Coach was right...but I still need my "fix"

Not heeding coach's advice (and the advice of others), I've developed some tendinitis in both elbows over the past few weeks... 

I had been training F1 3x per week; H1 2x per week...

That's when I got "itchy."  This has happened over the last three cycles, during the first 2 blocks when I feel I'm not working hard enough...  I began adding movements, and before I knew it, this is what I had in addition to BtGB 5 days per week: 

2 days of olympic lifting

2 days of hill sprints

2 days of "easy strength" ladders of pullups, ab wheels, shoulder press

When I'm bored, I also do Pavel's SS program (swings and turkish get ups).  

I know, I know...It's obvious.  

However, I'm figuring out something about myself that needs addressing and maybe this can help others, too.  I feel really good doing "something" every day.  And, when I don't exercise, I feel anxious and moody.  Moreover, I have a hard time just exercising; I want to train. So, what do I do?  i know I'm not supposed to layer programs.  I know that, biologically, my body has only so much recuperative abilities.  

What's the best way to get my "fix" of daily movement without cutting into my gymnastics training, which is my priority? 

I thought that by "practicing" movements like pullups and cleans and shoulder press and kb swings, etc. I would be fine, since I would not be overly stressing my body...  I guess, as my elbows indicate, even extra practice is too much.  Coach has mentioned in his last two interviews the elbow tendinitis indicator of over training... 

How do you guys get your "fix" if you are an exercise junky without over training and screwing up the progressions?  

I'm still battling my everyday smash mentality that I developed while doing Crossfit...  

Suggestions?  Do I need a hobby? 

I usually do flexibility/mobility/stretching work when I feel "bored" and I want to train even if I've done what I'm supposed to do. It's not as cool as pullups or KB stuff, but because it's hard and painful this approach fulfill my thirst for that day!

Or you can find another hobby or use that time to study more about the things you like! This is what usually works for me!

Look into "Original Strength" for some more or less harmless exercise throughout the day. As I recall it is a relatively cheap book

Also search for Christian Thibaudeau's "neural charge" training. You have to be careful with it because it still loads the joints and tendons but it is described as "super growth and recovery strategy" and supposedly it can be done every day as an addition to normal training.

Look into an aerobic or skill-based activity to fill in the gaps. E.g running, swimming, martial arts, dancing, etc.

Try going cold turkey and do nothing but foundation for a month or two. You may find your attention directed towards more sane activities than a training addiction.

Now that the weather is getting better in the northern hemisphere (if that's where you are), take up an outdoor sport that will limit you due to it's technical difficulty and therefore not tax you physically at the beginning:

Things that come to mind: 

1. Flat water sprint kayaking or canoeing: The balance in those boats is so difficult you'll spend most of your time in the water

2. Kiteboarding, windsurfing, or sailing: Very technically demanding, not taxing at first for someone with average fitness, but pretty expensive to do.

3. Try to improve your swimming by learning the "total immersion" technique which focuses on gaining speed through increased efficiency rather than by pushing harder: https://totalimmersion.net/

There's something about doing outdoor activities that's much more enjoyable than spending one's day in a gym; try to get to the mountains, a forest, or on water. You'll have fun, feel better psychologically, and learn a new skill. You're spending all this time getting physically fit, you may as well put it to use by getting involved in fun activities.

Given your issues with overtraining however, I would definitely stay away from activities like climbing, which though technically demanding and awesome, can also be quite physically taxing even at the beginner level. I'd also stay away from BJJ as it can actually be *more* taxing at the beginning when you have no technique and can only rely on the grind.

Try taking a dance class.   The girls (or your girl!) will love you for it.      Not too taxing but very movement oriented.

Thanks all.  I'm assuming people are in a similar boat, especially coming from a CF background where one gets used to daily "beat downs."  I'm sure I have something going on psychologically where getting that "high" makes my brain feel so good...  I know it's something I have to deal with. I'm trying to keep the long term focus as my motivation over the short term gratification of a grueling workout. 

Jennifer said:

Try taking a dance class.   The girls (or your girl!) will love you for it.      Not too taxing but very movement oriented.

I think my wife would like this option a lot.  We took salsa a ways back, and she loved it...  Thanks for the suggestion!  

