Rope climb Negatives cirques.

Hi besides legless rope climbs with strict descent on the way down what are the next following progressions for building up to the strict descent on the way down which means the negatives in the cirques? Sorry if i ask too much but how easy will rope climb make OAC i got no luck doing slight to minimal band assisted negatives with the OAC/OAP. Specially for the deadhang part that is the hardest part of the movement. 

Hi Asad, personally your negative is half rom negative. if you are intentionally doing half rom negative is ok, but if this is your level fo strength then you are not ready for negative.

What would i need to be ready then a 70-80% bodyweight percentage weighted chin up let me guess

I do not make assumptions basing on the % of weighted chin up. consider that my clients once completed Foundations 4 for rope climbing have already approximately 70% bodyweight on a weighted chin up. I had in the past one client who has reached the one arm chin up by working only with weighted chin up but it was only one. the other had the oac only with specific work after foundations 4 was completed. this ensures me a sort of safety margin in order to avoid elbows problem. all my strongest clients are completely pain-free. i mean people doing crosses, Maltese, one arm chin up , planche on rings, back lever muscleup etc. all of them had a very long work on basis that is exactly what is presented on foundations.

Why the only thing for me that for me is the hardest. Is the complete 100% deadhang and the top part as your can see here in the video. I dont got elbow discomfort or pain only some lat pain when did it on last saturday 

"only" lat pain is an abnormal condition. you should train pain-free, reach your goals pain-free.

once the pain is presented it is the only way that your body has to tell you that you are not prepared for the training you are doing.

Look dude it wasnt 100% completely pain only some slight discomfort!. But it hurted less today because as long as your take the progression slow and the body is capable of adapting then your doing it right.

Asad,

Slow down.  You are rushing.  If you continue, you will get injured.  Nothing slows down future progress more than training time lost to unnecessary injury.

Alex’s advice is spot on.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

And if i should follow Alex advice by conditioning my elbows shoulders. Did he actually got a full deadhang OAP by only doing rope climb or not?

I have 2 students who, after completing the foundations rope climbing section, had the one arm chin up. in the other cases, it represents a good transition from one arm partial pullup to full range of motion one arm pullup.

On 6/30/2019 at 11:44 AM, Asad Chaman-Ali said:

And if i should follow Alex advice by conditioning my elbows shoulders. Did he actually got a full deadhang OAP by only doing rope climb or not?

Asad,

Go do what you want.  It is clear that you are reluctant to follow Alex’s advice and are going to continue to quibble and nitpick.  After you get injured and heal, you will be much more open to following sound advice; even when that advice is contrary to what you want to hear.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

Look coach and alex. why do your mean do what i want to do. It is my own fault that i get injured. I actually did a heck alot of joint prep for the elbows forearms in the past. Which i still do sometimes for keeping them strong. For all that heavy pulling pushing. It is not everybody who can afford gymnasticbodies i really inside do wanted to get a gymnasticbodies program. The elbows isnt my problems more my lats serratus rotator cuff needs to be a heck alot of warm before i am even capable of doing the slightiest bit of One arm pull up. 

1 hour ago, Asad Chaman-Ali said:

Look coach and alex. why do your mean do what i want to do. It is my own fault that i get injured. I actually did a heck alot of joint prep for the elbows forearms in the past. Which i still do sometimes for keeping them strong. For all that heavy pulling pushing. It is not everybody who can afford gymnasticbodies i really inside do wanted to get a gymnasticbodies program. The elbows isnt my problems more my lats serratus rotator cuff needs to be a heck alot of warm before i am even capable of doing the slightiest bit of One arm pull up. 

 

This is one of the biggest mistakes that people will never understand. if you need to warm up yourself for 1 hour before doing an exercise it is not because you need warmup, it is because you are not ready for that exercise.

body thinks ib function of exercise and not for single muscles conditioning. you can use a magic trick, tool, objects. but the reality it is that body adapts to exercise and specific joint angles. 

do you have elbow pain? then in the exercise where you feeling pain, you are not enough prepared.

do you feel pain in serratus anterior? probably is by far worse than elbow because it is a shoulder/scapulae stabilizer. said that, again, do you have pain here? your serratus anterior is not enough prepared for.

we are offering you a training life without injury.

but seems that you are still convinced of your idea, no matter 40+ yo of Coach's experience and my almost 10 years experience working with adults.

now, you want suggestion but hearing what you are saying about the elbow, serratus anterior, rotator cuff, you are not prepared for your goals. not enough and I do not want to give you suggestions taking responsibility for further injuries. sorry, it's now my way to work.

sincerely, I'm not going to convince you anymore.

