Clearing up the PE2>iM movement

Hello!

I've been sifting through the forum in order to find cues on how to correctly perform HS/PE2>iM, but I've seen some confusing and sometimes contradictory suggestions. This resulted in some questions:

1. What should the scapula position be during the movement?

- elevated / depressed

- protracted / retracted

I'm getting very different ROM using different scapula orientation. In the video it seems like the athlete depresses and retracts, but my unknowing eyes are not sure.

2. I've always read that elbow pits should be facing downwards as to prevent shoulder rotation which could mask missing shoulder extension ROM. But when I try to keep my elbow pits facing down, it feels as if I have to rotate my shoulder/elbow inward (at least on a fairly wide grip), is this correct? My pits automatically rotate outward to a degree when I'm retracting.

3. Which are the correct muscles used in the movement? I've read that in this exercise, one shouldn't feel strain in the triceps, but rather in the muscles of the upper back. So does this mean, middle traps should fire to pull the hands together and bring them up?

And which muscles would be stretched? Pec minor and front deltoids?

I'm really trying to understand the movement, because I don't want to progress on a path just to find out later that it's been the wrong one and having to start over.

Thanks a lot

Daniel

Does nobody have any ideas? :/

I really feel demotivated by this exercise because I just can't seem to get the technique right...

1. What should the scapula position be during the movement?

depressed and neutral, excessive protraction will increase the risk of impingement . excessive retraction could leads to open chest. and this is not the goal.

2. while holding the previous scapula position the body always follows functions. so it will assume the best anatomical conformation-

3. triceps, middle, upper, lower traps. rotator cuff muscles , rombhoids,  rear delts and scapula lats fibers.

Thank you for your answer, Alex!

What exactly do you mean in the second point?

Does it mean that I should just focus on keeping a neutral and depressed scapula and then on lifting the arms up while letting the arms/elbows assume their 'best anatomical conformation' (The one that comes most naturally I suppose?)

I wanted to say thanks again, my mobility has improved tremendously over the last month using the hints alex gave in the thread.

But I stumbled upon the AMA Coach gave on reddit, and he stated that the correct scapular position should be depressed and retracted, if I see this correctly. 

http://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/comments/2tknnm/coach_sommer_ama/co09a7d

I guess I will try and retract a bit more while focusing on not letting the chest open, like alex suggested. Maybe this will push my mobility to mastery standards.

Just to help, I asked Daniel about this movement regarding press to manna a while ago. The takeaway for me was beginning strongly depressed and somewhat retracted; further retraction occurs as part of the lifting movement and it fixes itself pretty naturally by focusing on going straight back, not trying to dislocate it, and aiming for good ROM. Can't just slam your shoulders together and hope you are strong enough, it's not about isolation, it is about getting them to move properly and in co-ordination with your limbs

I hope I haven't just muddied the waters....

Jon Douglas said:

I hope I haven't just muddied the waters....

Muddy is my waters SOP. I wouldn't have the slightest idea where to begin with anything if it were anything but .

Makes perfect sense, thank you for the further clarification, Jon!