Foundation Side Effects

After following Foundation for about 8 months on and off, Handstand for about 3, running competitively for 3 years  and not deadlifting for about 4 years (only did 65 lbs, making sure of good form, dropped off), I decided to test my deadlift out.

 

Started out at 135 lbs (61 kg) for 3 reps. Easy. 185 single. Stopped at a pretty easy 205 (93kg). Probably could have gone for 225 had I warmed up thoroughly, but I didn't want to push it too much. This is 1.5x my bodyweight.

 

nice!

Imagine what it will be when you finish F4...

They are nice side effects!

Just this week I have had the side effects of being able to do 100kg deadlifts and 28kg kettlebell swings in a metcon with minimal soreness the next day. In the past I would have been very sore from this.I don't regularly deadlift like I use to and have never used 28kg KB in a metcon before. I also strung together 10 chest to bar pull ups, which was previously 5.

Nice work!

 

I'm seeing the benefits too. My school gym got a squat rack and barbell - I decided to go heavy on deadlifting for the first time last wednesday, managed 145 kg single, and on Friday a 115 triple on ATG squats. On both I could have done more, especially if I actually had chalk for deadlifts. This is from 2 1/2 weeks of squatting and of course, from foundation 1. Looking forward to getting F2 this Christmas! Foundation is making us strong! Though I am going to start deadlifts and squats 2 - 3  times a week, GST will always come first.

A deadlift at 100 lbs for 15 reps was no problem before F1; I can't wait to test it now....

Why don't you do SLS progressions (as per your signature)? Do you think the strength foundation gains that are carrying over to your deadlift come from SL mostly?

im 65kg and i can deadlift 150kg :/ still not strong enough tho

Awarenesss said:

After following Foundation for about 8 months on and off, Handstand for about 3, running competitively for 3 years  and not deadlifting for about 4 years (only did 65 lbs, making sure of good form, dropped off), I decided to test my deadlift out.

 

Started out at 135 lbs (61 kg) for 3 reps. Easy. 185 single. Stopped at a pretty easy 205 (93kg). Probably could have gone for 225 had I warmed up thoroughly, but I didn't want to push it too much. This is 1.5x my bodyweight.

 

Not wanting to burst bubbles but put into perspective, I never deadlifted and tested 275 lbs, or 1.67 times bodyweight.  And that isn't particuarly impressive as 2.5 times bodyweight is considered a strong deadlift.

 

Not to belittle, but sInce you never tested your max in this lift before you started running (which typically involves strength training for competition or at least hills) how can you say what your deadlift "strength" is a side effect of?

 

I don't mean to be harsh, and I support your training goals,  however this logic seems to be rampant on this board.

It is like everyone is sipping the Kool-aid. Personally I find it a turn off and a bit creepy.  Though the training itself may be superior, if critical thinking is valued here it shouldn't be encouraged or indulged by the board management.

The training should stand on its own merits.

I agree. I think everyone can also agree that more strength can be also hinted at with better technique. if you focus more on form, you will also unlock more strength through torque, etc. so not all of the benefit is in raw strength, which there is some but it just feels like a lot, especially at first. 

 

my mediocre punching skills became a bit more noticeable from learning how to protract and depress on a heavy bag, because i don't think 5 sets of 6 reps of HBP PE 1 is what really made that happen though the joint health does have it's measurable merits and mediocre my manuals got a smidget better when I tucked my tail while maintaining the balance point. nothing major but cool to know i have a bit of control over that now that can get progressively better over time.

 

/2c

Frankincensed said:

I don't mean to be harsh, and I support your training goals,  however this logic seems to be rampant on this board.

It is like everyone is sipping the Kool-aid. Personally I find it a turn off and a bit creepy.  Though the training itself may be superior, if critical thinking is valued here it shouldn't be encouraged or indulged by the board management.

The training should stand on its own merits.

I think you're misunderstanding somewhat.  Sure, we don't have previous deadlift numbers to compare them to, but their current deadlift numbers are a result of Foundation training.  What else could you attribute them to?

 

This isn't science.  People posting their 1RM deadlift aren't trying to say "our system is the best for improving your deadlifts, and here's why" because it isn't the best system for improving deadlifts.  It's just people testing themselves. 

 

Edit: As for the training standing on it's own merits: remember that we're not training for deadlifts.  This is just playing around.  Coach trained actual gymnasts, who performed incredibly well on an international scale.  Does that count for the training standing on it's own merits?

 

I understand that you're having trouble deciding whether or not to purchase the program.  But really, you have to try it for yourself, not poke holes in other peoples accomplishments.  There's a money-back guarantee, so you've got nothing to lose.