Asad, strength is something that could come from the main muscles needed for a good execution, or from compensatory muscles for a bad execution. In the calisthenics community you can see a lot of people doing exercises with a bad form just using compensation, and the truth is that they end with bad and even chronic injuries. The compensation comes from muscles that are not supposed to work on that load with that execution, the more you compensate the less the main muscles will work and therefore the compensatory muscles will need to work even more with time: the result is very bad for you. It would be great if the compensatory muscles could get strong enough but that won't happen, they are not mean to do what you are making them to do!

If you can afford gymnasticbodies program maybe you can at least do it with a friend, there are some couples here that do that! The program is meant to be personal but if you train together you can progress together.

Okay fine if its joint tendon prep your guys are saying what should i do instead buy a climbing rope or something like that? And do build up to 5x5 legless long stroke rope climbs. Apparently it do got a carryover to One arm pull up and it have some shoulder elbow conditioning effect too!

Asad,

"If it hurt why the f*ck did you keep doing it?" - My orthopedic surgeon

This is what he said during my first appointment after I was doing this type of stuff and destroyed both of my arms. 
Almost a year later and a few thousand dollars less in my pocket I am now finally able to train again....starting with incline rows and pushups.

Let my stupidity/ego and the advice of the coaches save you a lot of time, pain, and money. 

Okay fine if i should do gymnasticbodies joint prep type of style for the OAC were should i start i dont really got torn rotator cuff or inflammed elbows but the process is really slow as fuck.

14 hours ago, Asad Chaman-Ali said:

Okay fine if i should do gymnasticbodies joint prep type of style for the OAC were should i start i dont really got torn rotator cuff or inflammed elbows but the process is really slow as fuck.

Of course it is slow.  You are remodeling tissue.  The more advanced the skill you are pursing, the longer it will take.  Why should it be anything else?

The irony is that everyone who says they don’t have time to go ‘slow’ usually end up going even ‘slower’ due to injuries caused by the twin mistakes of impatience and imprudence.

Yours in Fitness,
Coach Sommer

But coach your are every word right. But if i should start somewhere were should it be. Let me guess the rope climb pull up series in foundation 1.

Yes.

Keep in your mind that nobody here knows your level of preparation and before telling you to do stressing movement we need a safety margin. primarily because it is what you need to train for 20+ years and then for a problem of responsibility. 

11 hours ago, Asad Chaman-Ali said:

But coach your are every word right. But if i should start somewhere were should it be. Let me guess the rope climb pull up series in foundation 1.

Difficult to say without my being there to personally evaluate you, which is why I encourage everyone who isn’t sure where to start to attempt mastery of a new progression each training day, starting from the beginning of the series.  You should fly through the easy progressions with little to no effort.  Nice thing about this approach is that, while it takes a month or two longer, it is very difficult to injure yourself.  And it also often highlights some previously undiscovered physical deficits.

Once you find your proper spot in the progressions, move at least several steps back from the mastery programming to allow your body time to adequately adapt without having to constantly strain.

Yours in Fitness,
Coach Sommer

Its not as much the elbows forearms that are my weak link in OAC more the rotator cuff shoulders so the question does it also include prep for the shoulders besides rope climbing itself will strengthen the forearms.

Look it is not because i am a complete beginner to pulling i am already capable of pulling a little bit over 50% bodyweight percentage if i weight those 85kg. So dont know what my exact level is if i should build up to legless rope climbs then cirques as the final end goal destination. Because of tissue remoldeling as coach said.

How much atm does the pull up rope climb series cost?.

Okay i actually choose to listen both to Alex and coach advice by doing it the most safe way. Even though i am not 100% completely new to pulling. I have done basic to weighted pull ups for 3-5 years. But in terms of progressive overload shall it be 1-2 total rep increase over every 4 week like if this week is 4x2 Because coach said somehow slow gradual progress in terms of tissue adapation.