SLS/PE1 Form Issue, but Mastered… Should I move on to SLS/PE2?

For this leg workout, I realized that I am not flexible enough to take it to the next level with SLS, yet, or am I wrong?

Although I feel I mastered the SLS/PE1, you can say I cheated within the "Deck Squat".  Rolling forward, I had to use my hands, on the ground, for leverage to help get up, but I managed to do the full MASTERY of it, AND the mobility for it was not hard.  My thought to get back to the PE1 was PE2's mobility, the "Twisting Squats".  It literally told me that I was not flexible enough, as I tried to lift up only going a few inches off the ground and landing back down; I had to use either my left or right hand to help get up, each time, depending on where I was twisting to get up.  And so I said to myself "back to the drawing board"...  

Was that a good idea or should I go through SLS/PE2's Block 3, even Block 2, because I went through SLS/PE2, and it's not hard to do the side to side "Cossack Squat".  It's just the mobility that's kind of in my way, and I'm thinking I will adjust eventually with that, as it states within the Mastery of that Mobility.  But before going there, I would love to hear your opinion(s) on this one.

P.S.  I've practiced getting up from SLS/PE2>iM from going through a stretching routine I did Saturday and that's how realized that I'm coming off the ground a few inches and landing on my butt.  I'm only guessing in time I'll be strong enough to hold it and go up standing without my hands.

P.P.S, I am 6'0", coming from weight lifting background.  MAYBE that's why it is harder for me to get up from the SLS/PE1.  I'm told my legs are long, I guess.

The general consensus is that you should not move on to the next element if you have not passed the previous one. There may be special cases, but Coach and the other experienced members can help with those.

Can you post a form check of SLS/ PE1 without hands? iM too? I think if the we see what's going on, we can give you steps to address the problem. 

This is an excercice where I find people seem to have most mobility problems: Deep squat. Either ankle mobility prevents people getting in to this position or really stiff hamstrings break the form. Just try to tuck your knees really close to the chest and keep your heels attached to your buttocks (haha). Also keep abdominal tension like in hollow body hold to get that rocking movement going which eases the transition for getting to deep squat position.

I would also like to see your form the help you out more and I would not progress to the next level if I was not 100% sure I completed the mastery as prescribed. I started Foundation One this week and I try to keep the mentality of not letting myself go easy. I punish myself for bad reps and disallow the mastery if it is not perfect.

I have been training like this three years (functional training of different kind) and I am not planning to let myself go easy on this either.

kingzlo said:

 

Rolling forward, I had to use my hands, on the ground, for leverage to help get up, but I managed to do the full MASTERY of it.

If you had to use your hands, you didn't do full mastery of it.  By definition.

I predict that if you go back and stay with the deck squats until you can do full mastery, you will find that you are strong and mobile enough later to get those twisting squats moving in the right direction.  There really isn't much point in hopping past steps you haven't mastered.  You will just be limited (or injured) down the road, and in any event this isn't a race to the finish.

If you can't get off the floor without using your hands, try a regression for the deck squat.  Stand next to an elevated surface, like a mat or even a mattress, and do the squats back onto that.  Once that's easy, use a lower mat.  Eventually, you'll have the ability to go to the floor.

I agree with the above comments. You do need to do this without using hands.  Once you do move on to twisting squats, you will still find them difficult, at least i did.  It helps to start them sitting on a small block or pillow, then gradually lower yourself over many weeks until you are doing them sitting flat on ground.  A mildly sloped hill will work for this as well. It will allow you do the motion, and get used to the mobility as you slowly improve.  Have fun, and nice to have you on the forum.

mcneuen said:

 

If you can't get off the floor without using your hands, try a regression for the deck squat.  Stand next to an elevated surface, like a mat or even a mattress, and do the squats back onto that.  Once that's easy, use a lower mat.  Eventually, you'll have the ability to go to the floor.

That seems to make sense.  What I may use is my aerobic stepper (or a long pillow or two), long enough for my upper body, from head to butt, for about a week or two.  Almost reminds me of when I had to use a pillow during 'meditation' and eventually I was able to do without and simply sit on the floor.  The two just may compliment each other in the long haul.  

Overall, I will continue doing the Deck Squat till I get it 'strictly', so it's back to the drawing board with SLS/PE1.  Thank you all for your replies.  

So I used my aerobic stepper, as a crutch, to workout my leg routine of SLS/PE1, last week, and went into mastery with it.  LOL.  On a serious note, this week, yesterdays (Monday) routine, I've decided not to use it and go STRICT.  At first I managed to up up a few inches before I fell on my butt, and I rolled back and it happened again.  I almost went for the stepper, but then I saw a video of someone going a similar route that I was in with not being able to go up and down.  Then I thought to myself how much stronger I've gotten around my back, waisteline, abdominals and butt, as I was going through MN/PE1 (week 7), and SL/PE2 (week 2 (had to fall back on week 2 again, thinking week 3 was too much for me and I was on 13th rep on the first set)).

