Overcoming Gravity vs. BtGB

[William Clarke]

My question is: how does Overcoming Gravity by Steven Low compare to BtGB (F1, H1, etc)?

The reason I ask is because I brought Overcoming Gravity awhile ago, and liked it, but I have not seen a ton of success stories from people using it (unlike BtGB). I will not be able to afford F1 or H1 until this school semester is over, so I was wondering if following OG would be fine... and for anyone who has both F1 and OG, how similar is F1 to OG? Because if they are very similar, I will probably not buy F1, just H1.

[Chris Aldersley]

OG is more like a poor man's (idiomatically speaking) BtGB, which itself is an out of date Foundation/Handstand program. Steven Low learnt a lot of what he knows from Coach Sommer, but has far less experience in developing athletes. I think there's some good stuff on the physiology of training, but you don't really need that and you can find other resources that are dedicated to that subject. You can probably get most of the information free here on the forums, or alternatively by getting BtGB. - These options will give you loads of information/exercises that will require you to develop your own training regime.

 

Foundation and Handstand series are different (and far superior). It's Coach's knowledge and experience spoon fed to you into an organised routine telling you what to do, when to do it and when to move on. Simple, but challenging and effective.

[Bill Köhntopp]

To me OC is a really informative book, equal where you start. Lots of illustrations, understandable written, mobility, rehab, everything is in it. But i think you need to know how to make a programm, its also in there, but not so explicit to your status.

BTGB was ok, but i think you find more informations about the whole thing in OC. Both are not really specific for helping making a schedule, but for this you find F1 and H1 here. But with experience you can use both books as really good help

 

Both has it's reason to be.

[William Clarke]

Thanks for the replies! I'm finding a lot of people say coach Sommers has a ton more experience, and has really good program to follow. I can design a decent lifting program, but obviously I don't know much about Gymnastic Strength Training™. I think I'll do a little more research and consider buying F1 and H1 on winter break.

[Alessandro Mainente]

To be understood you need to read BtGB at least 3-4 times and attend at least one seminar. The guideline of the book is awesome, but it needs a little bit of knowledge to be very useful.

[Joshua Slocum]

BtGB is not the same as F1/H1. BtGB is a book that was published several years ago, where F1/H1 are courses that were released this past winter. All three are authored by Coach Sommer. 

 

Overcoming Gravity (and BtGB) is essentially a reference book: it contains a lot of exercises, and a lot of information on training in general (how to create a program, how to deal with injuries, etc). It is a good DIY reference if you want to create your own training program. (They are both, sadly, quite lacking in the mobility department compared to Foundation). 

 

In contrast, the Foundation series is a training program. It comes with detailed progressions and day-to-day programming. It might take an hour or so to wrap your head around how everything works, but once you've figured it out, it follows the same pattern all the way through. Foundation also comes with mobility work integrated into the programming, to help you develop strong joints that move freely and are resistant to injury. Foundation's progressions are much more detailed than OG's (compare OG's 5 elements leading up to a front-lever with Foundation's ~24). [Also note that F1 is the first part of four.]

 

My recommendation would be to do what you can with OG for now, but buy F1 when you can afford it. 

[Keilani Gutierrez]

as someone who bought the book when I started training, i'll have to say I learnt quite a lot hanging around here and then getting the F series. 

 

I think it's been said before that the integrated mobility from Liquid steel into the series is what has made F1 so incredible to everyone, aside from the beginning strength work re-enforcing body shapes and muscular endurance. I remember my mobility sessions during my previous workouts were seriously lacking but i'd honestly chalk that upto my own inexperience with programming mobility and strength, rather than the book being a bust. 

 

it's good to use as reference though, just not gonna be an everyday thing

[Marios Roussos]

I used to hang out on Tyler Hass' ring forum (ringtraining.com) back when Steven ("braindx" at that time) had a log documenting his experiments with rings and bodyweight training.

 

From what I recall, he had done some form of gymnastics when he was young, then quit, then joined Gymkana when he was in undergrad after deciding to get back into gymnastics. I remember his early experiments with rings as being a lot of trial and error. He was a smart kid who was interested in exercise physiology, so he was attempting to adapt some book knowledge into his own training, but that was the extent of his experience at that time (2006ish). He didn't really seem to have a high-level mentor to help him with his training ideas. That being said, he should be commended for following through with his passion and actually writing a book that people seem to enjoy. Not many people would have taken it that far.

 

I mention this because I think there's a world of difference between getting advice from someone who develops a program or approach that should theoretically work based on book-knowledge, and getting advice from a coach that has been in practice for years and has had the opportunity to hone his craft by experimenting with what works and doesn't work.

 

Even Coach's first attempt had problems, and it's amazing to see the changes he's adapted from BTGB to the F and H series in order to improve his approach with adult enthusiasts. I personally can't wait for the movement course to be released as it seems that it will complete the beginner package with its dynamic/explosive elements. My hope is that by the time it's released, I'll have a year of F and H under my belt and will be able to add M1 to my routine without it affecting my recovery.

 

My recommendation therefore is to at least get F1 and get started early before all the other programs (M, R, Hungarian) get released and you start kicking yourself for not being ready for them. If you really can't afford F1 for a while, I suggest looking-up "Prerequisites" on old threads. I always ignored the prereqs as "too basic" because I could already hold a tuck planche for 60s and was close to a full lever, but I now regret my hubris. I think that people who took the time to master the prereqs have progressed through F1 a lot faster as they were much better prepared.

 

Hope this helps.

 

M

[William Clarke]

Wow! Thank you for all the replys. I was not excepting the forum to be so active!

From what it sounds like, I should get F1 and H1. I'll use my OG book more as a reference book once I have enough money to buy F1 and H1.

I looked into the prerequisites thread. Looks pretty good. I think I'll work on those instead of my tuck levers for a while. I'll still work on my lifting: squats overhead press and dead lift.

How does this sound for a plan until I can afford F1 and H1?

Warmup (include RTO support holds and German hangs)

Tuesday:

Squat 3x8-12

Barbell press 3x5-8

Deadlift 1x5

Inverted rows 3x5-8 (false grip to help muscle up?)

Thursday:

Squat 3x5

R Dips 3x5-8

Romainian dead lift 3x8-12

R Pull ups 3x5-8 (false grip?)

Saturday: (gym is closed, I but I have a weighted vest+rings+homemade parallel bars)

L-sit 3x(work up to 60s, then do it on rings or straddle...?)

Hang L-sit 3x(work up to 60s)

Pike or box press 3x5-8

Weighted inverted row 3x5-8 (false grip?)

I work a 10 hour manual labor day on the others days of the week (except Sunday, I do not like to train or work on Sundays for religious reasons). On my work days I am quite tired and do not think training would do me much good. However, I do stretch and do some light mobility on those days. Would it be a good idea to practice handstands and/or L-sit work everyday at a low volume? Thanks for the help, once again!