Do lower back stretches increase pike flexibility?

Hi everybody,

I have been doing gymnastics/calisthenics for about half a year now. I have been focussing on mobilty from the start. Despite the fact that I haven't really put any kind of pike stretches in my schedule I actually got quite a pike flexibility.

So my question is: Do stretches like shoulder bridge increase your pike flexibility?
 

Thanks in advance!

No.  Not really, no.

I would say not really, unless your lower back is very tight and you need the stretch just to get into a pike position with a flat back.

If you've been doing a lot of strict leg raises, you may have a reason for increase in pike flexibility though.

If your avatar is a picture of yourself, you have indeed a good active pike flexibility Paul3

Bipocni said:

No.  Not really, no.

Alright then, thanks!

Jon Douglas said:

I would say not really, unless your lower back is very tight and you need the stretch just to get into a pike position with a flat back.

If you've been doing a lot of strict leg raises, you may have a reason for increase in pike flexibility though.

Also, thanks for clearing that up!

FredInChina said:

If your avatar is a picture of yourself, you have indeed a good active pike flexibility Paul3

It is indeed a picture of me, thanks a lot

If your pike stretch is already quite good so that you're not rounding over just to get knees to nose then a good next step to deepen the pike is to work low lunges.  The point is to work on the mobility of the hip deep into the socket so that you're able to set the hip into the socket more effectively.

Low lunge you want to focus on setting the hip of the forward leg deep into the socket by pulling the torso up and out of the waist while pressing the front knee forward.  You should work to square the hips pulling the front leg hip back.  The back leg knee down is opposing and pulling the hip out.  Arms overhead and slight backbend help to increase the stretch.

The counter to a good low lunge is half split.

paul3 said:

(...) It is indeed a picture of me, thanks a lot

You are welcome, this is a very nice Vsit - welcome to the forum BTW

jl5555 said:

(...) The counter to a good low lunge is half split.

What does that mean?

paul3 said:

Hi everybody,

 

I have been doing gymnastics/calisthenics for about half a year now. I have been focussing on mobilty from the start. Despite the fact that I haven't really put any kind of pike stretches in my schedule I actually got quite a pike flexibility.

So my question is: Do stretches like shoulder bridge increase your pike flexibility?

 

Thanks in advance!

This is not an answer to your question. but it's a good thing to see such a person like you who is interested in mobility. You got a nice pike there. I think you should inspire people with your job. Nice V-sit man!

I'm kind of surprised none of our members caught this, but shoulder bridge isn't technically a lower back stretch.

Fred, half split would be the opposite of a lunge, front leg straight, and back leg bent, resting on knee.

Cole Dano said:

I'm kind of surprised none of our members caught this, but shoulder bridge isn't technically a lower back stretch.

 

Fred, half split would be the opposite of a lunge, front leg straight, and back leg bent, resting on knee.

I felt like the OP was asking about lower back extension exercises, rather than flexion, which is pretty much the opposite of a lower back stretch and would have nothing to do with pike flexibility.  To some extent, stretching the lower back could help with pike flexibility, just like stretching the calves would help.

Also, I've always considered bridge variations to be shoulder / upper back flexibility exercises.

Given how great the difference is between OP's pike and my own, it didn't feel right with me to try to tell him how it is.  He clearly knows something I don't...

You haven't seen anything yet. I spotted him with doing manna using one finger! His flexibility is disgustingly good. He feels nothing when his chest touches his knees...

jl5555 said:

If your pike stretch is already quite good so that you're not rounding over just to get knees to nose then a good next step to deepen the pike is to work low lunges.  The point is to work on the mobility of the hip deep into the socket so that you're able to set the hip into the socket more effectively.

 

Low lunge you want to focus on setting the hip of the forward leg deep into the socket by pulling the torso up and out of the waist while pressing the front knee forward.  You should work to square the hips pulling the front leg hip back.  The back leg knee down is opposing and pulling the hip out.  Arms overhead and slight backbend help to increase the stretch.