So, I got up, rolled backwards, rolled forwards, kept my legs in, and FINALLY managed to get up without my hands.  Only issue now is the fact that as I go up, I may come back down, so instinctually and automatically I'm stepping backwards like 2-4 steps backwards so I'm not falling.  After going there for a time, 5 sets, of each being 6 reps, it was not really exhausting, sweat came out of nowhere.  My last 2 sets, I managed to come up with 2 steps backwards to catch myself.  I believe I did 5 sets overall, so I'll be on Block 2 on Friday.  

I call that progress.  Looking forward to not going backwards stepping to catch myself on Friday.  Stay tuned.  

kingzlo said:

 My last 2 sets, I managed to come up with 2 steps backwards to catch myself.  I believe I did 5 sets overall, so I'll be on Block 2 on Friday.  

 

I call that progress.  Looking forward to not going backwards stepping to catch myself on Friday.  Stay tuned.  

Hi first time posting here, new to this stuff, doing foundation and handstand together so far....

I too am having similar issues as you except I don't use hands but just barely get up with a step or two backwards to catch me once I'm up. In the beginning it was very humbling as I couldn't even rock forward to get up and would land hard on my back at times. I used a partner that held a length of PVC I could hold or grab when needed and did sort of negatives and assisted forward rolls which I think helped me with developing strength and ROM for this movement. It seemed to me that if I concentrated on a tight tuck and forward roll momentum I could get enough force to get up. I think it also is a prob of flexibility in such a deep squat position. Not sure about you but when I try to hold this bottom position, the one just after the roll before one stands, it is very tight. I think if I spend some time in this position as a stretch might help too.

Hey Sean,

I felt great about my new found strength that I tried to do it cold.  I think there is a reason to hitting the abs (MN) and the lower back / gluts (SL) and their iM's.  Back when I used to lift, I noticed after a while of something difficult, became easy.  As I was working my abs, lower back, and gluts, I felt more powerful.  With special emphasis on my abdominals.  My imagination went wild as I felt even the lower section of my abs during the MN.  

It's those areas of the body that prepares for the legs (SLS).  I'm heaving myself forward and upwards, with real breath out.  Just like with lifting weight (no longer doing), eventually it gets easy.

As for flexibility, I stretch before and after my workout routines.  And I started stretching on my off days for a good length of time, overall body, with more emphasis (longer stretches) on legs.  Meditation is great as well, in that seated position, to relax the areas of the legs.

Sean said:

 

Not sure about you but when I try to hold this bottom position, the one just after the roll before one stands, it is very tight. I think if I spend some time in this position as a stretch might help too.

I THINK that may be your upper quads.  That area, and overall body, needs to get some stretches in.  I googled "upper quad stretch" and came up with some interesting pictures that all seem to go the same route of stretching, and there are video demos.  Google the quotation marks and see what I'm talking about.  

If you plan on doing those and other stretches, make sure you don't stretch too long before your workout, I'd say 15 seconds, if you go there.  But definately get the stretch in after the fact, for 30 seconds.

Hey Kingzlo,

Yes good idea Ill look into that. Just doing a standing quad stretch and I can feel how tight it is.  Trying to compress my knee to my chest and I can feel my hammies holding it back. I've always had tight hamstrings for some reason. It's humbling to be rolling around outside  like a zombie trying to get my body to do the im's  and at the same time reveals to me that I need a lot of mobilization. Probably from my years of being under the bar. 

Today I spent some time in the bottom squat position and used my weighted pvc tube for the handstand course as counter balance. I find my previously sprained ankle and hamstrings just under the glutes to be very tight but after using this technique for a couple 30 sec holds i was able to drop the PVC and sink into the bottom squat more easily without needing counter balance. Its obvious to me that I need to do a lot more of these. Might use this as a warm up for my next workout day.   Thanks for the response!

I'm a long-time martial artist.  I can do 3/4 of a SLS, plus all horse stance and lunges associated with martial arts, so I figured I'd breeze through these first few progressions.  Imagine my surprise when I can't do the first one with strict form!

Leg strength isn't the issue, plus the momentum of the roll helps push you forward.  It seems to be balance and flexibility.  Powering up from the bottom position, my feet inevitable move to catch myself from falling.  Closer inspection reveals that I cannot sit in the bottom position at all, not without immediately falling over.

When they say check your ego at the door, they really mean it.  The combination of strength, flexibility and balance is tough.  It sucks to be held back, but I'll take it if it means eventual mastery down the line.

Jonathan Pettit said:

I'm a long-time martial artist. I can do 3/4 of a SLS, plus all horse stance and lunges associated with martial arts, so I figured I'd breeze through these first few progressions. Imagine my surprise when I can't do the first one with strict form!

Leg strength isn't the issue, plus the momentum of the roll helps push you forward. It seems to be balance and flexibility. Powering up from the bottom position, my feet inevitable move to catch myself from falling. Closer inspection reveals that I cannot sit in the bottom position at all, not without immediately falling over.

