Help with Chin/Pull Ups (Beginner)

[Airness]

Hey guys,

I've recently started to do pull/chin ups but I am really bad at them. I am also in the process of trying to lower my body fat. I can probably at best do 3 dead hang pull ups and maybe 4-5 dead hang chin ups. Roughly around there and could be fewer too but somewhere around there.

Charles Poliquin said in his article to start performing progressions like this:

1. The first progression starts with the athlete hanging from the chin-up bar. The knees should be bent. Then a spotter should support the athlete at the ankles during the ascent. If extra assistance is required during this phase, the athlete can extend the legs against the spotter's base of support. Once able to perform 12 repetitions in this style with minimal assistance, the athlete is ready to move on to the next progression.

2. Repeat #1 with one legged assistance and assistance at the waist until 12 reps can be performed without and assistance.

If anyone can give me some advice as to how I can get my pull/chin up number up to 20 reps per set, it would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

[Razz]

It is pretty simple, 'grease the grove' with chinups. Basically you do 2-3 chinups ( no squeezing out reps) 10-30 times during the day. Do this for 2-3 weeks then take a break, test your new max and repeat the process with 50-75% of your new max. The important thing is that you shouldn't be going 100% 10-30 times during the day because you'll have to recover and rest, where if you do 50% of your max reps you can do it all day long for a long time with 1 or 2 rest days each week if needed.

At least thats one way to do it

[Airness]

I will try that on my door because I don't have a chin up bar in my house. I bought a doorway pull up bar but then I can't use it in my house because the door doesn't have a doorframe that allows me to use the doorway pull up bar.

Are there any other ways which requires like 4-5 training days a week in which I can increase my pull ups just as effectively? Thanks!

For example, do you think performing chin ups/pull ups for 10 sets x 1, for Monday (for example) and then trying to perform 10 sets x 2 on Wednesday, and then 10x3 the next time and so on, till I can get to 10x6-10 is a good option?

[Joakim Andersson]

I would go with Razz's example. It is what I do for one arm chin ups now, and without performing a single exhausting OAC-workout, I've developed very much strength for the movement in the last months.

If I were you - working on regular chins and pullups - I would mix in some tuck front levers and one arm hangs (start with just a few seconds and evolve). Variation might keep you from getting bored. Correct me if I'm giving bad advice here, but using a variation of movements on the pullup bar has strengthened my back much more than when I did just normal chins.

[Guest cccp21]

Hey guys,

I've recently started to do pull/chin ups but I am really bad at them. I am also in the process of trying to lower my body fat. I can probably at best do 3 dead hang pull ups and maybe 4-5 dead hang chin ups. Roughly around there and could be fewer too but somewhere around there.

Charles Poliquin said in his article to start performing progressions like this:

1. The first progression starts with the athlete hanging from the chin-up bar. The knees should be bent. Then a spotter should support the athlete at the ankles during the ascent. If extra assistance is required during this phase, the athlete can extend the legs against the spotter's base of support. Once able to perform 12 repetitions in this style with minimal assistance, the athlete is ready to move on to the next progression.

2. Repeat #1 with one legged assistance and assistance at the waist until 12 reps can be performed without and assistance.

If anyone can give me some advice as to how I can get my pull/chin up number up to 20 reps per set, it would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

*********** Have you ever considered assisting the weak or imbalanced muscle groups in the chins/pulls. Grip,forearms and scapula specialization might help quite a bit.

Brandon

[Blairbob]

Roger Recon pullup program is one and there is another out there, the Armstrong pullup program.

[Joshua Naterman]

What razz is suggesting works quite well. Brandon's advice on balanced muscle development is also good, just for your safety and future progress make sure that opposing muscle groups are being developed equally.

I would suggest doing the less intense program that Razz suggested for two or 3 weeks, take two or three days' rest, then do a real hard workout where you do two sets of each grip, maybe 80% of your max. Don't rest much between sets, 1 minute at the most. If you start dropping down to less reps, that's fine. Just make up the reps. So, if you could do 5 good pullups, each set should be 4 pullups on your hard workout. If you do 2, then take a few breaths, do 1 pullup, take a few breaths, do the last pullup, and take a bit of a longer break, but not more than 2 minutes. That will kick your butt pretty good, but you should notice that each time you do that, once every other week or so, that you are doing better. Make sure that you are using different grips, cycle through them as you do your pullup sets. Each set should be a different grip. When you can get through the whole thing with 1 minute or less breaks, doing 4 reps each set, you're ready to start trying 5 or 6 reps per set. You'll notice that your max will go up pretty quick. Before you know it, you'll be doing this with sets of 8-10 pull-ups and 30 second rests. Probably less than a year, maybe as little as 6 months if you're consistent and have a gift for recovery.

Grips are as follows:

Close (as close to thumb on thumb as possible), regular(shoulder width), wide(shoulder and a half to double shoulder width), regular curl-up grip, close curl-up grip, and palms facing each other. Palms facing each other means that you have both hands on the bar, standing so that if the bar was eye level you'd be able to look through it if it were hollow. Each pull-up your head goes to a different side of the bar. You pull up to touch your shoulder to the bottom of the bar. I'm going to call this grip Mountain Climber.

