Training and alcohol ?

     With st. patricks  day  here I was looking to get some thoughts on how alcohol effects your body when your training? Im doing F1 and H1  not trying to get in the olympics but want to do the best i can .

      Im not a crazy alcoholic but i do enjoy to have a beer with dinner and on occasion a few more  my family runs a bar so its hard to avoid ! I have read some articles  that say a couple drinks can wipe out all of the gains  you could of made. 

      I just want to kind of do a poll on what the average guy on here might drink a day or week. Since  starting F1 I have had about  5 beers per week . Down from about 15  before I  started to take this more serious .

      Some links about  alcohol 

http://www.charlespoliquin.com/Blog/tabid/130/EntryId/1651/Tip-468-Avoid-Alcohol-After-Training-Don-t-Erase-Your-Hard-Work.aspx

http://scoobysworkshop.com/alcohol/

It's usually not the booze but the junk you eat along with it.

The studies that show negation of MPS usually involve large amounts, like a full bottle wine.

I've known quite a few very high level athletes to indulge in binge drinking (over 3 drinks) pretty regularly and still be able to perform well in their sport. I've known others that cut alcohol completely out because they felt it interfered with their sport. Everyone is different.

Myself I have 1-2 drinks of beer or a glass of wine 1-3 times per week. I haven't seen any significant changes during the weeks when I don't drink anything.

oh and btw the reason I stay under 1 drink normally is because I do not like anything that alters my mood/way of thinking not because I feel like it would significantly hamper me in my goals.

I'm tee-total, since I was 16 the most frequently I have drunk would be a glass of wine every 2 weeks.

I am very strongly effected by what I consume though, I am also don't drink caffeine.

Zach Armijo said:

(...) a good bud (...)

Did you mean Budweiser?

There is no such thing as a "good" Budweiser!

Alcohol is metabolised in the liver so its the first organ to suffer through alcohol abuse and of course, alcohol has a detrimental affect on the bodies performance. Alcohol has a diuretic effect which impairs the bodies fluid balance so dehydration is likely. Also, alcohol impairs the bodies ability to regulate its temperature so the likelihood of heat stroke or hyperthermia is increased. So what else does alcohol do to the body? alters perception, slows reaction time, reduces strength power and endurance, hinders accuracy, balance, hand eye coordination plus body coordination. Yeah, not good for optimal athletic performance.

A final side effect of alcohol abuse is that it deprives people of sound judgment and therefore compromises safety in sport. Fatalities in sport involve alcohol and drug abuse.

Take home message? Moderation and certainly NOT before exercise/sport. If after exercise, drink plenty of water before consuming alcohol.

In the late 1970's and even early 80's, many National Level Rugby League players in Australia would drink a beer or two during half time of the game!

"Binge" drinking is anything over 3 drinks?????       

AlexX said:

I've known quite a few very high level athletes to indulge in binge drinking (over 3 drinks) .....

Binge drinking means different things to different people. One man or woman's binge is another's normality hence why binge drinking has never been defined scientifically - it's too difficult.

During my alcoholism I found the biggest problem related to training was the effect on my central and peripheral nervous system.

Alcohol depleted my myelin sheaths and gave me peripheral neuropathy due to the loss of B vitamins.  When I was detoxing I was given 2x vitamin B12 injections every day in my ass along with 3 x high strength Thiamin (B1) taken daily.  After a week they had tapered me off librium (chlordiazepoxide) and I was no longer at risk of Delerium Tremens.

I was eating at a big caloric deficit as I had no appetite.  As part of rehabilitation I was allowed to go to the gym supervised by an instructor.  I hit 125kg (275lbs) for three reps.  While I was still drinking I still went to the gym twice a week before I started morning drinkin and could only do 2-3 sets of 5 @ 105kg.  I can only assume I had a massive B vitamin deficiency that was limiting my central nervous system output.

This was with life threateningly excessive consumption and over a year however so I am not sure if this effect is be apparent at all in the moderate user.  I personally think it must have some effect at any level of consumption... but take that with a grain of salt - I despise alcohol and consume zero for what it did to my life and fear of doing it again.

 I would be interested to know if B vitamin supplementation would help the non drinker at all too.

After having indulged a bit too much I find the biggest factors that effect performance are lack of sleep and dehydration. Ive also noticed a temporary drop in strength but thats only for a day or so.

oh and if Ive been training the previous day I find that Im usually a bit stiff and havent fully recovered.

David, it's good to hear your off the grog mate, well done.

I would strongly suspect those driven to alcohol abuse may have issues or problems relating to work, family, school, financial or any of the myriad challenges that life throws at us.

