Are Iron Cross Trainers Helpful?

Hey guys I'm really wanting to start working on my iron cross and I was wondering if any of the iron cross trainers on the internet are actually helpful.

 

As of now I'm able to:

-Good support 30-45 seconds fairly easily

- L Sit in support for about 15

- getting decent at back lever yet and can hold for a few seconds

 

I believe HS and planche ( with planche being optional, I think) is recommended by coach and I don't plan to try iron cross until I at least have a decent handstand on rings. However I thought maybe if I get one of those iron cross trainers that takes a lot of pressure off the elbow I could go ahead and work on HS and assisted iron crosses at the same time. Just not sure if it's a good idea or not and wanted someone with more knowledge to help me out. 

I would focus firstly on getting more time in lsit. When you are ready to work on cross that should feel like nothing. 30 sec is a good easy goal.

Handstand will take a long time to develop and I recommend you get a good RTO with using straps only a little for balance before considering cross. Note this would also include the press to get to handstand. If you have to jump and climb to handstand you have no business even trying cross.

Daniel Burnham said:

I would focus firstly on getting more time in lsit. When you are ready to work on cross that should feel like nothing. 30 sec is a good easy goal.

Handstand will take a long time to develop and I recommend you get a good RTO with using straps only a little for balance before considering cross. Note this would also include the press to get to handstand. If you have to jump and climb to handstand you have no business even trying cross.

No business trying an unassisted cross.

I believe it's okay to work assisted cross after having a solid 45-60 sec. RTO support, 30 sec. L sit with rings turned out, a solid 45 degree RTO hold, and full back lever.

Cross trainers are great. Get the ones that have 10 levels so you can progress slowly without putting too much stress on your elbows.

I have those "prerequisites" and I have no joint problems on the easiest setting. I still plan on taking my time to achieve a cross though.

They're not an essential training tool. They can be useful if you're on the cusp of learning a cross, but they won't be super helpful at your level. If you do get them, treat them as a toy that lets you play with the cross position. That's not to say you can't gain the strength for a cross using a cross-trainer, just that it's not the most efficient way to do so. 

 

Also, you can get essentially the same effect for free by just slipping your hands through the ring straps, as seen in this video at around 0:30:

 

Hands through the straps works too, but I find it extremely uncomfortable.

Zach Armijo said:

What in our training is comfortable?

resting on a soft surface 

MrPuppeh said:

resting on a soft surface 

You mean SL/PE1?

Daniel Burnham said:

I would focus firstly on getting more time in lsit. When you are ready to work on cross that should feel like nothing. 30 sec is a good easy goal.

Handstand will take a long time to develop and I recommend you get a good RTO with using straps only a little for balance before considering cross. Note this would also include the press to get to handstand. If you have to jump and climb to handstand you have no business even trying cross.

How long should I be able to hold a free standing handstand for before training a ring handstand? I know they're quite different in terms of strength requirement but I'd imagine the balance is fairly similar.

 

EDIT: When you say press handstand do you mean bent arm press?

Balance is much different actually. I would say you should have a 30 second on floor at least though.

Not a bent arm press. Having a straight arm press with rings turned out is a good prerequisite for the cross. It's not a direct progression but is something that will build strength and give you another skill in the interim.

Use the trainers as josh said "toys". I personally like using straps or a spot better but they are comfortable and fun.

Daniel Burnham said:

Balance is much different actually. I would say you should have a 30 second on floor at least though.

Not a bent arm press. Having a straight arm press with rings turned out is a good prerequisite for the cross. It's not a direct progression but is something that will build strength and give you another skill in the interim.

Use the trainers as josh said "toys". I personally like using straps or a spot better but they are comfortable and fun.

Alright thanks I'll have to work on getting a better free standing handstand first I guess. I can walk on my hands for 30 seconds with a straight body and if I arch I'm able to get aligned again. However, as soon as I quit moving I won't  be up for more than 5-10 seconds and even then fighting the temptation to move my hands to re -balance is nearly impossible.

 

Is it okay to lower my rings to nearly floor level and just jump to handstand at first until I get comfortable with that?

Yes it is fine to lower the rings.

rings trainer are good but the version that actually is available on the web has a big gap from a level to the next. i ask to my uncle to make a different version with 4 or 5 more level. i'm waiting for it...

Iron Cross trainers are definitely near the bottom of any reputable training accessory list. They would become useful once you were most of the way through F4, perhaps, but realistically not before then.

 

I own a pair, and while I do like them well enough the fact is that Iron Cross training is very physically demanding, and will require more energy than it seems for a long time. I am sure that, just like everything else, once you are fully prepared it is not much different than any other strength exercise, but for most of us even the assisted version is going to have a negative impact on our Foundation work overall.

 

One thing is for sure: the right time to consider these will probably be discussed in the Rings series. I would wait until then, if I were to consider my purchase of the trainers retrospectively. Right now they are collecting dust.

those are my personalized version.

 

 

 

alex87 said:

those are my personalized version.

 

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Those look very nice! I'm going to make a more comfortable pair for myself once I am ready for them in a few years.

i found that the version in my gym has too gap between one level to the following. there are 6 levels total.

Doing some calculations i found that 10 levels is better.

I got the ones from ringtraining and they actually have 11 levels

alex87 said:

(...) there are 6 levels total.

Doing some calculations i found that 10 levels is better.

 

Hummm........ how hard the math could be?

Ahhahha fortunately my father is a physic teacher at university!   

i thought that was easier make a project of a "toy" like that, personalized for your forearms length, forearms size etc.

I agree. I want to make one with an adjustable forearm pad as well.

 Hmm, right now mine have been sitting for a good 3 years. I've contemplated selling except for the fact they are hard to come by.

 

 Maybe I should have my dad send me then as I'm sure some people might find it a useful toy.

 

 Until you have a way more solid support, I wouldn't bother. You can also use bands as a spotter or rig up a rings dream machine.

 

 They are pretty useful for learning a backward roll in. That's how I got mine since I lacked a spotter.

Blairbob said:

Hmm, right now mine have been sitting for a good 3 years. I've contemplated selling except for the fact they are hard to come by.

 

 Maybe I should have my dad send me then as I'm sure some people might find it a useful toy.

 

 Until you have a way more solid support, I wouldn't bother. You can also use bands as a spotter or rig up a rings dream machine.

 

 They are pretty useful for learning a backward roll in. That's how I got mine since I lacked a spotter.

Second the backwards roll.

Btw. I've found (http://gimnastycy.pl/forum/watek-iron-cross) this pic, smart concept for cross trainers, just a mini rope ladder, definitely easy to transport. Guy who posted pic (of himself) is quite positive about them.

 

[attachment=835:drabinka.jpg]

it's pretty cool to see your own thread linked on GB forum

Inspired by Janssen&Fritsen Cross-position aid I decided to make one for myself.

Materials cost about $10-$12 (about 15 times cheaper than J&F).

It's very good for full ROM cross pullouts and static holds but also for maltese and inverted IC but not for backward rolls. I find it better than assisted cross holds/pullouts because of constant amount of strength needed in every set and rep.

You can see it in action here.