Optimal Weight/body fat for Foundation Progress?

Hi I just started foundation 1 this week and woo it's harder than it looks.

The title says it all.

I am 6", 187lbs (85kg), about 12% body fat. I train and teach martial arts and lift 3 times a week (have now cut the lifting down for foundation 1)

I have just come down from about 200lbs (91kg) and can really feel the difference in how much easier the bodyweight movements feel to do and also how easy they are on my joints. just from that 13lb drop.

So I was wondering if it makes sense to keep dropping weight. If this will continue to benefit me in my training. And also where the point of diminishing returns is. So where continuing to lose weight would not be worth it.

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Also mentioned body fat as I would like to know if there is a general consensus as to what is too high/low for gymnastics and if there is a sweet spot?

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Thank you and good training to you all,
Alex

Being lighter will obviously make body weight training easier, but does it really benefit your training that it becomes easier? Its a bit like removing a couple of plates from the bar and noting that it is now much easier to lift, but would it be especially beneficial to train like that?

I suppose it depends on your goals; If you want to reach the next step in your progression quickly then yes, it will help if you drop weight. If on the other hand you want to develop as much strength as possible (not relative strength), then I don't think it's a particularly beneficial thing to go much lower than you are.

Muscle is denser than body fat. Keep doing what you have doing and let your body reach it's own optimal weight.

Thanks for the reply.

I can see your point there, hadn't really approached it from there.
 

I think I would like to move through the foundations at as good a speed as possible though, so losing a little bit of fat shouldn't affect my strength too much while making the exercises a bit easier.

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Also I would like to practise for aerial cartwheels and other dynamic movements that I think would be a lot easier on my joints at a lighter weight.

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I think a part of is that most of the guys you see doing the high end skills are just very light.

 

Rayne-William said:

Muscle is denser than body fat. Keep doing what you have doing and let your body reach it's own optimal weight.

+1

If you're actually at 12% bodyfat (not doubting your word, just don't know which method you used), you're close to the point where less fat is not always better. If you search through the nutrition forum, you'll see multiple times some of the more knowledgeable guys here underline that a lower bodyfat percentage doesn't always equal better performance and that's more often than not the contrary.

It still depends a lot on each individual, but the point is, if your nutrition is good, you'll slowly get to your ideal weight/fat percentage as your training progresses.

Bro said:

+1

 

If you're actually at 12% bodyfat (not doubting your word, just don't know which method you used), you're close to the point where less fat is not always better. If you search through the nutrition forum, you'll see multiple times some of the more knowledgeable guys here underline that a lower bodyfat percentage doesn't always equal better performance and that's more often than not the contrary.

It still depends a lot on each individual, but the point is, if your nutrition is good, you'll slowly get to your ideal weight/fat percentage as your training progresses.

I'd say between 11 and 14 percent. Admittedly I'm just going off of what I look like as an indicator of my BF, I have pretty visible abs now so am assuming I'm near 12%.

I cut mostly as a result of switching to a primal/paleo style diet from a bulking diet where I was consuming a lot of whole milk - I'd gained about 20lb prior while running starting strength. With probably 12-15 of it being muscle. Also I was - loosely - intermittent fasting which I think helped.

To be honest being a bit lighter helps martial arts a lot as well so I didn't mind losing a bit of weight.

Ideally I'd like to hit 9% and then slowly increase weight again while remaining single digit BF.

Alex Tansel said:

Ideally I'd like to hit 9% and then slowly increase weight again while remaining single digit BF.

Be careful of artificial number targets.  If your goal is to be a better martial artist and gymnast, find the weight and body composition that helps you be a better martial artist and gymnast, regardless what the number may be.

Alex Tansel said:

I cut mostly as a result of switching to a primal/paleo style diet from a bulking diet where I was consuming a lot of whole milk - I'd gained about 20lb prior while running starting strength. With probably 12-15 of it being muscle. Also I was - loosely - intermittent fasting which I think helped.

 

Oh GOMAD.  When I was 15 it brought my squat from 85lb to 300lb in under 5 months.  The trade off is I am permanently lactose intolerant.  

Washienko said:

Oh GOMAD. When I was 15 it brought my squat from 85lb to 300lb in under 5 months. The trade off is I am permanently lactose intolerant.

You raised your squat simply by drinking milk!?!?

Washienko said:

Oh GOMAD.  When I was 15 it brought my squat from 85lb to 300lb in under 5 months.  The trade off is I am permanently lactose intolerant.  

Ha! My squat was just coming up to 300lb before I backed off for this style of training, would have been nice but I reckon my joints will thank me in the long run for taking my time with my connective tissue/mobility. (also 215lb increase in 5 months is freaking insane, your arse must have tripled in size haha)

But I've never really been able to take dairy in the same way since. Extreme lactose intolerance. Works out well for primal eating though as dairy is at a minimum.

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For the guys that still do heavy squats/deadlifts while training F1, how do you structure your training? (as in days per week and also if you use certain rep ranges to minimize hypertrophy)

Thank you

Daniel Burnham said:

You raised your squat simply by drinking milk!?!?

I raised my squat with progressive overload and a caloric surplus.

I started as the weakest and ended as the strongest because I really wanted it.