Bar Weight for the first 6 PEs

What's the minimum bar weight to use for the mastery of the first PEs including the iM ones? It's written 5lb (roughly 2kg) for PE1iM, is it the same for the others (PE2iM, PE3iM, PE4 to PE6)?

2kg is fine for starting.  Under no circumstances however should an unweighted bar be used.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

Can someone explain the need for /purpose of the added weight for the mobility please? Does it make the action stronger and therefore more able when un loaded?

Many thanks

You don't just want to make it a stretch but to activate your muscles as well to build strength through the range of motion of the iM. Also, by activating your muscles you will increase blood flow to that area which should help rebuild your shoulders (which you are kind of aiming to do).

From my background, I believe there are few reasons depending on the movement. In general, the "appropriate" load facilitates improved range via:

1) Stimulating the agonist muscle groups to improve mechanics, as in early HS iM's. Just enough load will excite the deeper muscles surrounding a joint to increase the effort into the range. Too much load will squash the range of movement. 

2) Autogenic inhibition of the antagonist muscles, such as the posterior chain of the early MN iM and pHS iMs. Basically the correct load can relax the tight muscles, diving deeper into a range,

3) May add sarcomeres in series to legthen a muscle unit in the eccentric phase.

The facilitation reasons above are much different than "strength" training.

A few follow up questions to the OP:

1. Is it safe to say that 2kg (approx 4.5-5lbs) is sufficient for demonstrating mastery in all of the H1 iM, PE, and SE that utilize a weighted bar?
2. Once we have achieved the "sufficient" weight, what is the goal weight for these movements?
3. I tend to train the old mobilities as a warm-up and try adding weight slightly as I get comfortable, but I'm not sure what a good stopping point would be. Any other recommendations for keeping old mobility in your training?

1) I would rather see 5kg+ myself, but I understand 5lb with perfect rom is the minimum to demonstrate mastery 

2/3) We have previously discussed working up to 20kg+ on these mobility  elements longterm. 

On 5/1/2016 at 7:52 PM, Jon Douglas said:

2/3) We have previously discussed working up to 20kg+ on these mobility  elements longterm. 

Wow! Just thinking about a 45lb standing shoulder extension is insane

Yeah, i don't have that myself, but Daniel Burnham wrote some about it benefitting manna development

I'll start HS/PE10 tomorrow and so far I've been doing some of the previous bar mobility exercises ( PE1iM, PE2iM, PE5iM  mainly) in between sets during PE9 and the levels before to increase the weight and I was wondering if it' ok to do so because I'm planning to keep doing that during my PE10 workouts. I'm currently using a 10kg bar (started with 2kg back when I first did them).

Certainly its okay to keep doing them. I always starty handstand workouts with a few sets of weighted shoulder mobility

On 5/8/2016 at 4:31 PM, Jon Douglas said:

Certainly its okay to keep doing them. I always starty handstand workouts with a few sets of weighted shoulder mobility

Can you give us an idea of what movements and weight amounts you use? Currently I do Controlled shoulder articulation rotations and I use bands to do shoulder extensions and dislocates before moving onto light weight shoulder extensions

16 hours ago, Randeep Walia said:

Can you give us an idea of what movements and weight amounts you use? Currently I do Controlled shoulder articulation rotations and I use bands to do shoulder extensions and dislocates before moving onto light weight shoulder extensions

Sure. I keep everything to the weight of my weakest one, justfor convenience.

Today i did a full body limber, then a 'circuit' of 3x5 through with 10kg 

Shoulder extension 

Prone dislocate

Prone undergrip dislocate

(Then weighted pancakes, then onto HS workout)

I've been correcting an overactive pec minor that has caused me *untold* grief, and being very diligent not to add weight before getting shoulder width at my weaker grip, which is the undergrip for me. The others are easy do I'm putting in deliberate, controlled reps.

Doing it this way has forced me to put effort into what i find most difficult, because the penalty of being bored at a light weight on the others is adequate punishment to encourage my concentration  results, along with that pesky pec minor (which is a godsend; now i can do hbp15/im easily with good ROM), have been in loosening up my biceps and most particularly my forearms, which has been quite striking. I can now perform that damn extension walk from thoracic bridge series correctly, which despite the series being pretty easy for me i was plain unable to do in front of Coach in Nov last year! (He pointed out that forearm tightness was a potential issue on this stretch, which made me think about the forearm stretch in the front position of undergrip dislocates, and it turned out to be, surprise, right on the money).

I can standing dislocate 15kg+ although  I'm not sure what width right now; i use about  double shoulder width grip on weighted pancakes with 25kg which is easy; i prefer the lying ones right now because i can feel a good hs bodyline better against the matt, whilst I'm tempted to cheat with my body when standing as it gets heavier. I also wanted to work a harder variation so that i could keep the weight down and prevent myself from getting too carried away and upping the weight too quickly since, as mentioned,  I'm experiencing a mobility spurt right now . That's not to say that standing dislocates should be replaced by lying, just something i want to keep an eye on in myself.

I can ensure that around 15 kg (at least) of shoulders dislocate (standing prone version) all the major issues and little pain pf the shoulders disappear. extreme benefits you will obtain on shoulder girdle balance and on specific human flag development.

5 hours ago, Jon Douglas said:

I keep everything to the weight of my weakest one

Smart.

5 hours ago, Jon Douglas said:

the penalty of being bored at a light weight on the others is adequate punishment to encourage my concentration 

I appreciate this kind of thinking. Reminds me I may not be as weird as I think!

5 hours ago, Jon Douglas said:

the forearm stretch in the front position of undergrip dislocates, and it turned out to be, surprise, right on the money).

One thing I love about some of Jon’s post is that they’re sprinkled with almost cryptic, futuristic gems. The same could be said for all the other forum coaches! By futuristic gems I mean, little reminders of what not to do, how to prevent it, or simply revealing a potential time bomb. But you won’t get any of that if you don’t read between the lines. Ironically, it is the opposite of what some peeps are asking, while I’m sure tempted to follow his inspirational foot steps.

If you read carefully, you will understand why you should NOT try anything he is doing because he is Jon and you and me are in our uniquely own spot along the path. It may be the same path, but we haven’t traveled the same mileage, nor come with the same "baggage” or gifts. So please "don’t try this at home" and avoid the temptation of getting "creative" with your own programing, unless you know something about programming and your body. Even then, I strongly think nothing beats having a world-class Coach with your best interest in mind and we have that right here in this forum! Is this real or what!^#%+

Thank you @Jon Douglas and coaches for the numerous aha! moments.
 

That's an interesting way to put it

My experiences are shared with the trust that everyone can distinguish between following the professionally produced step by step courses written by a long-time national team coach of frankly unfair knowledge, experience and success; and myself

What are you guys using for a 2kg bar? My gym has 20kg olympic bars and lighter all-in-one bars 10kg and up. Can I use 1kg dumbells in each hand?

17 hours ago, Eric Ling said:

What are you guys using for a 2kg bar? My gym has 20kg olympic bars and lighter all-in-one bars 10kg and up. Can I use 1kg dumbells in each hand?

Use a wooden or pvc dowel and slide a single weight plate onto the center of the bar.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

Before i had access to a gym i hung wrist /ankle weights over a broomstick too.

If you get annoyed by the weight plate(s) sliding along the dowel you can get something like a "weighted aerobic bar" (eg. from amazon) and combine it with ankle weights for weight variation.

One thing I like about the sliding weight is that it provides instant feedback in assymetry in the shoulders