When they say check your ego at the door, they really mean it. The combination of strength, flexibility and balance is tough. It sucks to be held back, but I'll take it if it means eventual mastery down the line.

I hear you. I could do multiple reps of full ROM weighted and jumping SLS before I started F1, but couldn't do even week 1's volume (some days no reps at all) of deck squats with correct form.

The GB programs really do demonstrate what Coach said in his podcast with Rob Wolf about we adults being (for the most part) way out of balance athletically speaking.

Keegan said:

I hear you. I could do multiple reps of full ROM weighted and jumping SLS before I started F1, but couldn't do even week 1's volume (some days no reps at all) of deck squats with correct form.

The GB programs really do demonstrate what Coach said in his podcast with Rob Wolf about we adults being (for the most part) way out of balance athletically speaking.

Thank god I'm not the only one. I have moments of frustration at times wondering what is the theory behind rolling around on the ground to do a squat and how this pertains to working a single leg squat. At the same time I know there is something I'm lacking if I can't perform exactly what appears to be a simple move and therefore I know theres more to this. Part of why I've come to respect this method, as I'm working through the progressions I feel like I'm kinda rebuilding myself. That being said, kinda wish there was more written as to the purpose for choosing the types of movements that are required. I enjoy learning the theory as to why it is I'm doing the movements I am and how it pertains to the body's development and future goals. just my two cents... 

Sean said:

... That being said, kinda wish there was more written as to the purpose for choosing the types of movements that are required. I enjoy learning the theory as to why it is I'm doing the movements I am and how it pertains to the body's development and future goals. just my two cents...

Good question and one that is addressed as an overview in the GB seminars and in greater detail during the master classes. Each of the GB educational programs has its proper time, place and function:

- The role of the courses is to disperse basic GST progressions and programming.

- The role of the forums is to expand upon the information provided in the courses.

- The role of the seminars is to expand upon the information provided in the courses.

- The role of the master classes is to expand upon the information provided in the seminars.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

p.s. Before the emails come pouring in; the GB Master Classes are by invitation only and are only for GB instructors in development.

p.p.s. And yes, they are totally awesome.

p.s. Before the emails come pouring in; the GB Master Classes are by invitation only and are only for GB instructors in development.

p.p.s. And yes, they are totally awesome.

Thanks Coach for taking time out of your, I'm sure, massively busy schedule to answer a question from one of the low faces on the totem pole lol.  Quite the honour a man of your serious professional background would do so. If I may ask a follow up question, How does one qualify for GB instructor status, complete all current and future course material with certifications? This I find intriguing.....

Thank you for your (and any others) efforts in putting this course material together. I love this kind of stuff and believe this will help me take it to the next level ( ring work is my goal). Patience would be an understatement in tackling these techniques and iM's. You could nick name me swiss cheese for all the holes in my technique and structure that has been revealed to me as a result of implementing your material. That's ok though because anything new worth doing will come with it's share of personal faults to be revealed, restructured, and transcended.  

Sorry I hope this isn't inappropriate to post this here as I see I'm taking someone else's thread a bit off course. Thank you in advance. 

Is the qualifications for GB instructors basically passing Foundation mastery tests or something separate that's a work in development

alan tseng said:

Is the qualifications for GB instructors basically passing Foundation mastery tests or something separate that's a work in development

The first step for anyone is GB Athlete Level .5 Certification. This should be the sole focus before thinking at all about what comes after. There is a world of difference between completing all the PE1-3s according to internet standards and demonstrating mastery standards according to Coach's expectations. 

Cory Fair said:

The first step for anyone is GB Athlete Level .5 Certification. This should be the sole focus before thinking at all about what comes after. There is a world of difference between completing all the PE1-3s according to internet standards and demonstrating mastery standards according to Coach's expectations. 

sorry don't mean to belabour the point but is level .5 all the foundation courses or just one or two etc? I'm not sure I understand how the level system and courses fall together. 

do you have the course, Sean?  it is equivalent to the strength chart 0.5 level, which is halfway through F1.

MT Nordic said:

do you have the course, Sean?  it is equivalent to the strength chart 0.5 level, which is halfway through F1.

Yup Duh!!?? *sigh* Classic should have looked first before opening my mouth. I read the course but obviously didn't catch how that chart related. Thx

1) Actually the first step is beginning the courses.  

2) The second step is attending a GB seminar.

3) Based on seminar performance, select individuals are occasionally invited to begin the GB certification process.

4) Once certification is achieved, some individuals may be selected to enter the GB Instructor development pipeline. 

5) GB Master Classes are specifically designed to increase the physical and professional proficiency of these actual & potential GB instructors.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

Coach Sommer said:

1) Actually the first step is beginning the courses.  

 

2) The second step is attending a GB seminar.

 

 

Gottcha,  I've started the course material, next is seminar, then impress coach lol That might be a long while (on both accounts  ) as I'm assuming one should have some proficiency in the movements ( perhaps completion of foundation one? ) to make the most out the event? Thank you again...