turned to us an said:" ok with this bar maybe you´ll need grips if you want to swing for longer than that...".

I understand that the problem with the grips is that your wrist and grip technique will suffer using them. Maybe some leather gloves will do the trick?, I´ll try them next week as they are cheap.

I dunno about just using gloves themselves on the bar.

Honestly, I would take some time to allow your hands to build up. Perhaps tape grips if anything.

However, the rust sounds like a particular issue.

The Geriatric Gymnastics club I was a part of in Marin from Drillsandskills used that workout format, alternating days.

HB,FX, PH. SR, V, PB.

However, there is something to be said about training basic floor and pommel horse/circles every day, especially in the beginning stages. You have to watch for overuse problems as far PH and circles but it does speed up learning, especially for competition.

Swinging in straps can save your hands a bit as well as for HB. However, I don't like to put anyone in straps till they have a decent tap swing. This goes for HB and SR.

Overuse wont be a problem because I only got 1 day a week to train swings. I'll try different options and see how it feels

regarding the grips

Great discussion!

However there is one error that needs to be addressed. High Bar giants, or even basic High Bar swings, should not be learned without grips unless you are a woman swinging on a women's bar. If you are learning giants on a men's rail you should be using grips or you could also use high straps with either gloves or PVC. I particularly like to use straps for fitness enthusiasts as you get 80%+ of the benefits of correctly utilized grips with almost none of the negatives.

For people who have assumed incorrectly that a tight grip is necessary (as I did when I was young), your time attempting to swing on High Bar will be one of frustration and pain as you are attempting to perform two completely opposite actions simultaneously; holding the bar with the tightest possible death grip while also trying to pivot your body around the bar. If the hands are anchored so tightly, just how is this rotation to be achieved? Something has to give and it usually does as measured by the torn bloody callouses on the palms of your hands.

The reason why is a little technical so please bear with me. When you perform a pull-up you have a strong grip and the majority of your weight is born by the first knuckles at the top of the palm. The callouses fold over the top of the bar providing additional grip and support. But when swinging giants the weight should be born by the grip's dowels on the finger tips and the wrist band encircling the wrist; NOT BY THE PALMS OF THE HANDS. In essence you are hanging on the bar by the dowel of the grip; not gripping the bar directly. There should be little to no pressure on the palms of the hands; rather the hands should be relatively open, with the thumbs providing only the lightest of pressure on the side of the index fingers. Anyone who has had the opportunity to listen to me coaching High Bar will hear me constantly reminding my athletes, "...relax your hands ... open your hands ... you are gripping too tight ... trust the dowel ...".

Relax, soften the hands and allow yourself to "slip" around the bar rather than gripping it with a death grip. Your hands will thank you for it.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

Coach, what is the reason for men learning with grips, and women without?

The diameter of the women's rail is substantially larger and negates your ability to swing by your fingertips.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

Thank you for the tip coach, really interesting! Calluses are really taking a grind without grips( they are allready ordered), I never could imagine the way to use them is so diferent.

I have started to play with high bar as a small part of my warm ups and straps are really great as im not very comfortable with big swinging just yet.

7uRyfzqAhBo

Hey Omegant,

How are you progressing with your swings?

With regards to your rusty high bar, have you thought about asking the gym whether or not you can take matters into your own hands?

I'm sure with a bit of wire wool, white spirit and maybe a few cloths; you could have that high bar in far better condition in just a few minutes! it would cost pennies, take next to no time and would be helpful for everyone!

I'd say it is still worth considering even if you are using grips, if nothing else it will elongate their lifespan...

Food for thought!

Chris.

Well I bought the grips and they really make a difference!, I am swinging to horizontal with relative ease and I feel that I can go further but as we don´t have a foam pit I´m a bit scared :shock: . That is in high bar. With the rings is slower as the technique is a bit more difficult and you need more shoulder strength (at least that it is what I feel), Not reaching horizontal yet but technique is improving slowly. Unfortunately due to job trips and family I am currently only able to train at the gymnastic gym 2 or at most 3 times a month. That is clearly not enough for a consistent improvement but I expect to increase training days at the end of this year (hopefully!). I´ll try to make a video and post it here.