Quick skin the cat question

Is skin the cat exercise considered as training for back lever ?

I would consider it a prerequisite for back lever training.  If there is any discomfort in the elbows during skin the cat, they aren't ready for back lever training. 

jules said:

I would consider it a prerequisite for back lever training.  If there is any discomfort in the elbows during skin the cat, they aren't ready for back lever training. 

If no elbow discomfort then would you say for sure "good to go"? Or are there other considerations for safety/long term joint health?

GeoffeyLevens said:

If no elbow discomfort then would you say for sure "good to go"? Or are there other considerations for safety/long term joint health?

For sure? No. There are many prerequisites and they're laid out in the foundation series. Coach believes we should have rope climbs mastered before back lever training begins.

Vincearoo said:

For sure? No. There are many prerequisites and they're laid out in the foundation series. Coach believes we should have rope climbs mastered before back lever training begins.

That should be easy for me, in a couple years!!!! HAH!   Oh well. Thanks for the info.

I do skin the cat before i try to work on my back lever. It warms me up

 Yes, it is.

so is the bottom hold on skin the cat/german hang passive or active?  

 

am i just hanging as far down as my body will allow or am i not going that far down and tightening my muscles to hold the bottom position?

 

how far do i need to go down to ensure that i have full flexibility in my shoulders and elbows before starting back lever progressions?

 

ive been working on flexibility by putting my feet on some boards, after flipping over backwards, to start the stretch in my shoulders and elbows without murdering my elbows since my elbows are feeling it the most (palms facing up).  i also practiced just flipping over backwards and lowering down in a controlled manner (and not holding a stretch at the bottom) to work on strength.  now im nearly competent with that controlled motion and need to know how far into the stretch i should go to prep for back lever.

Its active, but the more flexible your shoulders are, the less resistant and the more passive it will feel.

 

My eyes started hurting trying to find a decent skin the cat video. 

This is the best one I could find before my eyes started bleeding:

 

This is the type of range you want at the bottom of the movement. 

 

You should only consider BL training if you can hang around for a while in the bottom position of a skin the can, with your palms facing DOWN (at the bottom of the movement), and without any elbow pain/discomfort.

 

In the mean time, you can prepare yourself for the skin the cat by stretching your shoulders while standing with your arms behind you grabbing on to a bar.

ok thanks for the video.  now i have a visual on have far i should go down.

 

yeah from what ive read 3x30 seconds of skin the cat is preferred before bl training.

 

another question, is it necessary to be able to flip back out of skin the cat or is that just for extra strength?  ive tried it and i cant budge from the bottom lol.

You should be able to move all the way to the bottom position and pull back out of it. 

how do i work on that?  start at the top of the flip then slowly work on going deeper and deeper in the hang?

A good place to start is starting with reps from normal hang, tuck your legs through, lower down to your current end range and then pull back.  After your reps and sets are done, then work on your static hang to increase the range of movement. 

Some people might disagree with me, and chose to stretch out first then do reps, but for this particular movement, I prefer Reps then stretch.   (Note:  'Skin the cat' means going in and out of the movement. Skin the cat hang or German hang, is that static hang/stretch).

 

So your program might end up looking something like this:

Skin the cat   2x5-10r

German hang 2x30s

Skin the cats should be easy as eating pie before you really should be concerned about a back lever. Doing 5 skin the cats for my little guys was a benchmark as was 10 and Erik could do 20+ if there was ice cream in it for him.

 

There are progressions for skin the cat, such as negatives, reduced ROM, tuck, adv tuck, pike, straddle, 1/2 lay, straight. Etc, etc.

jules said:

A good place to start is starting with reps from normal hang, tuck your legs through, lower down to your current end range and then pull back.  After your reps and sets are done, then work on your static hang to increase the range of movement. 

Some people might disagree with me, and chose to stretch out first then do reps, but for this particular movement, I prefer Reps then stretch.   (Note:  'Skin the cat' means going in and out of the movement. Skin the cat hang or German hang, is that static hang/stretch).

 

So your program might end up looking something like this:

Skin the cat   2x5-10r

German hang 2x30s

thanks i did not know the difference between the two but that makes sense now.

Blairbob said:

Skin the cats should be easy as eating pie before you really should be concerned about a back lever. Doing 5 skin the cats for my little guys was a benchmark as was 10 and Erik could do 20+ if there was ice cream in it for him.

 

There are progressions for skin the cat, such as negatives, reduced ROM, tuck, adv tuck, pike, straddle, 1/2 lay, straight. Etc, etc.

progressions for skin the cat or back lever?

Progressions for the back lever are simple... i did it this way:

3x5 skin the cats (tightly tucked, tuck, adv tuck, half full, full)

2x20s german hang hold (not active, so more a stretch. I probably should be active (trying to pull scapula together - retraction. I don't know. I've read it here one time)

 

Now for the actuall back lever i suggest a hold and a pull

so tightly tucked, tucked, advance tuck, half full, straddle, one leg in one leg out, full

Same for back lever lifts (you lower yourself from inverted hang to back lever and back to inverted hang)

thanks for the advice.  i could actually do 5 skin the cats in a row to my surprise.  once i get more competent with them, such as full leg extension, then ill work on german hangs then back lever progressions.

quick question.  does anybody else have a problem with their armpits rubbing when doing skin the cat on a bar?  i dont have rings so i dont know if the same thing happens but when i did them i had to put on a compression shirt to reduce the amount my armpits rubbed.  it still hurt a lot but it wasnt as bad as with a regular t-shirt.

 Don't shave your armpits, man.

 Seriously. I tried shaving them a few times and if anything there was more friction. Noticeable during support swings on PB.

I had to shave my armpits one when I was competing in Russia (long story), Doesn't feel right, and I would say there is more friction.

And (non-judgementally) why do you train with a compression shirt?  I've seen those things pop up the last few years and I still dont get them. What it is that they claim to do?

They are pretty good and not sliding down and over your head while inverted. They are supposed to keep you a bit warmer but I don't feel it even in my compression shorts really. Probably depends on thickness.

jules said:

I had to shave my armpits one when I was competing in Russia (long story), Doesn't feel right, and I would say there is more friction.

And (non-judgementally) why do you train with a compression shirt?  I've seen those things pop up the last few years and I still dont get them. What it is that they claim to do?

i dont shave my armpits, never have.  i was given the compression shirt and wear it every now and then to work out if i dont have a clean t shirt.  not sure of the actual benefits but it does feel nice to work out in.

did skin the cat again today and it still hurts my armpits.  i tried being loose but in control in my shoulders but still have to tense up towards the bottom and pull my arms in and thats where the rubbing comes in to play.

 

might try some baby powder next time to see if that helps.

 

oh and i use a shoulder width or slightly wider than shoulder width grip if that makes any difference.

Personally I've stopped working on rings one for BL progression until some weeks ago. I spent my last 8 months improving my german hang flexibility. the difference is simply impressive in therms of range of motion that you can obtain by using proper mobility as foundation 4 shows.

Personally I prefer to look for 165-180° of open shoulders.