Recap:

For 2-3 weeks do 40-50% of your max randomly throughout the day, at least 10 times. If you need a rest day take it, but don't take two rest days in a row. Ideally you want two rest days in the week, non-consecutive. Each set with a different grip. Just cycle through them.

After the 2-3 weeks is up, take a few days rest. 3 is plenty. Do a real workout, 2 rounds of each grip at 80% of your good form max. If that doesn't give you a nice round number, but instead something like 3.5, do 3. I'd suggest doing regular, close, wide, close curl-up, mountain climber(right hand forward), regular curl-up in that order. For the second round, do left hand forward for the mountain climber pull-ups.

Then start the cycle over.

[Airness]

I started the grease the groove thing today and have done 11 reps in 4 hours or so but 65% of the reps are weighted with 5kg. I'm doing them on my door lol, hope it doesn't break haha.

[mobrep]

*********** Have you ever considered assisting the weak or imbalanced muscle groups in the chins/pulls. Grip,forearms and scapula specialization might help quite a bit.

Brandon

Brandon, thanks for mentioning the scapula. It was that and re-reading Coach's explanation of the front lever flat tuck when it clicked. (pulling the shoulders away from the hands = pinching the shoulder blades) The first few sets doing it this way were a little awkward, then it began to feel more natural. Pinching the shoulder blades also helps on those last few inches during a pullup, which is where my main issue's were.

[quad6]

GTG is great! the only thing that worked for me.

However, I noticed when I switched back to just doing chins a couple of times per week, my progress stopped and actually seemed to go backwards.

So now I'm doing the GTG thing again!

I guess it's just a matter of getting out of the bodybuilding mindset where you hammer a move/muscle a few times a week and into the mindset of "practicing". More frequency, adequate intensity but never to failure

[Joshua Naterman]

It CAN be good If it works, use it Glad to hear of your success!

[Jason Stein]

Friend,

Grease the Groove can provide great benefits. If you eventually look for more structure, you might also follow Pavel's Fighter Pull-up Plan. I followed this rep scheme and set a new PR of max strict pull-up numbers.

If you scroll down among the plans, he outlines a plan for someone with 3 as a max pull-up.

http://www.kbnj.com/FighterPullupByPavel.htm

A word of advice: the volume will creep up on you and your elbow joints, so definitely pay attention to rest and recovery, especially if you're also training the levers.

best,

jason

[James Portillo]

I know this is an extremely old thread, but I had a question regarding the fighter pull up program as my pulling strength is horrid (as discovered in yesterday's WOD).

How would I best incorporate the program into the WOD, especially since it's 5 days on and 1 day off? As part of the warm-up after all my pre/rehab and FSPs, right before the day's WOD? Or directly after it? Thanks in advance to anyone that answers.

[Blairbob]

I would say before it and scaling back the WOD accordingly. AKA not doing a boatload of pull work. As in, too much.

[Coach Sommer]

I had a question regarding the fighter pull up program as my pulling strength is horrid (as discovered in yesterday's WOD) ... How would I best incorporate the program into the WOD, especially since it's 5 days on and 1 day off ...

My recommendation is - don't.

Simply scale your pulling work as needed during the WODs; dropping all the way down to static chin holds over the bar if necessary.

Yours in Fitness,

Coach Sommer

[Joshua Naterman]

I agree with Coach for the most part. For one thing, I do not believe that program is the best way to develop pull ups. I have outlined a program that is more effective, and that should only be done 1-2x per week when working the WODs. If for some reason it is absolutely VITAL that you develop your pulling strength quickly, you should basically replace the horizontal portions of pull WODs with bar hangs and SLOW, SLOW negatives for one workout and the next should really be bar hangs and (in my opinion) the program I have outlined elsewhere. It will not perfectly fit into the WODs but can be adapted.

You will also make very good progress if you scale the pull WODs back to just doing slow (8-10s is the goal, but if you start out with 3-4s that is ok) negatives with FULL ROM. Sounds stupid but it works. Just do 4-5 reps per set, as prescribed in the WOD. You can do an explosive pull up to the top if you want to and are able to in order to get bat to the contracted position again, but it is perfectly ok to jump back up or use a stool. I believe you should have similar rates of success with each approach, but working the negatives during a scaled WOD is going to be a lot less disruptive and simpler to program in my opinion. When you are able to do the 8-10s negatives for the whole WOD I believe you will find that the actual pull ups are a breeze. I WOULD absolutely switch between chin ups and regular grip pull ups at first, and add in the other variations and grips as you get stronger.

If you notice that a week has no pulling WODs I would do this at least on the Friday WOD. If you know the WOD schedule you will be able to program this intentionally, but I don't think you need to worry about that. If you happen to go a whole week without doing pull ups, do them on the last day of the week pretty much just as you would on a normal pull WOD day UNLESS you feel like you need the rest. Then maybe just do 1 set.

I personally think that this last option is going to be the best for most people here, as it will give better muscular development and a fairly comparable rate of progress as compared to the first option. It may actually be better for some.