Started by Hayden.M., February 6, 2010 · 15 Replies · 6,860 Views
hi
what are the prerequisits needed to perform an OAC? for example, how many pull ups should I be able to do? and what exercises should i supplement the pull up with to be able to do the OAC?
progressions and development ideas anybody?
any replies as always appreciated,
thanks
I would say once you can do 5x5 of the most difficult pull up variation in the book, which means you could also do 5x5 of all the other variations as well, then start working on assisted OAC. There is no magic sauce that you can use and then get a OAC first try. You have to work up to it and it is a very challenging movement.
Doesn't Jim from Beastskills cover this topic a bit? I try them from time to time but find it is a lot of stress on the relevant wrist and forearm.
Ido also covers some isometric one arm holds which seems to be a good route to go.
You need to take your time with the OAC/OAP. If you can't do at least 8 slow close grip pull ups with no problem, starting from a dead hang, going up for two seconds, holding at the top for one second, and lowering back down to dead hang for two seconds, you're not even close. Why close grip pull ups? Your hand's going to be in the center of your body when you do the OAC/OAP. Close grip work starts preparing your forearms, wrists, and elbows for the strain. That's going to take a long time, a few months at the very least if you haven't been doing close pull ups.
When you start getting close you should start doing one armed hangs to start working on hand strength. Once you can do 2 sets of at least 8 good close grip pull ups you should start working on uneven pull ups, where one hand is on the bar and the second hand is on the first hand's wrist. Chalk helps a lot on this, or long sleeves. Start doing sets with the same tempo. When you're doing at least two sets of 5 you should start working on short partials of the OAP/OAC. Start with your chin over the bar, and lower down a few inches, stop for a second, and pull back up. From here there are two routes you can go, and both are good ideas. You could just add an inch to your ROM every month or so until you are doing full ROM. The second method is to start working on assisted OAC/OAP. You hang a towel, rope, dog leash, or whatever else over the bar about a foot or two away from you, so you can pull up a little on it with the free hand. THis lets you assist yourself through the part of the ROM where you can't do it on your own. Once you get to where you are able to pull yourself up, stop assisting yourself! Keep doing this with less and less assistance as time goes on until you're doing OAP/OAC!
You should be able to do at least a set of 5 of +50% bodyweight pullups before you start to train OAC IMO.
You need the relevant connective tissue strength otherwise you will likely destroy yourself from overuse once you actually start training it.
Oh yea, well that's the point behind starting with uneven pull ups. Your wrists aren't the main issue, your elbows and shoulders are, and by hanging onto the wrist you can control your descents and ascents so that you're not overloading the joints to the point where they get hurt. You still need a high level of elbow flexor strength and conditioning of course, and I can't disagree with what you've put out, but don't you think that's more of a guideline to follow before doing unassisted negatives, or statics?
I need to ask one of my buddies about this. He can do one arm chins +20% bodyweight.
I'm not very close, but one way I've tried working them before is to do chins with hands close together on the way up, hold with one arm at the top for a couple of seconds, and then lower as slowly as possible with one arm. Repeat alternating arms.
braindx said:You should be able to do at least a set of 5 of +50% bodyweight pullups before you start to train OAC IMO.You need the relevant connective tissue strength otherwise you will likely destroy yourself from overuse once you actually start training it.
I'd like to add some guidelines I've heard and also observed with regards to the OAC, and when it might be time to train negatives and lock-offs: 20 strict dead-hang pull-ups; 1RM of BW+80%.
These are approximates, YMMV.
best of luck,
jason
Also, while doing pullups, reciting the alphabet backwards is another good requirement.
DrAlexisOlson said:I need to ask one of my buddies about this. He can do one arm chins +20% bodyweight.I'm not very close, but one way I've tried working them before is to do chins with hands close together on the way up, hold with one arm at the top for a couple of seconds, and then lower as slowly as possible with one arm. Repeat alternating arms.
Yes, negatives once the joints are prepared through other work IMO should be about 50% of the training.
My best is around +13% bodyweight
jasonmstein said:braindx said:You should be able to do at least a set of 5 of +50% bodyweight pullups before you start to train OAC IMO.You need the relevant connective tissue strength otherwise you will likely destroy yourself from overuse once you actually start training it.
I'd like to add some guidelines I've heard and also observed with regards to the OAC, and when it might be time to train negatives and lock-offs: 20 strict dead-hang pull-ups; 1RM of BW+80%.
These are approximates, YMMV.
best of luck,
jason
I don't know about 20 strict deadhangs. That's all I can do now even though I have the capacity to do OACs... lol. Very low endurance on my part.
I would definitely say 10 chest to bar or maybe belly button to bar strict reps which shows extremely good chinning control and strength.
If you have about 1 RM of +85-95% weighted chin you are probably strong enough to do OAC with practice.
When I was on my ship I could do the bottom 2/3 of the ROM. I just did heavy pull ups(10 reps with around 50-55% BW added), but looking back I would have been smarter to have been training specifically for the OAC.
I don't know about 20 strict deadhangs...I would definitely say 10 chest to bar or maybe belly button to bar strict reps which shows extremely good chinning control and strength.
This is an approximate idea of when your connective tissue is ready to begin training.
The guys who walk into the gym able to do OAC can do both 20 strict dead-hang and BW+80% chins. Again this is approximate.
The 20 deadhang is not so much a measure of endurance or strength but a measure of connective tissue capacity. You will destroy your elbows doing OA lock-offs, OA negatives and cirques if you haven't prepared them.
best,
jason
Very true. It's all about the tendons and ligaments, and they take a long time to grow stronger. When you have the ability to work in an endurance fashion under constant tension(i.e. tempo pull ups) with your bodyweight, your connective tissue has developed to the point where it is able to handle far more than what you are subjecting it to.
If you're doing quick, explosive pull ups for a set of 20 this does not apply. The connective tissue is not under significant strain for most of the movement, so you are not developing the joint integrity necessary to safely pull up nearly all of your bodyweight with one arm, or even to work negatives without serious risk of injury.
Perhaps it will make it easier if you understand how static ropes are tested, because ropes are just like connective tissue. They don't stretch much, and they are not rated by how much weight they can hold maximally, they are rated for how much weight they can hold for 10 minutes without being damaged. That is how maximum work load is established, and safe working load is sometimes considered to be only half of the maximum work load. So if you see a rope that is rated at 200 lbs, you can be assured that it can hold 400 lbs at least, for a short while. However, if you do that to the rope, you'll see that the fibers get distorted and start to come apart. That's exactly what happens to your connective tissue when you work beyond its' safe working load. You have to increase that to the point where your bodyweight is the safe working load for ONE ARM, and it takes a long time to do that.
Now... what happens when you can't use the other arm? *evil grin*
I just figured an assisted chin up machine would work best. Would negatives help me a lot if I wanted to train solely on the strength level, not caring for a "pump", hypertrophy, adrenaline rush, etc? I've been playing with one arm chins since wednesday, and I started to train 3-4 reps to, basically, failure.
Seiji said:Now... what happens when you can't use the other arm? *evil grin*I just figured an assisted chin up machine would work best. Would negatives help me a lot if I wanted to train solely on the strength level, not caring for a "pump", hypertrophy, adrenaline rush, etc? I've been playing with one arm chins since wednesday, and I started to train 3-4 reps to, basically, failure.
Negatives are the way most people get them...
This is the KILLERSET , called by cisco himself on the video.
anyway you have to have a good level before begin train with that set.
-xc7IrWy9tI
Good luck