Working toward HeSPU: Partials vs negatives?

I've seen both partial reps and negatives recommended as a way of building up to HeSPUs. I was just wondering if one or the other is a better use of time and limited recovery ability? Would it make sense to work it both ways? How would you program it?

Right now I can do 3-5 half reps or I can do a slow negative, pausing briefly about 3/4 way down.

Thanks.

I know this doesn't directly answer your question, but how are you at doing L-HeSPu? How how high can you Elevate your legs before you can't complete a full ROM L-HeSPu? I was having trouble doing the negative HeSPU for a long time until I started working the L version. I kept it up for 10 weeks only doing it once a week in combination with L Pullups, and elevated my legs more as the weeks went by. Lo and behold, I can now do 3 consecutive HeSPu without having worked the negative.

Just A thought.

schlaffmann said:

I know this doesn't directly answer your question, but how are you at doing L-HeSPu? How how high can you Elevate your legs before you can't complete a full ROM L-HeSPu? I was having trouble doing the negative HeSPU for a long time until I started working the L version. I kept it up for 10 weeks only doing it once a week in combination with L Pullups, and elevated my legs more as the weeks went by. Lo and behold, I can now do 3 consecutive HeSPu without having worked the negative.

Just A thought.

Which one is the L-HeSPU? Is it the one with your feet on a box?

I was doing the box HeSPUs for a while and it didn't go very well. After a couple of weeks I lost all pressing strength. I couldn't do 1 rep with a 16k kettlebell and I've never not been able to press it before. I have no idea how that happened but I've been doing handstands against a wall and some pike pushups and my strength is coming back now.

The Hansenator said:

I've seen both partial reps and negatives recommended as a way of building up to HeSPUs. I was just wondering if one or the other is a better use of time and limited recovery ability? Would it make sense to work it both ways? How would you program it?

Right now I can do 3-5 half reps or I can do a slow negative, pausing briefly about 3/4 way down.

Thanks.

Partial reps are a good way to progress. Make a stack of books that is high enough for your head to hit at the bottom of your half rep. Do HeSPU when the WODs call for them and reduce the height of your book stack by about an inch each month. You should notice that you are always able to do 3-5 sets of 3-5 reps when you move down each inch.

Negatives require tons of recovery. If you do them, just do ONE negative at the end of your HeSPU workout and only do that one time a week, at the most. Personally, I don't think you are at the point where negatives are your best option, but I don't actually know you very well so I could be way wrong in my opinion. The isometric hold I mention later in this post is going to be your best option in my opinion.

Following the WODs will ensure that you develop balanced strength all over your body, and that development will bring your gains in the HeSPU department.

There is one other thing that you should do twice a week. A 10 second isometric hold at the bottom of your half rep. Get on the wall and drop down to your lowest point. Hold for as long as possible, up to 10 seconds, and as soon as you feel yourself lose position by even a quarter of an inch, stop. You're done. Don't do that more than twice each session, with two sessions a week.

When you can easily hold that 10 second isometric for two weeks straight, meaning four consecutive sessions, go down another inch and start over. Do NOT do this on the same day as your HeSPU workout. This can be done during the later part of your warm up without severely affecting your workout. Remember, two holds in the same day might be too much! Go for one quality 10s hold first! Rest as much as you need to if you choose to do a second hold. I don't recommend even toying with a second hold until your first hold is a good 10 seconds. Set some sort of a clock up so that you can watch it for accurate time measurement.

Thanks slizzardman!

I actually had my wife measure the distance from my head to the floor. It was 10 inches so I have a stack of books 5 inches high that I use.

slizzardman said:

Do NOT do this on the same day as your HeSPU workout. This can be done during the later part of your warm up without severely affecting your workout.

Just a quick question on the isometric hold: When you say not to do it on the same day as my HeSPU workout, I can do it any other day, just not the same day?

What if I work my partial HeSPUs on Mon and Fri and do the isometric hold on Wed?

You could do that.

I'd consider swapping those out, or at least swapping them every other week. Your muscles need time to recover and grow stronger!

However, what you propose is certainly reasonable! You may want to do Wednesday and Sunday for the isometrics.

Ok, thanks!

I just tried pike pushups with my feet up on a chair and I think it's a difficult enough exercise that I can still get some benefit from them, maybe as a lighter day.

How does something like this look?

Mon: Partial HeSPUs

Wed: Isometric hold

Fri: Pike pushups - feet on chair

Sun: Isometric hold

Unless there's something that would really work better, maybe I'll give that a try and see how it goes. I can always change something if needed.

Go for it! Ideally you want to see steady gains over a month. If you gain your first week and fall back a little your second week then you are probably doing too much. Thats the "easy" way to figure out if your volume is sufficient or too much!

slizzardman said:

Go for it! Ideally you want to see steady gains over a month. If you gain your first week and fall back a little your second week then you are probably doing too much. Thats the "easy" way to figure out if your volume is sufficient or too much!

Thanks, I'll pay attention to that.

slizzardman said:

Go for it! Ideally you want to see steady gains over a month. If you gain your first week and fall back a little your second week then you are probably doing too much. Thats the "easy" way to figure out if your volume is sufficient or too much!

That's what I am realizing. There were times when I thought I wasn't doing enough, because when I would take rest, or cut volume, I was still getting weaker. When I switched to steady state intensity and volume, my strength was coming back. It is becoming my default setting when things go wrong, or I get confused.

Steady state is surprisingly smart. There are a LOT of competitive lifters who enjoy great success by never really pushing to their true max. This is essentially the core of Jim Wendler's 531 program, and while that program does not follow a steady state approach the basic physical effect is similar: You NEVER try to work at your maximum workout after workout. Everything is sub-maximal except for when you take a new training max to base your next cycle off of.

That basic concept is the core of both the steady state cycle and one of the best lifting programs out there!

Steady state is more ideal for calisthenic work like gymnastics because we are using low leverage positions to develop strength. Each degree is harder than the last as you move further towards the final progression, which means that it is crucial that you give your body time to adapt to the training load it currently has. And, besides that, you'd need a partner, a laser level with an angle function, and some complex math if you tried to follow a progressive submaximal program with bodyweight. It's quite a lot of effort compared to the steady state cycle, and the end results aren't much different!