Peter Sbirakos said:

(...) I would strongly suspect those driven to alcohol abuse may have issues or problems relating to work, family, school, financial or any of the myriad challenges that life throws at us.

Just like all of us

there is a post on this section where Joshua ( I think was Slizz at that time) did a very interesting intervention about how much alchool can be assumed, and how a moderated assumptions can have a great effect of the body. 

https://www.gymnasticbodies.com/forum/topic/6104-what-is-your-favorite-beer/page-2?hl=%2Balcohol+%2Bounce#entry59975

I've heard several occasions where a small buzz allowed athletes to get new PRs in their lifts. I assume that the lowering of inhibition can also allow the body to forget what is it's max. 

RandomHavoc said:

I've heard several occasions where a small buzz allowed athletes to get new PRs in their lifts. I assume that the lowering of inhibition can also allow the body to forget what is it's max. 

I think there might be something to that. Then again, I often find that generally when I'm expecting a terrible performance due to no sleep, stress etc I tend to hit new (strictly low-rep) PRs, so perhaps there's something more to the sense of disinhibition/resignation/"I'm just going to go hard and get this shame over with already" than the cause per se. Not something to rely on long term though.

Alcohol abuse is a huge issue in a lot of Australia, WA (where I'm from) in particular. I sort of find that suprising when you see the 30-40 year old habitual drinkers who look 10-20 years older than that and have real, real trouble psychologically going a week or socialising much at all without alcohol. When you can see the 'after' in front of you, it gets discouraging to me real quickly...

 I grew up in a country town where teen drinking is very big, and even going home now I find I don't fit in much if I'm not keeping up with my schoolmates at the pub. I've got nothing against how they live their lives, but something's sort of sad knowing they're at the same pub as when we were 18... doing the same thing every weekend... and that the same 40-50yo guys are filling up the pub that I saw when I was there at 18... and they've been doing that several times a week since THEY were 18... And yeah, where I'm from, we wouldn't call a bottle of wine 'a huge amount.' At 18 I would regularly show up to parties with a bottle of vodka and a shot glass, and I certainly wasn't alone. It's still difficult when I visit my parents and friends not to sometimes get caught up in the mentality of heading out with the specific intention to get trashed, and that = good time. It's frightening when you look at that in the cold light of day.

I have long since learnt my lessons and have been the designated driver for quite a few years now, but then again I'm lucky enough to travel a lot and have had the chance to get some perspective on the world. To a lot of my friends back home, that mining/farming town of 25k people with hundreds of k's of nothing in every direction around it might as well be the whole world, because they never got that wider view.

I've gotten off topic and this whole post is pretty disjointed. So I'll cut it off there. I will be splitting a bottle of red with a friend or two tonight, don't doubt that, but I'll be buying it on quality over quantity

Edit;

Theres a whole nother section on martial arts and qigong that I could add to the above, but I'll limit it to saying it's not polite to your partners to be sweating tequila when you're rolling BJJ.

 I would be interested to know if B vitamin supplementation would help the non drinker at all too.

Around here there is a strong push to inject all athletes with B complex vitamins, often before addressing basic nutrition (ARG!).  I assume that most of the athletes I work with directly are non-drinkers based on age and family influence.  As far as I can tell B vitamins might have a little to do with recovery from flexibility sessions and avoiding stress induced colds.  But nothing else is observable, other than big swollen lumps on people's posteriors from allergic reactions/injections in the  wrong spot.

I've heard several occasions where a small buzz allowed athletes to get new PRs in their lifts. I assume that the lowering of inhibition can also allow the body to forget what is it's max.

That sounds like a case where a sports psychologist might do some good.

      I feel a little better about myself now. I was beating myself up  for having a couple beers . I guess as long  as i keep it to just one- two light beers  or one Pliny the Elder  one of them is like two or three !

Don't drink alcohol right before bed and you should be okay. 

Charm said:

I think there might be something to that. Then again, I often find that generally when I'm expecting a terrible performance due to no sleep, stress etc I tend to hit new (strictly low-rep) PRs, so perhaps there's something more to the sense of disinhibition/resignation/"I'm just going to go hard and get this shame over with already" than the cause per se. Not something to rely on long term though.

 

 

Alcohol abuse is a huge issue in a lot of Australia, WA (where I'm from) in particular. I sort of find that suprising when you see the 30-40 year old habitual drinkers who look 10-20 years older than that and have real, real trouble psychologically going a week or socialising much at all without alcohol. When you can see the 'after' in front of you, it gets discouraging to me real quickly...