-MR said:

Now that the weather is getting better in the northern hemisphere (if that's where you are), take up an outdoor sport that will limit you due to it's technical difficulty and therefore not tax you physically at the beginning:

 

Things that come to mind: 

 

1. Flat water sprint kayaking or canoeing: The balance in those boats is so difficult you'll spend most of your time in the water

2. Kiteboarding, windsurfing, or sailing: Very technically demanding, not taxing at first for someone with average fitness, but pretty expensive to do.

3. Try to improve your swimming by learning the "total immersion" technique which focuses on gaining speed through increased efficiency rather than by pushing harder: https://totalimmersion.net/

 

There's something about doing outdoor activities that's much more enjoyable than spending one's day in a gym; try to get to the mountains, a forest, or on water. You'll have fun, feel better psychologically, and learn a new skill. You're spending all this time getting physically fit, you may as well put it to use by getting involved in fun activities.

 

Given your issues with overtraining however, I would definitely stay away from activities like climbing, which though technically demanding and awesome, can also be quite physically taxing even at the beginner level. I'd also stay away from BJJ as it can actually be *more* taxing at the beginning when you have no technique and can only rely on the grind.

Yup.  This is exactly what I want to get to--to develop fitness that will allow me to better enjoy outdoors activities...  I did some BJJ a while back and found the sessions to be too late at night and affected my sleep in too negative a way.  BUt, I do a lot of white water kayaking, which I should have mentioned earlier that is on top of everything I mentioned--haha!  I have been trying to weave in more weekly hikes, etc.  Will continue to do so... Thanks. 

mitko said:

Look into "Original Strength" for some more or less harmless exercise throughout the day. As I recall it is a relatively cheap book

 

Also search for Christian Thibaudeau's "neural charge" training. You have to be careful with it because it still loads the joints and tendons but it is described as "super growth and recovery strategy" and supposedly it can be done every day as an addition to normal training.

Yeah, this looks very similar to "Easy Strength" and Dan John's "Even Easier Strength" where you do some "punch card" work...sort of like hauling wood, toting water; daily work that builds a foundation...  I think this is the type of stuff that I run into trouble with--looking for daily movement that involves weights, instead of more natural daily movement.  

Thanks for the suggestions.  

Ravn said:

Try going cold turkey and do nothing but foundation for a month or two. You may find your attention directed towards more sane activities than a training addiction.

Exactly.  I think this will be my primary focus.  

Im same way. So i decided to master skipping rope and get lean while doing F and H. My sessions with the rope are up to 30 min.

That gives me my "fix" when not wanting to overtrain

RJS said:

Im same way. So i decided to master skipping rope and get lean while doing F and H. My sessions with the rope are up to 30 min.

That gives me my "fix" when not wanting to overtrain

Without jiu jitsu and mma I would do this. Love it!

Ya, i get such a high from the rope. For me its like a dance/ trance kind of state. After awhile there isnt even a rope anymore.

i like riding my bike or just doing a few reps of a different PE, doing that enough times puts you in a state of mind of patience to earn moving on after you've invested enough time to master either strength or mobility

I've got the same issue, although it's my subscapularis not elbow.

I'm going to work on stretching, trampoline, squats, and sprints.  Your sprints and squats should be fine for the elbow, right?  

And rehab. You've got rehab to do now, too, right?  (After you give them a rest.)

I get so much physical activity at work, 8-10hours a day stone masonry,  that I just need to do F/H work(+stuff I play around with) and rope jumping and I get my fix. I wish I had more time to have fun! You could always do yoga or zumba lol jk

So today, even with my elbow tendinitis, I felt like I needed to do more. (I definitely have a problem.) So after my F1 training, I did 10 all-out sprints each lasting about 15 seconds. I now feel awesome. I think the suggestions for doing aerobic based movement will be really helpful. And, keeping them very intense like sprinting for me gives me that fix that I was talking about. Moreover, I don't feel like I done anything that is detrimental to my gymnastics training or that will set me back.

Well, to be fair, recovery is not only bodypart specific, but also CNS recovery, which is going to help all other components heal and recovery.

That said, And however, im proud of your determination, its comendable, and your attitude is admirable. Keep Going

Can we add a poll and see how many people here have some tendonitis issues in specific body parts lol.

Put me down for some medial epicondylitis (pretty much gone) and now some more distal forearm flexor pain on ulnar side, especially when releasing tension/contraction on certain exercises/serving in tennis - although they are more than likely related, they seem to be separate issues and come on at different times.