 

The counter to a good low lunge is half split.

I will add those in my schedule, thanks!

FredInChina said:

You are welcome, this is a very nice Vsit - welcome to the forum BTW

 

 

Thanks

Richard Burns said:

This is not an answer to your question. but it's a good thing to see such a person like you who is interested in mobility. You got a nice pike there. I think you should inspire people with your job. Nice V-sit man!

Thanks a lot!

Yaad Mohammad said:

You haven't seen anything yet. I spotted him with doing manna using one finger! His flexibility is disgustingly good. He feels nothing when his chest touches his knees...

Haha thanks, not sure whether my active flexibility is good enough already, though.

I'm told lower back stretch is detrimental to the spine.

I say do loads of hamstring stretches. That'll contribute to a better pike. Throw in a straddle stretch too.

Paul's progress at manna: https://www.gymnasticbodies.com/forum/gallery/image/327-v-sit/

Found it in his gallery

In my experience, most people will be better suited by focusing on releasing the neck extensors and calves when trying to improve pike mobility. Additionally, they should focus on building strength in the pike position. In my experience, focusing on just the hamstrings does not lead to optimal results.

Although, to me, it doesn't look like the OP needs much work on his pike...

raja said:

In my experience, most people will be better suited by focusing on releasing the neck extensors and calves when trying to improve pike mobility. Additionally, they should focus on building strength in the pike position. In my experience, focusing on just the hamstrings does not lead to optimal results.

 

Although, to me, it doesn't look like the OP needs much work on his pike...

Really? I've been stretching my hamstrings only and I'm not making much progress. So calves and neck extensors? Anymore muscle groups?

Yaad Mohammad said:

Really? I've been stretching my hamstrings only and I'm not making much progress. So calves and neck extensors? Anymore muscle groups?

Often, those groups will compensate for the hamstrings because they are along the same kinetic chain. Releasing them before performing pike mobility work will allow you to better stretch the hamstrings and achieve a better pike.

Once you gain the passive pike flexibility through movements like Jefferson Curls (my personal favorite) and Weighted Pike Stretches, it's just a matter of converting that ROM to active flexibility (aka mobility) through leg raises, kicks, etc. 

For the person with poor initial pike stretch opening the hamstring is an obvious first step.  But, it doesn't take long though to work through meaningful incremental increases in flexibility focusing solely on it.  

Once I found my forward pike stretch was no longer seemingly restricted by my hamstrings, glutes, etc. there were two areas I worked on that seemed to still be restricting me:

• extending the posterior cruciate ligament behind the knee
• working hip mobility to fully set the hip socket during the forward seated bend

To work the PCL I do two things:

• Cross one ankle over the extended leg just above the knee and bend forward.  Please exercise caution and feel/know your limits with this.  You WILL feel it behind your knee but the PCL will release over time.
• Whenever performing any type of pike/forward bend/straddle/etc stretch work to press the heels away and pull the toes towards you.  

Working the hip mobility is a bit more difficult to explain however.  If you've ever seen someone setting up on the floor preparing to forward fold, legs extended, they wiggle their butt back a bit.  Sometimes this is explained as moving certain muscles/butt cheeks "out of the way".  While that may be part of it I believe what is really going on there is that the hip sockets are being fully set to accept the maximum bend.  

It's a bit hard to explain but when I do it I feel like my pelvic girdle has rotated slightly forward and dropped down as the femur moved back, outwards and deeper into the hip.  The legs spread a bit between the thighs but the feet actually move towards each other.  

Sailor Venus said:

I'm told lower back stretch is detrimental to the spine.

 

If stretching the lower back was deterimental to the spine you would not see lower back stretches being done by yogis around the world. If anything stretching the lower back aids in decompressing the spine. Which in turn helps relieve lower back pain and help us maintain better standing/sitting posture.