 

 I grew up in a country town where teen drinking is very big, and even going home now I find I don't fit in much if I'm not keeping up with my schoolmates at the pub. I've got nothing against how they live their lives, but something's sort of sad knowing they're at the same pub as when we were 18... doing the same thing every weekend... and that the same 40-50yo guys are filling up the pub that I saw when I was there at 18... and they've been doing that several times a week since THEY were 18... And yeah, where I'm from, we wouldn't call a bottle of wine 'a huge amount.' At 18 I would regularly show up to parties with a bottle of vodka and a shot glass, and I certainly wasn't alone. It's still difficult when I visit my parents and friends not to sometimes get caught up in the mentality of heading out with the specific intention to get trashed, and that = good time. It's frightening when you look at that in the cold light of day.

 

I have long since learnt my lessons and have been the designated driver for quite a few years now, but then again I'm lucky enough to travel a lot and have had the chance to get some perspective on the world. To a lot of my friends back home, that mining/farming town of 25k people with hundreds of k's of nothing in every direction around it might as well be the whole world, because they never got that wider view.

 

I've gotten off topic and this whole post is pretty disjointed. So I'll cut it off there. I will be splitting a bottle of red with a friend or two tonight, don't doubt that, but I'll be buying it on quality over quantity

 

 

Edit;

Theres a whole nother section on martial arts and qigong that I could add to the above, but I'll limit it to saying it's not polite to your partners to be sweating tequila when you're rolling BJJ.

This^  From the age of 13 I drank like this and so did my friends and most people in my school.  We drank and drank and took drugs and that is what I thought having a good time WAS.  A "quiet one" consisted of a crate of Stella and a bottle of vodka between four of us.  It never turned out to be a good time.  Just completely disastrous ending in violence most nights only to do it again next weekend.

I completely relate to what you said.  I never go back to my home town or speak to any of my friends because they are still doing this.  The way alcohol is marketed in the UK in clubs drives the madness and is somewhat responsible IMO.

I used to think I was boring when I made the decision to go tee-total but binge drinking is so ingrained in me now that moderate drinking is just like teasing my alcohol-damaged mid brain setting off a craving that I don't trust myself to resist.  I have found that although I don't believe in a lot of the stuff in Alcoholics Anonymous and I hate giving myself the derogatory, incriminating label of an addict/alcoholic, I still find the need to go to NA, CA and AA meetings in order to meet people in the UK that don't drink and take drugs like I used to (even most of the people in my local gym binge drink at the weekend).  It's a very sad state for the nations youth to be in I think.

Was going to limit my post to just my observations on alcohol + training, but I opened my mouth and there was a bit more in there than I thought

To offer a positive perspective: where I grew up, people in the community rarely drank, except a reasonable amount with food or at social gatherings. When I was older, my parents began letting me occasionally have a beer or glass of wine with dinner. Because I was introduced to alcohol as something to enjoy in moderation, I very rarely feel the desire to get drunk. On the occasions when I do drink, it's generally because I found something that pairs well with the food I'm eating, and I usually have only one. 

I guess there is nothing much more to be said on the matter. I live in Newcastle-upon-Tyne, which, in the U.K., is known for it's bars and binge drinking culture.

And we Brits can drink!

It's hard to always say no when eeryone else is drinking. Alot of my friends have been going away to study around Europe for a few months, which means there has been lots and lots of parties in the past 2 weeks. Many of which I have attended and gotten quite drunk. The biggest problem with drinking for me; apart from the obvious long term damage; is the way it throws my nutrition and training out of schedule. If I drink, I miss workouts and meals, either because I finish work and go out early or I'm hungover the next day and too tired when it's time to workout. THAT is what causes the biggest problem to me. Now I have to go back a week or so in my F1 work.

Of course I'm still young (22), so I may be able to get away with it better, but even I can see it having a negative effect on my workouts without it building up over the years.

Chris.

My social life has taken a hit since I stopped drinking and partying. I still see my friends, but rarely. We just have different ways of having fun now, and they respect that.

Klaudius Petrulis said:

My social life has taken a hit since I stopped drinking and partying. I still see my friends, but rarely. We just have different ways of having fun now, and they respect that.

I'll admit I became a recluse when I first stopped but now I have loads of friends that don't drink and we still go out and have a good time.  It's just a good time sans waking up in a police cell lol.  If I could drink successfully without it ruining my life however, I would undoubtably be drinking heavily on a regular basis and my training would no doubt suffer.  I get fat and weak when I drink so in a way I am glad I can't touch the stuff at all.

Not to mention that alcohol inhibits recovery. If it wasn't for that, and the morning after zonkiness, I'd probably indulge more.

Nothing cited here but an interesting read http://www.streetdirectory.com/travel_guide/41581/health/alcohol_and_muscles.html