Since you now have tendonopathy you can now focus your spare time on fixing that . There are plenty of rehab exercises you can now do as well as mobility. Once you have recovered from the tendonopathy work on correcting imbalances in your body. Most people have imbalances they have had for years that need plenty of work.

Also cardio is a good safe compliment to foundation.

I do feel for you Bombadil! When BtGB came out I got it immediately and due to plenty of enthusiasm and exuberance I ended up with lateral elbow tendinopathy. Ended up being out of the game for 9 months. Lesson learnt. These days I err on the side of caution. 

I do my Foundation work around noon on M, Th, but I usually do a small body weight circuit every morning.  Preceded by foam rolling and active mobility warm ups.  The circuit itself is very easy, usually two rounds of upper body pushing and pulling followed by two rounds of lower body/posterior chain work. Light weight/easy progressions,  no more than 21 reps per exercise.  I also go for a short run once a week, and usually a hike on Su.  Another thing I do for low intensity activity is Yoga, which I might do one to two times a week for about 15 minutes.

You're an exercise addict, plain and simple. You're like an alcoholic that thinks if you cut down to one drink a day, you'll be fine.  You won't. There's a whole section of this book http://www.amazon.com/Solving-Paleo-Equation-Nutrition-Exercise/dp/1936608278 devoted to discussing exercise addiction and what guidelines to use in your workouts to prevent you from continuing to damage yourself (your elbows are not the only thing suffering, your overall health is too).

The only way for you to really fix something like this, IMO, is cold turkey.  Take a month off from any "training".  Go for walks.  If it seems hard and doesn't feel right, that's fine.  You're breaking an addiction, it shouldn't feel "normal" or "desireable" to you.  A month of no training will not drastically do anything in the scheme of things, for better or worse.

Take it or leave it.  This is coming from a guy who has burned myself out doing (let's review):

• 5 sports teams in one summer as a teenager (2 baseball, 2 basketball, swim team)
• CrossFit (I co-founded the first CF in my state, so "been there, done that" was a long time ago)
• Olympic weightlifting
• Powerlifting
• Highland Games

Take the month off.  It's the only way the reset button is going to get pushed in your brain.

gymnastikals said:

You're an exercise addict, plain and simple. You're like an alcoholic that thinks if you cut down to one drink a day, you'll be fine.  You won't. There's a whole section of this book http://www.amazon.com/Solving-Paleo-Equation-Nutrition-Exercise/dp/1936608278 devoted to discussing exercise addiction and what guidelines to use in your workouts to prevent you from continuing to damage yourself (your elbows are not the only thing suffering, your overall health is too).

So just to be clear, you just compared daily exercise to daily drinking?

I feel compelled to say that there is teeny bit of difference, and with all the crap people are capable of, needing an exercise buzz is the least of our problems.

He was not refering to daily exercise like daily drinking, merely using the analogy of an alcoholic to get his point of addiction across.

I see this fairly frequently in soldiers - and I generally agree with gymnastikals. If the OP is in a position where he is asking this question, he is probably in a position where he just needs to reset. If you find yourself calling exercise "practice" and using quotation marks to try and down play it, then you have a problem.

I was in a similar situation once (going through it all side-by-side with Paleo), then took a week off all exercise. From that point, I started focusing on well periodised and thought out strength training and was amazed at how much better I felt and performed, even though I ended up doing less work. Now I am nearly 100% commited to F1/H1, it is nearly the only training I do except for what I cannot avoid in the army - and funnily enough, it again is working - despite spending less time in the week exercising.

Commit to something and rest hard. Then when you are execising, enjoy it more for this is your time! You will probably even find yourself working harder and getting more out of it, then recovering better in your downtime so you can push again next training session. Before you know it, you might be into a cycle of positive re-enforcement... going up, and up, and up...

Take it or leave it, but if you are asking that question on these forums I suspect you already know what you should be doing. You ask these questions because want someone to say 'nah keep going, what you are doing is perfect', to back you up, despite how you feel so the responsibility is off your shoulders.

 - Callum

I read this thread just after reading the transcript of this TED talk and thought that there was a connection and that it might be useful food for thought. Replace the concept of speed with amount, and keep the result of quality time.

http://www.ted.com/talks/carl_honore_praises_slowness?awesm=on.ted.com_srtT&utm_medium=on.ted.com-facebook-share&utm_source=l.facebook.com&utm_campaign=&utm_content=awesm-publisher#