 

There's a reason we're all drinking this kool-aid you know.  You might just like it yourself...

awareness is 16 (he mentioned it in another thread).  he's gonna get stronger, no matter what.  the last time he deadlifted, he was 12.

 

i don't think frankincensed meant anything negative or malicious with his post.  he's just trying to figure things out for himself.

Bipocni said:

I think you're misunderstanding somewhat.  Sure, we don't have previous deadlift numbers to compare them to, but their current deadlift numbers are a result of Foundation training.  What else could you attribute them to?

 

This isn't science.  People posting their 1RM deadlift aren't trying to say "our system is the best for improving your deadlifts, and here's why" because it isn't the best system for improving deadlifts.  It's just people testing themselves. 

 

Edit: As for the training standing on it's own merits: remember that we're not training for deadlifts.  This is just playing around.  Coach trained actual gymnasts, who performed incredibly well on an international scale.  Does that count for the training standing on it's own merits?

 

I understand that you're having trouble deciding whether or not to purchase the program.  But really, you have to try it for yourself, not poke holes in other peoples accomplishments.  There's a money-back guarantee, so you've got nothing to lose.

 

There's a reason we're all drinking this kool-aid you know.  You might just like it yourself...

The only thing I'm tyring to poke holes in is the faulty logic (association vs causation). Otherwise I think what is happening is fine and great, and I may start it myself (just starting to evaluate). I think I made it clear in my reply that it is nothing personal against the trainee or against the training. 

 

But I know it's not science and most of exercise science is weak anyway. Exercise involves dreams, hopes and ambitions too. It's not something that can be quantified precisely on an 8x12 sheet of paper. At the same time exercise programs are one of the biggest areas of consumer manipulation, and I would think that is something that the board would be aware of.  It may not be intended as manipulaiton, however the social marketing force is strong here. However I'll try to filter that out for now.

 

Sorry kid for laying this on your doorstep. You are doing great, and keep up the good work! And that is a good lift for your age especially!

 

F

Someone left a weighted barbell on the ground at the gym today so I decided to give dead lift a try. Never done it before in my life and am just starting my third month of consecutive foundation/ handstand work ( life got in the way last year so couldn't do it much) I also rock climb a bit but again only coming into my third month of that as well again thanks to life interfering the past year. Anyway at about 86 kilos I dead lifted my body weight for reps very easily ( happened to be 85 kilos ). So thanks to all these recent posts I've decided it would be fun to test my max lifts in certain exercises now and then compare them every few months . Would never have thought to do this if it hadn't been for posts like this so thanks I a, looking forward to this little experiment.

The absolute first time I deadlifted at a bodyweight of 160 I was picking up 225 and was never by any means strong. Nowadays I can easily chump double bodyweight, which for me is about 340 lbs. I attribute it to ropeclimb and side lever work (the arch body hold in particular). The single leg squat series helps somewhat. 

 

If you want to deadlift a lot, you have to deadlift a lot. Foundation is not a deadlifting program, but it will get you to a very respectable deadlift, as well as bench press and probably back squat, too. I prefer Foundation to traditional barbell training because it has a comprehensive integrated mobility program and it carries over to weight training well, but weight training does not carry over much to Foundation. My shoulders have always been terrible and my hips were tight, Foundation has fixed this. My lifts have also either stayed the same or gone up. That's enough to convince me. 

Frankincensed said:

Not wanting to burst bubbles but put into perspective, I never deadlifted and tested 275 lbs, or 1.67 times bodyweight. And that isn't particuarly impressive as 2.5 times bodyweight is considered a strong deadlift.

Not to belittle, but sInce you never tested your max in this lift before you started running (which typically involves strength training for competition or at least hills) how can you say what your deadlift "strength" is a side effect of?

I don't mean to be harsh, and I support your training goals, however this logic seems to be rampant on this board.

It is like everyone is sipping the Kool-aid. Personally I find it a turn off and a bit creepy. Though the training itself may be superior, if critical thinking is valued here it shouldn't be encouraged or indulged by the board management.

The training should stand on its own merits.

these are very good points! My thoughts were somewhat similar on this topic. I would also add that people who do not lift on regular basis should not be even trying their max as they do not posses proper technique and specific strength no matter how strong they think they are. Actually the stronger they are the more chances there are that something will go wrong. I definitely agree that it should not be encouraged and maybe even frown upon. Personally I can pull almost x3 my BW (500 lb) but I can't say that GB contributed to it at all. On the other hand it is complementing weightlifting very well and building it's own strength and skills which are awesome and ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL! GB does not need weightlifting at all to validate it's merits.